Wish FREQOUT pedal

i'm not sure why this thread is still going. i've provided 2 methods to replicate this pedal using a couple of blocks and a modifier. i thought the ethos behind the axe was not to have everything handed to you on a plate, but to use the tools provided and your imagination to make whatever it is you're thinking of. adminM@ even did a really great tweak to the original design to change the frequency of the feedback note depending on the pitch played, which i thought was terrific.
I don't think this is the ethos of the Axe at all. It literally hands hundreds of amps and effects blocks to you on a plate.
I've followed your threads, and you are a brilliant, creative user of the Axe.
I am not.
IMO, it's legitimate to continue asking for a feature you desire without having to use a workaround solution, no matter the genius of the workaround.
 
so what you want is a block that you can add into a preset, select the pitch of the feedback and then attach it to a pedal so you can turn it on and off?

what do you think i just did to make that sound clip? yes, there are a couple of little tweaks but it's not rocket science and you'd want to tweak your "freqout block" anyway, so it's not like it's extra work.

here's the block. attach it to the input of the amp in parallel to the main line. voice 1 level needs to be attached to an expression pedal, or a control switch. i made mine a momentary control switch, but it's up to you. the shift parameter controls the frequency of the feedback. type the value in if you want to change it....don't adjust by turning the dial, because it won't rest on an integer value (even though it looks like it)
 

Attachments

  • Freqout Sim.blk
    784 bytes · Views: 46
  • layout.png
    layout.png
    31.8 KB · Views: 68
I'm guess I'm looking more for a "Real Feedback Simulator" not an emulation of the Freqout. I have a Freqout and was hoping it would "fill the gap" before someone came up with something great on the Axe-FX. Unfortunately, it's not that great.

The “one pitch” issue is what makes it and all the suggested solutions sound unconvincing to me. If I wanted to just fade in a +19 from the note I'm playing, I would. When you do the tricks everyone has posted so far, there is a big disconnect from your guitar's sound and the "feedback".

Real feedback “blooms” with your guitar's sound and I wish there were more effort to emulate that.

Try this for a (admittedly not great) example of what I'm talking about:
  • Filter block (parallel to main signal) - set to FB Comb Type
  • set Delay Time to 7.5 ms (or to taste)
  • Strike a power chord and let it ring out (i've found that an open d power chord in drop d works well for the example)
  • Slowly increase depth towards 100% (this gets REALLY loud so be careful)
  • The LFO could also be used to make it more interesting
My main problems with this method are that it can sound "artifact-y" and requires some external way to control the volume overload. The controls on the filter block are pretty limiting in terms of this as well. IDK what to add to make it better though.

Maybe someone can expound on that idea to improve and overcome the limitations?
 
I'm guess I'm looking more for a "Real Feedback Simulator" not an emulation of the Freqout. I have a Freqout and was hoping it would "fill the gap" before someone came up with something great on the Axe-FX. Unfortunately, it's not that great.

The “one pitch” issue is what makes it and all the suggested solutions sound unconvincing to me. If I wanted to just fade in a +19 from the note I'm playing, I would. When you do the tricks everyone has posted so far, there is a big disconnect from your guitar's sound and the "feedback".

Real feedback “blooms” with your guitar's sound and I wish there were more effort to emulate that.

Try this for a (admittedly not great) example of what I'm talking about:
  • Filter block (parallel to main signal) - set to FB Comb Type
  • set Delay Time to 7.5 ms (or to taste)
  • Strike a power chord and let it ring out (i've found that an open d power chord in drop d works well for the example)
  • Slowly increase depth towards 100% (this gets REALLY loud so be careful)
  • The LFO could also be used to make it more interesting
My main problems with this method are that it can sound "artifact-y" and requires some external way to control the volume overload. The controls on the filter block are pretty limiting in terms of this as well. IDK what to add to make it better though.

Maybe someone can expound on that idea to improve and overcome the limitations?
You can use the Send / Return blocks to make a real feedback loop... But be forewarned that this is really difficult to control and can easily result in you needing to change your undies... ;)
 
so what you want is a block that you can add into a preset, select the pitch of the feedback and then attach it to a pedal so you can turn it on and off?
That’s definitely not what I want, and not how the pedal behaves. I’m not quite sure why there seems to be defensiveness around this topic, though.
 
hmmm. This thread seems to have derailed in a few ways. I'll try to bring it back on point by including details on the specific Freqout functionality from the manual:

The Harmonic Feedback Types:
The first five Harmonic Feedback types let you get feedback at a predictable, repeatable frequency. Feedback is selectable at a sub-octave, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 5th harmonic, where harmonic is defined as a multiple of your note¹s frequency. For example, the 5th harmonic is 5x your note¹s frequency (which is actually 2 octaves above a major third interval of the original note).

The Natural Feedback Types:
The two Natural Feedback types (NAT LOW and NAT HI) act more like natural feedback does. Using these feedback types, you might get different feedback every time you play the same note.
Here are some tips to steer the feedback to what you want when using the Natural Feedback types:
• Getting Lower-Frequency Feedback - Try playing more softly, rolling off your tone, and using the neck pickup.
• Getting Higher-Frequency Feedback - Try picking your notes harder, opening up the tone control, and using the bridge pickup.
• Getting Transitioning Feedback - In general, high-frequency feedback is more likely to transition to lower frequencies as the note decays.

