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Free IRs: Pacific Woodworks 1x12 cab

Kyo Gt

Member
(Added on 15th Sep.) The IRs are available on post #13.

I had a luck of coming by a Pacific Woodworks 1x12 cab loaded with a EVM12L. I've been searching for the IRs of this but couldn't find one, so I decided to shoot IRs by myself. I guess it'll help other Axe owners pursuing 90's LA tone, so I'd be happy to share the IRs here.
Can you share it if you have recommendations on microphone placement? I'm not sure about the yummy positions I've never had an experience with this cab and I cannot find a good picture of the cab mic'ed up either.
At the moment I plan to shoot IRs on the positions indicated by the red dots on the picture, on-axis. And maybe I'll capture some IRs from room mics, too.

(Revised on 11th Sep.)
FYI, on the shooting session, I will use the following microphones:
  • For close mics, Neumann TLM103 and either Shure SM57 or Beta57A Shure SM57, Beta57A, and AKG C414XLS
  • For room mics, either Audio Technica AT4040 or RODE NT-2A AKG C414XLS and Sony C-100
I'll use Midas XL48 for microphone preamp and RME Fireface UFX.
PW EVM12L Mic Position rev.png
 
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Dave Merrill

Power User
Paging @York Audio :)

With (a lot of) luck, he's right down the street from you and he can actually do his thing with it. (Like he has nothing else planned...) Absent that, maybe he has suggestions.

Note that this is me spitballing, not to be even slightly construed as any kind of commitment from Justin, or even interest.
 
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York Audio

Power User
Vendor
I had a luck of coming by a Pacific Woodworks 1x12 cab loaded with a EVM12L. I've been searching for the IRs of this but couldn't find one, so I decided to shoot IRs by myself. I guess it'll help other Axe owners pursuing 90's LA tone, so I'd be happy to share the IRs here.
Can you share it if you have recommendations on microphone placement? I'm not sure about the yummy positions I've never had an experience with this cab and I cannot find a good picture of the cab mic'ed up either.
At the moment I plan to shoot IRs on the positions indicated by the red dots on the picture, on-axis. And maybe I'll capture some IRs from room mics, too.

FYI, on the shooting session, I will use the following microphones:
  • For close mics, Neumann TLM103 and either Shure SM57 or Beta57A
  • For room mics, either Audio Technica AT4040 or RODE NT-2A
I'll use Midas XL48 for microphone preamp and RME Fireface UFX.

View attachment 72287
I would shoot the 57, Beta 57, and TLM103 if I were you. EV-12Ls CAN be fairly dark speakers, so I think those mics would work great on that cab. You’re only limited by the time you want to put into capturing, so don’t be afraid to shoot a ton of IRs if you really want to dial in this cab and find the sweet spots.

So much of making IRs is trial and error, but your ears will tell you when something is great. Unfortunately, I have to keep my method and approach secret for obvious reasons (it’s taken YEARS to refine... and still refining), but if I were to give you a beginner’s roadmap to get you started, I’d say shoot the 57 in positions 2, 3, 4, and 5 in a horizontal line to the left and right of the dust cap. If you wanna go a little deeper, try those same positions going vertically up and down from the center of the dust cap. Listen to those before shooting other mics so you have an idea of what the cab sounds like and if you prefer the brighter or darker positions along with your favorite spot on the speaker. You won’t like all of the captures, but you’ll get an idea of which part of the speaker sounds best to you.

Then try the Beta 57 in the positions you liked. It has a boosted top end, so keep that in mind knowing that it’ll give you a little more edge compared to the standard 57. I don’t typically like that mic on guitar cabs (great on snare drums though), but the added brightness may work well with this cab.

The TLM103 is pretty full range, so if you want to avoid a super crispy top end, maybe try it in positions 4, 5, and 6 on both sides of the dust cap as well as 8 and 9 if you feel like gently blending in some low end warmth.

I’d also use the TLM103 for your room captures. The 4040 can be pretty raspy on the top end and take away from the “room” sound. I like my room mics on the warmer side, but that’s just personal preference.

