Flattening the Headrush Curve for Legacy Products (Especially AX8)

dsouza

Experienced
The AX8 is a great piece of work that is relevant even until today.

The Headrush 108 FRFR units are a great , economical way to sound fantastic. I recently purchased not one but two because I like the sound and affordability so much and I wish for them to run in stereo.

The problem with the Headrush 108's is they come out of the box TOO BASS heavy. Taking it out of the corner and putting it up in the air only help so much.

One creative fellow named @WKSmith came up with an idea how to change the Parametric EQ for the FM3/Fm9/AF3 series.

I noticed by using the same curve on the AX8 Global EQ I was able to flatten it and get a true FRFR sound like that of a monitor.

I am now delighted with my AX8 and HR108's sound.

The only problem is I use OUT 1 for my U2 custom presets, and also for PA and while out 1 with the new Global EQ changes fix the HR108's the same curve makes my PC monitors or anything else linked to OUT 1 sound shrill and high pitched.

There are only two options at this point. Find a way to copy Output 1 to Output 2 which I haven't been successful getting to work with my U2 Presets which were designed for output 1. And then change the Global EQ for each of them. One for the HR108's one for the PA guy.

Or use the back of the HR108's XLR DI output to send to FOH. However, it's questionable whether the PA guy would like this? After all the volume on the HR's could be set at 4 or at 11. Would he get a sound he would like?

Has anyone who has HR108's been successful sending them to FOH or PA guy from the XLR output located at the back of the units? If so, do tell how you accomplished this!
 
I think it is quite simple:

Instead of copy Out 1 to Out 2 you just add a FX loop to ALL your presets.
  • Set up Out 2 for Stereo
  • Do NOT use a global EQ
  • In your signal chain:
- Add an EQ block at the end of the chain, in parallel , just before going to the output.
- Add the FX loop block after the EQ block.

This way you send signal with corrected EQ curve to the Headrush from output 2, and the unaltered signal to FOH from output 1.

Have a look at page 32 of the Axe8 manual, you would have different blocks but the concept is exactly the same.

Just forget about providing the FOH signal from the Headrush. That output seems to be primarily intended for connecting a 2nd Headrush.
 
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@Toopy14
@ChristThePhone
@chris
@Bruce Sokolovic
@JoKeR III
@Habuman

I really don't want to be messing with EDO's presets. First of all a lot of them run at up to 89%-90% cpu power. I don't wish to be adding more blocks because this would likely cause a CPU error message.

Have you heard of the value of a D.I. box? Would buying one of these and adding it to my HR 108 XLR outputs produce the correct "thru" signal for the PA sound engineer while still letting me hear the 108's at peak volumes of my choice? I'd rather spend the money on a simple D.I. box than alter 100+ presets (Most of which I can't because they're maxxed out in CPU power usage anyways).
 
@Toopy14
@ChristThePhone
@chris
@Bruce Sokolovic
@JoKeR III
@Habuman

I really don't want to be messing with EDO's presets. First of all a lot of them run at up to 89%-90% cpu power. I don't wish to be adding more blocks because this would likely cause a CPU error message.

Have you heard of the value of a D.I. box? Would buying one of these and adding it to my HR 108 XLR outputs produce the correct "thru" signal for the PA sound engineer while still letting me hear the 108's at peak volumes of my choice? I'd rather spend the money on a simple D.I. box than alter 100+ presets (Most of which I can't because they're maxxed out in CPU power usage anyways).
no, a DI box is supposed to be neutral. I'm not in front of my AX8 right now but didn't it have 2 separate global EQs for out 1&2 ? If not and you don't want to change your presets you'll need an external EQ between the AX8 and your HRs. Feeding the HR signal to PA would not solve your problem,the thru signal is a copy of what's coming in into the HR.
 
no, a DI box is supposed to be neutral. I'm not in front of my AX8 right now but didn't it have 2 separate global EQs for out 1&2 ? If not and you don't want to change your presets you'll need an external EQ between the AX8 and your HRs. Feeding the HR signal to PA would not solve your problem,the thru signal is a copy of what's coming in into the HR.

@ChristThePhone
@Toopy14

Thank you for clearing up the DI box issues.

Yes it does have two separate Global EQ's one for OUT1 one for OUT2.

Initially, I tried to do a copy of OUT 1 to OUT 2 so I could run all my U2 custom presets (with amp sims) on either, and then just change the Global EQ for out 1 for the PA guy and OUT 2 for the Headrush 108's. Remember, I want OUT2 to INCLUDE amp sims. Most people use OUT 2 with power amps for a backline only. I want to hear the full sound of the U2 effects and amp sims in OUT2 .

Simple right? Only problem is I couldn't get copy out1 to out 2 to work properly. I went into settings --> audio --> echo -> OUT2 is an echo of OUT1. While it did make my stock AX8 presets function, it didn't make my U2 custom presets function. The U2 custom presets sound was very, very faint, almost inaudible. There was almost no gain, and the signal was weak. I couldn't understand why. I had the output knob on the front panel of the AX8 OUT 2 turned to max as I had OUT 1 turned to max.

I believe my solution to copy out 1 to out 2 is not far away. I am just missing a key component or setting for it to work properly.

I just hope there is not a bug in the copy OUT 1 to OUT 2 echo for AX8 firmware 10.1.
 
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@Toopy14
@ChristThePhone
@chris
@Bruce Sokolovic
@JoKeR III
@Habuman

I really don't want to be messing with EDO's presets. First of all a lot of them run at up to 89%-90% cpu power. I don't wish to be adding more blocks because this would likely cause a CPU error message.

Have you heard of the value of a D.I. box? Would buying one of these and adding it to my HR 108 XLR outputs produce the correct "thru" signal for the PA sound engineer while still letting me hear the 108's at peak volumes of my choice? I'd rather spend the money on a simple D.I. box than alter 100+ presets (Most of which I can't because they're maxxed out in CPU power usage anyways).
Why don’t you try the proposed solution instead of dismissing it?

No offense intended but I do see a pattern in different posts where you ask for help, you get the right answers still you give the impression to hold on to your own approach.

Maybe it’s just me…good luck anyway, I’m stepping out here.
 
do Edo's presets use an FX send/return block ? That could explain why Out 2 is different from Out 1.

@ChristThePhone

Bingo!

EVERY SINGLE ONE of his presets use an FX LOOP on a separate line before the AMP and CAB blocks (in AX8Edit) . In the loop the FX mode is set to "thru".

I am wondering would changing the FX Loop's mode to "mute" solve my problem? Or removing the FX loop entirely?
 
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Man if feels like we just walked 5 miles to move 2 steps forward!
Glad the community could work together to come to a good easy solution.
 
One last step to close the discussion. No doubt, people will ask where is the new Headrush curve? I've included it here. Finito.
 

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Today I spent some time in the studio listening to some CD's through the HR108.
Neal Morse Band (Fractal) Night Ranger, Rush, Focus at 90db.
Turning On/Off the EQ Flattening curve. Wow what a difference! With it Active it is quite harsh!
I ended up dialing in my own EQ curve to try.
I know there are HR haters, but I don't care.
Like someone said in another thread,
by the time you are on stage standing next to a drummer who is pounding the crap out of them...
The experiment continues.

Hey guys I just wanted to make sure you didn't miss this info that I added.
The work is still in progress...
 
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