FM3 Firmware Version 3.02

Griff_NZ said:
How would you describe the difference over Ares? More attack/presence?.. or is it more a feel thing?
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When comparing fm3 to my amps (and a JCM) I felt as if there was a muddiness to the fractal sound along the spectrum. There was a "ts-style" distinctness to the chugs that I had to fight to get right on the FM3. It wasn't a massive difference by some measures, but real to me as a player.

Chungus on axe fx 3 didn't have that issue. The feel was considerably closer to the real JCM, and I think it also sounded closer, even though I didn't record A-B tests. On Ares FM3, my muted string attack was more undefined and didn't have the same "kick". I felt like Chungus was more dynamic to my picking.

And the kick from the real jcm was back. I had the amp right there also with fm3 and axe fx 3, all going through the same IR in my daw (suhr load box for amp).

I have to use Chungus more to know more, but these were my initial impressions.
 
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Griff_NZ said:
How would you describe the difference over Ares? More attack/presence?.. or is it more a feel thing?
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I spent several hours a day over the last week playing with my AF3 with Cygnus, plus several hours a day or two ago on my FM3 with Ares 3.02 on the same presets.

Cygnus is more alive, organic, real, open, pick an adjective to describe something sounding much more like a real amp. Ares is good... for a modeler, but Cygnus is good for a real amp though it's modeling them.

Cygnus amps might not exactly match someone's specific amp, because every amp is different due to manufacturing and component tolerances, but the amps sound and feel real to me. I've had real blackface Deluxe and Vibrolux and Tweed Bassman amps, and those all sound convincingly real in the models. I've played and played on stage with Twins and the models sound and feel right. The Mesa combo models sound like my old IIb and my Lonestar Special. And, in those cases, Ares was recognizable as the amp but didn't nail it, but Cygnus could easily be the amp within the manufactorer's specs.

I'm not one who MUST have the exact sound from a song on an album, I want the feel and to be in the ballpark, and to not feel like I have to fight the modeler to get the sound. I'm to the point where I know the AF3 with Cygnus is going to deliver exactly what I want and I can relax and just have fun and let the guitar and amp talk. I can relax and enjoy it because it's that good.

It's attack, presence, openness, feel, responsiveness. It's less modeler and more real-deal.

That's my $0.02.
 
bcp said:
I ran across this video recently- thought they took an interesting approach and did a nice job of describing it.

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While it's nice they did the video, it's not a good comparison; The Cygnus demos are not what that firmware beta sounds like. They got something wrong because it sounds like it's out of phase. Cygnus on my AF3 sounds like it's alive and not diffused and unfocused.

Their attempts to describe it used "3D" and that is too nebulous and with the weird out of phase sound, tends to confuse people.

It'd recommend Leon Todd's videos where he's demoing it as he avoids the weirdness in the audio.
 
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Greg Ferguson said:
I spent several hours a day over the last week playing with my AF3 with Cygnus, plus several hours a day or two ago on my FM3 with Ares 3.02 on the same presets.

Cygnus is more alive, organic, real, open, pick an adjective to describe something sounding much more like a real amp. Ares is good... for a modeler, but Cygnus is good for a real amp though it's modeling them.

Cygnus amps might not exactly match someone's specific amp, because every amp is different due to manufacturing and component tolerances, but the amps sound and feel real to me. I've had real blackface Deluxe and Vibrolux and Tweed Bassman amps, and those all sound convincingly real in the models. I've played and played on stage with Twins and the models sound and feel right. The Mesa combo models sound like my old IIb and my Lonestar Special. And, in those cases, Ares was recognizable as the amp but didn't nail it, but Cygnus could easily be the amp within the manufactorer's specs.

I'm not one who MUST have the exact sound from a song on an album, I want the feel and to be in the ballpark, and to not feel like I have to fight the modeler to get the sound. I'm to the point where I know the AF3 with Cygnus is going to deliver exactly what I want and I can relax and just have fun and let the guitar and amp talk. I can relax and enjoy it because it's that good.

It's attack, presence, openness, feel, responsiveness. It's less modeler and more real-deal.

That's my $0.02.
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Thanks Greg, appreciate that man. All I can do is wait but I know it'll be worth it. I play through a power station and cab with my FM3 and it sounds ridiculously good if I'm honest.. hard to imagine it being even betterer!
 
The AF3 will always sound better compared to the FM3, even when Cygnus is ported to the FM3. More processing power plus extra features... it’s a no brainer.
 
boz52 said:
The AF3 will always sound better compared to the FM3, even when Cygnus is ported to the FM3. More processing power plus extra features... it’s a no brainer.
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Ultra res is (also) coming to fm3, as well as at least some version of axe fx 3 drives.