So shoot those and listen to the results and see how you feel. You can always go back and shoot more. I’m currently shooting round two of a cab right now because I felt like round one wasn’t quite where I wanted it, so be encouraged that guys who do this literally every day sometimes have to go back and try new things. Having said that, it’s important to enjoy what you’ve created and try not to get too obsessed with the minutia that most people will never notice.

Sorry for the novel, now have fun and shoot some IRs!
 

Kyo Gt

Member
I would shoot the 57, Beta 57, and TLM103 if I were you. EV-12Ls CAN be fairly dark speakers, so I think those mics would work great on that cab. You’re only limited by the time you want to put into capturing, so don’t be afraid to shoot a ton of IRs if you really want to dial in this cab and find the sweet spots.

So much of making IRs is trial and error, but your ears will tell you when something is great. Unfortunately, I have to keep my method and approach secret for obvious reasons (it’s taken YEARS to refine... and still refining), but if I were to give you a beginner’s roadmap to get you started, I’d say shoot the 57 in positions 2, 3, 4, and 5 in a horizontal line to the left and right of the dust cap. If you wanna go a little deeper, try those same positions going vertically up and down from the center of the dust cap. Listen to those before shooting other mics so you have an idea of what the cab sounds like and if you prefer the brighter or darker positions along with your favorite spot on the speaker. You won’t like all of the captures, but you’ll get an idea of which part of the speaker sounds best to you.

Then try the Beta 57 in the positions you liked. It has a boosted top end, so keep that in mind knowing that it’ll give you a little more edge compared to the standard 57. I don’t typically like that mic on guitar cabs (great on snare drums though), but the added brightness may work well with this cab.

The TLM103 is pretty full range, so if you want to avoid a super crispy top end, maybe try it in positions 4, 5, and 6 on both sides of the dust cap as well as 8 and 9 if you feel like gently blending in some low end warmth.

I’d also use the TLM103 for your room captures. The 4040 can be pretty raspy on the top end and take away from the “room” sound. I like my room mics on the warmer side, but that’s just personal preference.

So shoot those and listen to the results and see how you feel. You can always go back and shoot more. I’m currently shooting round two of a cab right now because I felt like round one wasn’t quite where I wanted it, so be encouraged that guys who do this literally every day sometimes have to go back and try new things. Having said that, it’s important to enjoy what you’ve created and try not to get too obsessed with the minutia that most people will never notice.

Sorry for the novel, now have fun and shoot some IRs!
@York Audio, thank you very much for all your advice!
It's good to know your recommended positions before hand, then I'll focus on 2-6 positions on horizontal/vertical line for close speaker mics. And I'm glad to hear TLM103 is better than 4040 for room mics as I can reduce a mic to rent from the recording studio!:laughing: I heard that Neumann mics were not suitable for capturing room ambiance, but looks like it was just my biased thinking.

Your thoughts on Beta 57 was a surprise. It's generally the updated version of the classic 57 so I've thought it always sounds better than 57.
Now I'm torn apart between Beta 57 and Sennheiser MD421 MKII - Do you think it's worth it to rent a MD421 instead, when I'm micing with classic 57 and TLM103?
 

York Audio

Power User
Vendor
@York Audio, thank you very much for all your advice!
It's good to know your recommended positions before hand, then I'll focus on 2-6 positions on horizontal/vertical line for close speaker mics. And I'm glad to hear TLM103 is better than 4040 for room mics as I can reduce a mic to rent from the recording studio!:laughing: I heard that Neumann mics were not suitable for capturing room ambiance, but looks like it was just my biased thinking.

Your thoughts on Beta 57 was a surprise. It's generally the updated version of the classic 57 so I've thought it always sounds better than 57.
Now I'm torn apart between Beta 57 and Sennheiser MD421 MKII - Do you think it's worth it to rent a MD421 instead, when I'm micing with classic 57 and TLM103?
Ya know, I gotta admit when I'm wrong. I just looked up the frequency response of the Beta 57 and my description was inaccurate. The upper mids and top end is very different from the 57 and it might actually sound a little darker on your cab. I just remembered a session I did years ago with my old Dual Rec and Mesa 2x12. I always recorded it with a 57 and it sounded great, but this time the producer put a Beta 57 on it and it just sounded a little harsher than it normally did. We put a normal 57 on it and all was right in the world again. He may have had a bad Beta 57, or that mic just didn't like my amp (not all mics like all cabs), but I walked away thinking the Beta 57 was a lot brighter than a normal 57. I might need to pick up one of those and try it out on some cabs. I'd be curious to hear what you think of it vs the 57.

