Getting annoyed with directional cabs

Billbill

Power User
Hi guys. Seeking some advise here. I'm running 2x212 orange cabs loaded with V30's and a matrix in stereo. Now, they sound great but I'm getting annoyed with the fact that they are probably thee most directional cabs I've ever had. It's night and day between on/off axis. I know this is nothing out of the ordinary and physics can be a real headache regardless of volume lol.
Is there a way to improve on this dilemma? I've had the Gemini FRFR 212 cab and it was the same way but maybe not quite as bad I guess. What should I do? What is the least directional cab you've played through?
 
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https://www.google.com/search?clien...-1j7......0....1..gws-wiz.......0.LUpyeSw7l6g
I think that the Mitchell doughnut only works with 1X 12 cabs though.

This is one of the biggest reasons why guys with Fractal gear, etc., go FRFR.
FRFR monitors have much better directivity specs than guitar cabinets.
The CLR has some ofr the best dispersion characteristics of any FRFR monitor.
That's why lots of guys use them with Fractal gear.
 
I think that the Mitchell doughnut only works with 1X 12 cabs though.
Why should it work only with 1x12s?
I have a couple mounted on my 2x12 and IMHO it works even better than on the 1x12 I had previously.
 
I use a 4x12 for the center of a w\d\w set up, and have had beam blockers on all 4 speakers in the 4x12 for 7 or 8 years now.....it seems to really help with the dispersion of the highs of the 4X12. Not as nice as my CLRs, but still an improvement.
 
Hi guys. Seeking some advise here. I'm running 2x212 orange cabs loaded with V30's and a matrix in stereo. Now, they sound great but I'm getting annoyed with the fact that they are probably thee most directional cabs I've ever had. It's night and day between on/off axis. I know this is nothing out of the ordinary and physics can be a real headache regardless of volume lol.
Is there a way to improve on this dilemma? I've had the Gemini FRFR 212 cab and it was the same way but maybe not quite as bad I guess. What should I do? What is the least directional cab you've played through?

The Doughnut or beem blockers will help for sure on the directivity! The other thing you can try if your not doing it already is setting your cab up Vertically an angled 212 would be the best. Reason for this is it puts the resulting comb filtering on a horizontal plane though I think it's pretty minimal.
 
The Doughnut or beem blockers will help for sure on the directivity! The other thing you can try if your not doing it already is setting your cab up Vertically an angled 212 would be the best. Reason for this is it puts the resulting comb filtering on a horizontal plane though I think it's pretty minimal.
Yeah I have my cabs about 10' apart and each one is angled up with a 4x4 block that I shove under the front edge of cab
 
Hi guys. Seeking some advise here. I'm running 2x212 orange cabs loaded with V30's and a matrix in stereo. Now, they sound great but I'm getting annoyed with the fact that they are probably thee most directional cabs I've ever had. It's night and day between on/off axis. I know this is nothing out of the ordinary and physics can be a real headache regardless of volume lol.
Is there a way to improve on this dilemma? I've had the Gemini FRFR 212 cab and it was the same way but maybe not quite as bad I guess. What should I do? What is the least directional cab you've played through?

I know where you come from and I found a solution for spiky and directional sound. It is called the „deeflexx“ deflection system for guitar and bass amps. It is a high tech piece of plastic, was develloped in Switzerland, costs around 250 Euros. The price is insane but this thing splits the beamy sound, improves your amp sound and lets you play with less volume on stage and still be heard by your band members. I tried it with my Redplate combo, bought it and spent in fact 250 Euros for a piece of plastic. This thing does stands up to its advertising. The maybe biggest musicshop in Europe sells it and you will find reviews on its website. I use the deeflexx also at home with an active cab right in front of me.
https://www.hoovi.at/deeflexx/

And no, I do not work for these guys and I‘m not related to them.
 
Why should it work only with 1x12s?
I have a couple mounted on my 2x12 and IMHO it works even better than on the 1x12 I had previously.

My (admittedly very limited) understanding of the theory behind this is that when you place the same speakers in a row, it will narrow the beam, which is the effect behind the whole line array thing. If you align them vertically, the whole assembly should have wide horizontal and narrow vertical dispersion. In line arrays this is beneficial because you don’t waste energy radiating the ceiling.

A single speaker acts more like a point source, and the beam should be uniform in all directions, with width depending on the speaker’s directivity (and possibly wave guides if you have those).
 
My (admittedly very limited) understanding of the theory behind this is that when you place the same speakers in a row, it will narrow the beam, which is the effect behind the whole line array thing. If you align them vertically, the whole assembly should have wide horizontal and narrow vertical dispersion. In line arrays this is beneficial because you don’t waste energy radiating the ceiling.

A single speaker acts more like a point source, and the beam should be uniform in all directions, with width depending on the speaker’s directivity (and possibly wave guides if you have those).
I know little too about this stuff but in my experience I clearly heard the difference after installing the donuts in my 2X12.

Anyway I believe that what you describe happens regardless of donuts.

One possible explanation, from what I understood from Jay Mitchell's article at least, is that his donuts don't really alter the dispersion pattern of the speakers but attenuate mid-high frequency only on-axis to make the on-axis frequency response similar to the off-axis response.

I would instead expect the issues you described to accentuate when using something like beamblockers which actually change the dispersion pattern by reflecting sound waves (and they create some phase issues too).
 
One possible explanation, from what I understood from Jay Mitchell's article at least, is that his donuts don't really alter the dispersion of the speakers but attenuate mid-high frequency only on-axis to make the on-axis frequency response similar to the off-axis response.

I must admit that I’ve never used any donuts on speakers, but as far as I understand this is indeed their purpose - make on-axis more like off-axis and to get rid of those harsh shrieking highs (or high mids, whatever).

Which seems to be the opposite of what OP wants.
 
Which seems to be the opposite of what OP wants.
That is relative, it really depends on how you're accustomed to hear your cabs (on or off axis) and it's pretty easy to compensate for the loss of high frequencies with an eq eventually.
In my case the EQ wasn't even necessary because they took off just the right amount of harshness and fizz.

What matters is to have the same response on axis and off axis.
 
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