Besides, a least the amp sims don't seem to be downgraded in some way to save processing power.

For my kind of signal chains (rather simple) and IRs I'm not noticing much of a difference between latest axe fx 3 ares vs fm3, if any.
 
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CPU usage is not the same on 3.02 firmware as previously.

Many of my presets that weren’t neat to peak in red are now in red... I have to change some presets...

Hvce you noticed that behaviour ?
 
Dimi84 said:
Ultra res is (also) coming to fm3, as well as at least some version of axe fx 3 drives.
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I might have missed it but I don't think that's been confirmed.
Dimi84 said:
Besides, a least the amp sims don't seem to be downgraded in some way to save processing power.
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There has been discussion on this since before the FM3 was even released. There were some things that didn't get carried over. I don't know if that has changed...
 
unix-guy said:
I might have missed it but I don't think that's been confirmed.

There has been discussion on this since before the FM3 was even released. There were some things that didn't get carried over. I don't know if that has changed...
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Both were confirmed. There's another thread on here about the drives; and ultra res was also mentioned by fractal on that thread. Not sure what form the drives will take though -- if this is about some economy mode, what exactly, ect.

In so far as processing power and amp sims being downgraded, I think a couple of controls didn't make it through? I don't remember. I guess that can count as a downgrade itself, so I'd be wrong. I had in mind more so the quality of what's there, for some reason.

But to be more accurate, for the controls that exist -- or the ones I use, to be even ore accurate! -- it was difficult to tell fm3 apart from axe fx 3 when both were on similar Amp sim firmware and the same settings were used. The latest firmwares on fm3 and axe fx 3 respectively have often had differences for amp modelling, enough to causes discrepancies in some people's tests imo.

I expect similar performance from cygnus as what i saw when testing amp sims in firmware of fm3 that matched axe fx 3, with the exception of whatever (if any) controls aren't there. Predominantly at least, which is pretty great for me.

Unless of course axe fx 3 happens to use a more developed version of cygnus, at some point, and fm3 hasn't gotten there, using earlier firmware with different amp modelling.
 
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boz52 said:
The AF3 will always sound better compared to the FM3, even when Cygnus is ported to the FM3. More processing power plus extra features... it’s a no brainer.
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I disagree. If a preset will run on the FM3, then running it on the AF3 will sound the same. I've directly compared my two units on the same presets and could hear no difference.

Fractal was careful to make sure that the presets sound the same if they'll run on the FM3.

It's easy to turn up all the settings to the top quality on the AF3 and create a preset that won't run at all on the FM3 but when it fits it sounds good.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
I disagree. If a preset will run on the FM3, then running it on the AF3 will sound the same. I've directly compared my two units on the same presets and could hear no difference.

Fractal was careful to make sure that the presets sound the same if they'll run on the FM3.

It's easy to turn up all the settings to the top quality on the AF3 and create a preset that won't run at all on the FM3 but when it fits it sounds good.
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Unless you're running identical firmware and modeling I don't think that can really be true. Even doing that on different firmwares on the Axe Fx III won't sound the same ;)
 
unix-guy said:
Unless you're running identical firmware and modeling I don't think that can really be true. Even doing that on different firmwares on the Axe Fx III won't sound the same ;)
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Prior to Cygnus I could run identical presets created on either the AF3 or the FM3 and couldn't tell a difference in the sound. Since Cygnus, because it's beta firmware, the FM3 can't read the presets from the AF3, so until they reach parity on the firmware I push to the FM3, and since it's still on Ares, there are significant differences in the sound. Once we get Cygnus on the FM3 they should sound the same again.

Fractal reduced the capability as far as being able to have duplicates of amp and cab blocks, etc., but the sound quality within those limitations is equal. They're aware the FM3 has less horsepower so it can't run as many blocks or all the blocks at the highest CPU demands, but if the FM3 says it can run the preset it'll sound the same. They admit up front that it doesn't have the same capability but they never said, nor can I hear, a reduction in quality.

Of course different firmware will sound different, and the older firmware won't sound as good. Increased efficiency, and better algorithms are aimed at improving the sound. That's why Fractal updated the firmware, to hand us better modeling.
 
Douglas Costa said:
Today is friday, but I think it's not THE FRIDAY.

There's a lot of development on FM3 side, it may take a while.
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Seems so.

Considering they're baking axe fx 3 drives, ultra res capability and cygnus.. may take a while, so we see these implemented sporadically. Perhaps.

Or a monster beta update drops with drives, ultra res and cygnus and soon-coming, ultra, Finnish lockdown becomes more tolerable.
 
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