As far as room mics go, you can always try the TLM103, 4040, and NT-2A in the same spot and see which one you like the best and go from there. I use a U47 for my room mic and it's absolutely glorious. I have a TLM49 which is probably closer to your TLM103 and it's a great sounding mic. Mic position and the room itself are everything when it comes to ambient captures, so you'll want to experiment a bit if room mics are important to you. I don't think you need to rent a 421 at this point. Right now it's all about having fun and creating some files of a cab you're already familiar with. If YOU don't normally use a 421 when you mic a cab, I wouldn't mess with the headache that comes with learning the sonic signature of a new mic.
 

favance

Power User
I, for one, would love to see @York Audio do his treatment and release an EVM12L Cab IR like this! I had a 2x12 Fender Cab back in the 70's loaded w/EVM12Ls and would love to see something like this released!
 

Joe Bfstplk

Fractal Fanatic
I had a luck of coming by a Pacific Woodworks 1x12 cab loaded with a EVM12L. I've been searching for the IRs of this but couldn't find one, so I decided to shoot IRs by myself. I guess it'll help other Axe owners pursuing 90's LA tone, so I'd be happy to share the IRs here.
Can you share it if you have recommendations on microphone placement? I'm not sure about the yummy positions I've never had an experience with this cab and I cannot find a good picture of the cab mic'ed up either.
At the moment I plan to shoot IRs on the positions indicated by the red dots on the picture, on-axis. And maybe I'll capture some IRs from room mics, too.

FYI, on the shooting session, I will use the following microphones:
  • For close mics, Neumann TLM103 and either Shure SM57 or Beta57A
  • For room mics, either Audio Technica AT4040 or RODE NT-2A
I'll use Midas XL48 for microphone preamp and RME Fireface UFX.

View attachment 72287
Positions 1 - 7 with each close mic, plus a room mic shot or two with each room mic ought to cover the options....
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Ya know, I gotta admit when I'm wrong. I just looked up the frequency response of the Beta 57 and my description was inaccurate. The upper mids and top end is very different from the 57 and it might actually sound a little darker on your cab. I just remembered a session I did years ago with my old Dual Rec and Mesa 2x12. I always recorded it with a 57 and it sounded great, but this time the producer put a Beta 57 on it and it just sounded a little harsher than it normally did. We put a normal 57 on it and all was right in the world again. He may have had a bad Beta 57, or that mic just didn't like my amp (not all mics like all cabs), but I walked away thinking the Beta 57 was a lot brighter than a normal 57. I might need to pick up one of those and try it out on some cabs. I'd be curious to hear what you think of it vs the 57.

As far as room mics go, you can always try the TLM103, 4040, and NT-2A in the same spot and see which one you like the best and go from there. I use a U47 for my room mic and it's absolutely glorious. I have a TLM49 which is probably closer to your TLM103 and it's a great sounding mic. Mic position and the room itself are everything when it comes to ambient captures, so you'll want to experiment a bit if room mics are important to you. I don't think you need to rent a 421 at this point. Right now it's all about having fun and creating some files of a cab you're already familiar with. If YOU don't normally use a 421 when you mic a cab, I wouldn't mess with the headache that comes with learning the sonic signature of a new mic.
Again, thank you @York Audio for your opinions. I guess I should focus on TLM103, SM57, and Beta 57A this time and do the trial&errors as much as possible. If the time allows during my session, I'll also rent some more mics to try out.
 

Joe Bfstplk

Fractal Fanatic
Again, thank you @York Audio for your opinions. I guess I should focus on TLM103, SM57, and Beta 57A this time and do the trial&errors as much as possible. If the time allows during my session, I'll also rent some more mics to try out.
Try to find a ribbon. 121, 160, or a Cascade FatHed.

I bought a FatHed and it really does nice things for filling in the lows when mixed with a 57.....
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Try to find a ribbon. 121, 160, or a Cascade FatHed.

