FM3 Audio Out of Sync in DAW

orion32773

orion32773

Experienced
I was working on a video idea this morning and wanted to use the FM3 as my audio interface. All is fine with setting it up. My normal configuration is a separate interface tied to the axe fx 3 (Aggregate interface on the mac) but the clock source (which I am wondering may be the issue) is set to the 3rd party interface (An X32 mixer in this case).

In every DAW (Pro Tools, Logic, Garageband, etc) and on 3 different Macs, when i use the FM3 (or even the Axe Fx 3 to a degree) as the only interface, my audio is out of sync AFTER it is recorded by a few samples. I have exhausted all my troubleshooting knowledge on this one.

I decided it was best to turn to someone smarter than me who might have more experience using the FM3 or the Axe Fx as the only interface. WHILE recording everything is fine so I am not talking about latency. It's once the track is recorded and played back. The click track and audio are off...not much but enough to feel it's dragging. Only thing I can think of is that it has something to do with the clock sync in the FM3. It's set to default since it's the only device being used as the interface.

I've been trying to find a setting in the unit that would catch my attention that I could test/change. From reading the manual I do know that the FM3 only receives and cannot transmit midi beat clock....and I don't even know if this is even the issue. I am guessing at this point.
 
Ok, so this thread might be confusing and so people don't feel they can chime in:

Can someone who owns an FM3 please help me test and grab your DAW of choice, use the FM3 as the only interface, add a click track, record a simple riff, and then play back the track (keep click track running) and let me know if the audio track is dragging behind the click?

I have an HX Stomp for testing and have zero issues with sync/lag but I really want to use this FM3 as an interface. This is not a delay compensation problem (which most DAWs have a setting for). This seems to be a clock issue, maybe. I have a ticket open with Fractal and I'd like to give them an update if others have the same issue as well. I would rather not send the unit back for repair when it isn't a hardware problem.
 
I think this is an issue in general. There are other threads on the forum that discus how to configure the DAW to compensate for the latency. I had to do the same on my Axe-Fx III and once configured in the DAW, it resolved the issue.
 
Ok, well as long as it isnt delay compensation. Logic has where you can set it but even then it's still off a little. Pro tools only has a global setting that's either on or off....if there's something else then I have not idea. I must not be searching the right area in the forum. I will look harder
 
You may need to use the Fractal Device as your clock source when recording (don't have an FM3, so just guessing).
I've only ever had sample alignment issues crop up when working with SMPTE locked video: the samples want to align to a frame rate. There might be a lock to SMPTE function on in the DAW that's moving the recorded audio to the nearest frame based on the SMPTE clock.
 
So when looking in audio midi setting on the Mac it says clock source (default). I thought of this as well and I was assuming that default meant itself since I can’t change it. I normally use my axe Fx 3 with my behringer x32 as an aggregate device and the x32 is the clock source. As far as the SMPTE I would have to browse through pro tools to see about that. I’ve heard mention of the USB buffer size adjustment but it’s on the axe Fx 3 but that setting isn’t available on the FM3 (yet???).
 
I used to have this problem with my AxeFX II and my old laptop with Pro Tools. IIRC, I fixed it by adjusting the buffer and streaming settings in the Fractal config app in Windows. It was a bit of trial and error until I found a setting that fixed the offset audio problem. I haven't had that issue for a couple of years, thankfully.
 
I’ll have to like around on the Mac and see if I can see those settings. Fractal config app? You mean axe edit or something else?
 
Chad Beattie said:
Not sure if it's related at all, but here is the thread I was talking about:

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/logic-pro-recording-delay-setting.157412/
Click to expand...
Yes matt suggested this in the support ticket but it "kind of" helps but its still a little off, but maybe I need to do what the second pos suggested. ProTools unfortunately only has a check for turning delay compensation on or off. I did stumble on a promising thread that mentioned adjust the USB Buffer setting in the i/o menu (Setup) but this setting was only on the Axe 3. It's missing on the FM3. I am guessing they could choose to add it in a firmware update but not sure if they will. I have been trying to find people to test this and chime in, so we can at least see if all units experience the same thing. Frustrating thing is my little HX stomp is dead on, but I don't want to use the HX lol. I want my FM3! haha
 
So, at the moment I have Logic figured out and can adjust the recording delay (my old iMac needs -2400 sample offset). I recorded a track then measured how far off it was (40-50ms) and then converted MS to samples based off the project sample rate of 48kHz. Now if I could only set a recording delay in Pro Tools. I am curious if this buffer setting in the i/o menu would help (if it was enabled at some point)
 
orion32773 said:
So, at the moment I have Logic figured out and can adjust the recording delay (my old iMac needs -2400 sample offset). I recorded a track then measured how far off it was (40-50ms) and then converted MS to samples based off the project sample rate of 48kHz. Now if I could only set a recording delay in Pro Tools. I am curious if this buffer setting in the i/o menu would help (if it was enabled at some point)
Click to expand...