Follow the instructions above for getting higher-frequency feedback to get more feedback transitions.

NAT LOW vs. NAT HI:
Both feedback types have similar behaviors, but NAT LOW restricts the feedback frequencies to a lower range and doesn¹t allow feedback at the 5th harmonic or higher. This restriction ensures that you don¹t get feedback that sounds “major” on minor chords. NAT HI lets the feedback get a little higher-pitched, and thus slightly increases the odds of the feedback transitioning mid-note.


I think that Simeon's Synth version is pretty darn close to the Harmonic types described above. Personally, I only use the Natural feedback types described above. It seems like the right combo of Synth block + Pitch block combined with some approach to simulate randomness should be able to nail it, but I haven't cracked the code yet.

Overall, I think I'll probably stick to my Freqout because Synth+Pitch blocks add up to a lot of CPU and I am constantly struggling with staying below 80% on my presets.

I'll also take this space to give props to Simeon, who is a huge asset to the community :)
 
Overall, I think I'll probably stick to my Freqout because Synth+Pitch blocks add up to a lot of CPU and I am constantly struggling with staying below 80% on my presets.
Same here - though some of the implementations here seem equal or better, there's a convenience factor with the pedal, + not something I care enough about to spend system resources on - the the Freqout, and Mimic stay as outboard items for me.
 
I think that Simeon's Synth version is pretty darn close to the Harmonic types described above. Personally, I only use the Natural feedback types described above. It seems like the right combo of Synth block + Pitch block combined with some approach to simulate randomness should be able to nail it, but I haven't cracked the code yet.
don't think you need synth and pitch. you'd need to attach a random lfo to the shift parameter in the synth block and have the lfo quantised to the right number of steps to only select the useful harmonics. if you didn't want the harmonic to change while you were holding a note, you could attach envelope to lfo "run" so it only runs when you're not playing anything and settles on a random pitch when you do. might be a bit fiddly to set up, but you only have to do it once. feedback is a very complex mechanical phenomenon and trying to reproduce it digitally is a fool's errand if you ask me. nothing beats the real real thing for visceral fun, so turn up loud, or fit a sustainiac, or make do with the freqout or a synth block.
 
@simeon's block is a nice single-block solution IMO and definitely usable in a live scenario to give a feedback flavor. I don't really find the Freqout to be more "natural", but maybe a little different. If you need to save some CPU cycles and can add a pedal to your setup, go with the Freqout. I doubt it's worth the effort and CPU to search for something more realistic. If you need more realistic feedback, you're probably best served making some real acoustic feedback.
 
+1 for this for sure! Perhaps it would get implemented into the pitch block some how? I think ideally, if feasible, making it it’s on block though as to not lose a pitch block (in the FM9). This would be a great tool to have to assign to a CS that you could hold down at will to generate feedback. It would be great to have the same kind of settings as the Freqout.
 
OK, I just tried this preset, and it doesn't do anything usable for me even after mapping the Pitch block mix control to my pedal. I know the Freqout isn't perfect, but it's considerably better than this. My wish remains.
So I'm now interested in checking out the ideas from this thread regarding both @simeon and @Moke. I've just tweaked up the preset @greiswig mentioned above and found that dialing the high cut on the pitch block all the way down to 2K really warmed it up. I also dimed the level on the compressor as I found that made it sound more natural. For my purposes, that's probably gonna work just fine. I have a FreqOut, and feel like this is just as good. For me, it certainly beats adding the pedal, as that's why I bought the Axe3...so I wouldn't need anything else.

Oh, and I have a momentary switch instead of a pedal, so I used damping to ease the effect in.
 
the method i outlined above actually doesn't sound at all synthy. worth a go!
Yep. I tried it today and it works well. The problem I'm having is the length of sustain. Using either the pitch or synth block I can get a good "feedback" tone, but you have to know when to move on, because they both do weird things once the decay reaches a point (just like the FreqOut). The synth sustains a little longer, fwiw. Just for sh@ts and giggles, I also tried them in parallel and it sounds cool as a FreqOut, but then if you noodle around, it's a nice Octavia sound that works everywhere on the neck...
 
i definitely prefer running the synth into the front of the amp. it's the mix of the original plus the pitch shifted tone as you transition from one to the other and the effect that has on the amp that makes it sound authentic to my ears
 
I had the Freqout but I sold it to minimize the rig. I have not been able to simulate it with the Axe-FX. It would be nice to have it
 
I just tried the Helix’s new “Feedback” effect, and it’s really awesome! Lots of parameters to adjust, and it’s done really well and pretty realistic for low volume playing.

Hopefully fractal will come out with something similar in the future!
Interesting - Id love a Freqout effect in the AxeFX - will check out youtube for an overview of line 6s effort.
 
FWIW this pitch block works pretty well for me...I just modify the mix like this...all pretty simple.1701291897888.png
 

Attachments

  • ch A feedback sim_20231129_155522.blk
    1.4 KB · Views: 2
Back
Top Bottom