I bought a FatHed and it really does nice things for filling in the lows when mixed with a 57.....
Thanks. Unfortunately, The studio I'll be at when shooting does not have any ribbon mics and neither do I...
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Now it's the weekend, and I just booked the recording studio for tomorrow midnight.
After advice from @York Audio, I've changed the plans on mic placement. As the studio said TLM103 was broken at the moment, I decided to use AKG C414XLS instead. Hopefully I will share the resulting IRs here on Sunday.
 

aziz

Power User
You can shoot 100 ir's with fraction of an inch and they all will be different, so just do 1000 tries and hunt for the best. The current 421 is screechy and bright, rather have a 57. Old 421 is nice.
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Thank you everyone for the advice here, and attached are the captured IRs. Attached in the zip are the wav version of IRs for ease of mixing work.

Unfortunately, I literally blew it this time. At the earlier stage of the session the cab suddenly stopped speaking. I swapped the power amp only to find out the speaker was blown up.
I seem to have done a wrong calculation on power rating - I used a power amp with the output of 300w at 4ohm so I thought it was OK to full-drive the amp connected to 8ohm speaker, but I guess due to the test tone always on -0dBFS the speaker might have exceeded its limit.
Apologies not just for only 8 IRs I could capture today but also for blowing up this masterpiece. I'm really really disappointed, I guess I'll replace with a new EVM12L and do this session again.

That said, I hope you enjoy my IRs from the "death cry" of the speaker. After I get some sleep I'll try them out and hopefully let you know the recommended one to start with.

(Mic positions for IRs captured today)
PW EVM12L Mic Position result.png
 

Attachments

notalemming

Fractal Fanatic
Was it a solid state amp? Was it bridged? I would think that speaker should be able to handle the wattage but if the power amp was clipping hard, that's like sending razor wire through the speaker & that might have been the cause. Never fun to fry a speaker no matter what the reason.
 

Dave Merrill

Power User
Far as I know, the only good thing higher volume does is bring the signal up over the noise floor in the room. Once you've achieved that, you're only stressing things needlessly. It's not like you need to drive it hard with the test tone so the captures sound good.
 

Joe Bfstplk

Fractal Fanatic
Far as I know, the only good thing higher volume does is bring the signal up over the noise floor in the room. Once you've achieved that, you're only stressing things needlessly. It's not like you need to drive it hard with the test tone so the captures sound good.
5-10 watts is quite sufficient for a close mic'ed speaker. I use an old '70s solid state SAE 50WPC hi-fi amp to capture speaker impulses. It has LEDs on the front indicating output power level and I shoot for around 5W or so....
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Thanks for the advice, everyone.
Yes, I used a solid-state power amp, as Cliff advised somewhere. I have thought"the louder, the better", as I once had an experience shooting IRs with different volume and it sounded to me that the ones from the loudest test tone was the most articulate and cut through in a mix.
Listening to the test tone again, EVM12L sounded like it was overloaded at the beginning of the tone sweep. I guess I need to be safer and to lower the volume knob anyway.

As the cone was not damaged, I'll ask EV if a replacement voice coil is available from them first. As soon as the recovery, I'll take my Pacific cab again to do the shooting session again.

FYI, I hope you check out my thread https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/free-irs-hughes-kettner-cc412-a30.165444 as well.
This is an "by-product" of this thread - I had 4 hours remained when I blew my cab, so I pivot to a Hughes&Kettner cab lying around in the studio. It's another cab whose IRs are difficult to find, so I shot by myself. The resulting IRs can be downloaded freely.
 

Kyo Gt

Member
Just changed the thread title and added words on #1, so that others can know from the title IRs are available in this thread.

@York Audio
Again, thanks for all the info. Regarding the comparison between SM57 and Beta57A, I guess I prefer SM57 for this after auditioning the resulting IRs. IRs from Beta57A sounds "mild" and not bad when listening to the guitar track alone, but in a mix it sounds not very articulate and seems like drawn in the mix. Perhaps I've done something wrong with Beta57A, but I've got the same impression when auditioning Hughes&Kettner cab above.
 
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