This is what I had to do in Reaper for the Axe-Fx III. I can test with the FM3 but assume I will have to do the same thing. Doesn't Pro Tools have automatic delay comp or something similar?

With the Axe-Fx III, I believe I still had the issue at the lowest buffer settings. The only difference was the amount of compensation that was needed. Somewhere on the forum their is a thread that talks about the buffer size in relation to the offset etc... After reading that thread, I came to the conclusion that this was a common adjustment that needed to be made. But honestly I don't remember having to do it when I was using my 003. It may have been taking care of the issue in the background and I just didn't realize it.
 
Thanks for posting this thread.
I’ve lived the last 8 years of my life on a click track locked onto a grid.
I’ve just begun recording using PTs. I have been struggling with this issue and thought I was loosing it. It seems to be more noticeable on the FM3. I don’t recall this being noticeable on the Axe III.
 
I had this issue as well. I ended up running the FM3 Output 1 into a cheap USB interface and no longer had any latency. The FM3 doesn't have the buffer settings available that the AxeFX III does.
 
Chad Beattie said:
This is what I had to do in Reaper for the Axe-Fx III. I can test with the FM3 but assume I will have to do the same thing. Doesn't Pro Tools have automatic delay comp or something similar?

With the Axe-Fx III, I believe I still had the issue at the lowest buffer settings. The only difference was the amount of compensation that was needed. Somewhere on the forum their is a thread that talks about the buffer size in relation to the offset etc... After reading that thread, I came to the conclusion that this was a common adjustment that needed to be made. But honestly I don't remember having to do it when I was using my 003. It may have been taking care of the issue in the background and I just didn't realize it.
Click to expand...
Pro tools has just a check box so you can't adjust it and from all the research I am seeing it really only starts doing it's job when you introduce plugin that cause delays so it calculates that and will adjust accordingly. At the moment I can only get Logic working since "recording delay" is available. Bummer...I'm just not that great at Logic and even more frustrating that my HX stomp, which, honestly I only bought while waiting for the FM3 has zero issues. I'm not smart enough to say why but my brain is hurting from the last few days of troubleshooting and I haven't seen any replies from Fractal on my ticket. Hoping they will chime in soon but this may just not be a priority issue for them at the moment
 
mcro2430 said:
I had this issue as well. I ended up running the FM3 Output 1 into a cheap USB interface and no longer had any latency. The FM3 doesn't have the buffer settings available that the AxeFX III does.
Click to expand...
Yep, I didn't want to have to bring something else around but I may have to resort to this when I want to go portable. It's unusable in pro tools. Not even a workaround.
 
skunc said:
Thanks for posting this thread.
I’ve lived the last 8 years of my life on a click track locked onto a grid.
I’ve just begun recording using PTs. I have been struggling with this issue and thought I was loosing it. It seems to be more noticeable on the FM3. I don’t recall this being noticeable on the Axe III.
Click to expand...
Yep, axe3 doesn't have it (as much...just a tad). Bummed that I can't at least find a workaround for now. Delay compensation is a no go. Need some sort of control for an offset at a minimum.
 
orion32773 said:
So, at the moment I have Logic figured out and can adjust the recording delay (my old iMac needs -2400 sample offset). I recorded a track then measured how far off it was (40-50ms) and then converted MS to samples based off the project sample rate of 48kHz. Now if I could only set a recording delay in Pro Tools. I am curious if this buffer setting in the i/o menu would help (if it was enabled at some point)
Click to expand...
40-50ms is enormous. Well beyond the half dozen or less samples with a SMPTE frame lock circumstance. Does setting the buffer in Logic or ProTools to the maximum help? (obviously, live monitoring would be required for tracking) If clock sync is working: You shouldn't have to adjust the recording delay, (Logic or Protools) unless there is outboard analog gear that isn't clocked (some legacy midi synths for example). Likely the clock can't be read due to some sync issue or setting. Good Luck!
 
Buffer settings in Pro Tools are only relevant to tracking real time. I don't need that. For live monitoring all you have to due is either enable low latency mode in Pro Tools or if not available in other DAWs, just mute the track while tracking. The issue here is that during the record process something is causing a "printing to track" delay so when you look at the track recording you can physically see the transients shifted further (delayed). You need some sort or negative offset to get it to record sooner to the track. You can listen back and everything is way off to a click or live drum track. Very frustrating. If you have another suggestion I am fully open to try it. Simple setup....only FM3 plugged in and using as an interface. Nothing else plugged into the laptop. Same behavior for multiple DAWs
 
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