Flanger sweep timing consistency like Van Halen?

I use to think that the Flanger was either just timed in the studio and live it was all up to chance. But since Danny brought this up I started watching everything I could find on Youtube. When he does use it live, it's almost always timed just right (as stated before). I just found this fairly recent interview from Guitar World.

Excerpt from a Guitar World Interview

What led you to the MXR Flanger?

Obviously, I liked the Phase 90, so when MXR came out with the Flanger, I said, What the hell? I loved their stuff. Their pedals are built like a brick shit house, and they make great sounds, so I started putzing around with the Flanger too. I always use the same setting for everything, from the intro to “And the Cradle Will Rock…” to “Unchained,” with the exception of the setting I used on the intro to “Outta Love Again” and “Bullethead.”

I set the three knobs on the left between 11 o’clock or 11:30, and the last knob on the right [regeneration] is all the way up. I might fine-tune the speed a little to match it to the tempo of the song, like on “Unchained” where the sweep goes perfectly with the riff. I was just goofing off and experimenting. It wouldn’t have sounded good to use the flanger all the way through. The riff just needed a little bit here and there. It’s a cool, tasty little tidbit that I threw in there to draw attention to the riff.

How did you decide to place the Flanger in front of the Phase 90 in your signal chain?

I have no idea! I think I just liked having the Phase 90 in the middle between the Flanger and the microphone on the stage.

How did these pedals influence your songwriting?

One good example is “And the Cradle Will Rock…” I had written that intro riff on the electric piano, and the guys thought that it needed something. I just hooked up the Flanger and pounded on the low keys. It was a great sound, and it worked. There wasn’t any rocket science to it. Even the Flanger on “Unchained” was totally by accident.

For some reason I just thought that the Flanger sounded good there. The way it goes from the sweep up to the sweep down wasn’t planned. My normal setting just happened to fit the tempo of the song. I kicked it in and out, and when I heard the way the Flanger swept up and then down, I thought it sounded cool. Nothing I’ve ever done is really all that thought out. I’d just wing stuff, and if it sounded cool I would do it again.
 
That pretty much confirms he's just having the flanger go up and down constantly and he happens to turn it on and off at those points and it happens to go up or down mostly.

He probably turns the flanger on and holds a chord before starting the song. Then counts off when it's up and down where he needs it. They've played the song a million times so their tempo is probably pretty consistent and it goes down then up later.
 
Wait till I start commenting about "Ain't talkin bout love" the other timed flanger song! Lol! Now that one is faster than the one in unchained for me. Whatever the case, our effects in the Fractal are always moving in real time. Unless you hit a chord and find out where a sweep is, you'll have a hard time nailing it. Other effects reset somewhere along the way and just keep on moving.

Like I mentioned about the digitech, upon clicking on a patch that had a flange or phase, it would reset one time so worst case scenario, you'd get what i got in example 1 and in my opinion, closer to evh. There are a few points where the flange won't hit perfectly, but if you listen to unchained or ain't talkin via the albums they appear on, there are imperfections too. So we're closer to where we need to be with a one time reset IMHO.
 
Danny Danzi said:
Wait till I start commenting about "Ain't talkin bout love" the other timed flanger song! Lol! Now that one is faster than the one in unchained for me. Whatever the case, our effects in the Fractal are always moving in real time. Unless you hit a chord and find out where a sweep is, you'll have a hard time nailing it. Other effects reset somewhere along the way and just keep on moving.

Like I mentioned about the digitech, upon clicking on a patch that had a flange or phase, it would reset one time so worst case scenario, you'd get what i got in example 1 and in my opinion, closer to evh. There are a few points where the flange won't hit perfectly, but if you listen to unchained or ain't talkin via the albums they appear on, there are imperfections too. So we're closer to where we need to be with a one time reset IMHO.
Click to expand...

Cliff!!! Time Reset, please! :eagerness:
 
Hey guys, I got quite a few asking about the flanger settings so here ya go. You guys have given me loads of help...it's not much but it's the least I can do. :)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4909348/Unchained Flanger 17.02_20141217_170049.blk

(I hope that's how I share it)

The flanger has to be put in front of whatever amp you use right in line so it dirts up. You literally want it to be in the signal path....don't put it in an effects loop or anything. Good luck and remember who ya got it from! :devilish: :eagerness:
 
Danny Danzi said:
Hey guys, I got quite a few asking about the flanger settings so here ya go. You guys have given me loads of help...it's not much but it's the least I can do. :)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4909348/Unchained Flanger 17.02_20141217_170049.blk

(I hope that's how I share it)

The flanger has to be put in front of whatever amp you use right in line so it dirts up. You literally want it to be in the signal path....don't put it in an effects loop or anything. Good luck and remember who ya got it from! :devilish: :eagerness:
Click to expand...


Thanks for this, but I cannot open this on my end.
 
I think that assigning the flanger's bypass to a momentary switch would make this a bit easier, less tap dancing involved. Example: Hold down pedal or switch: flanger on, release pedal: flanger off. I would use one of those keyboard sustain pedals to control this.
 
Mark's Tone said:
Thanks for this, but I cannot open this on my end.
Click to expand...

Sorry...two things I forgot to mention...

1. It's not something you open. You go to where your Axe Edit folder is that has your block preset files you created and drop it in there. For example, (there are a few Axe Edit folders) the one mine is in is: C:\Users\Danny\Documents\Fractal Audio\Axe-Edit\blocks\Flanger

I drop the file in there, fire up Axe Edit and then go to a preset where you have a flanger and it will come up as a preset for you.

2. The preset is built around me using my Expression pedal to trigger the flanger output, so if it doesn't work...remove the flanger output modifier for that so you can just turn the flanger off and on with your switch.

Hope this helps. :)
 
Chris@AxeFxTutorials said:
They've played the song a million times so their tempo is probably pretty consistent and it goes down then up later.
Click to expand...

I agree with the other stuff but I had to post these vids for this statement. :) (Humorous intent - not an attack in any way)

Close - Song starts at about to 0:20 mark.



Not so Close




Cocaine is a wonderful drug ~Quote by Rick James

 
InsideOut said:
AHAH!!! If I use X/Y of a single block, it does not work. If I use Flanger 1 and Flanger 2 blocks, it works. I guess it must be the same LFO controlling X and Y within a single block?
Click to expand...

Cool that works. Set Flanger1 for Down Sweep (LFO Reset 0 deg), Set Flanger2 for Up Sweep (LFO Reset 180 deg). Program a button for each on your pedal board and voila!

Here's a clip. Playing is a little sloppy. Still trying to get coordinated hitting the footswitches.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kpy9exai2elyrpb/unchained.mp3?dl=0
 
There's no way that it is by chance, there is no way that it just happens to work. There is a secret to it.
Eddie has been known to give inaccurate information to hide the secrets of his tone haha.
 
Jay Seeney said:
There's no way that it is by chance, there is no way that it just happens to work. There is a secret to it.
Eddie has been known to give inaccurate information to hide the secrets of his tone haha.
Click to expand...

You may be right, but to me, the most obvious is what I reported initially in this thread. Certain effect modules reset when they are bypassed. I don't know if this was the case with Ed's flange in 78. If this is the case though and you have the right flange sweep and timing, when you engage the flange it will work and will go up and down and will eventually lose the perfect timing as you play the song the same as Ed's. His was not perfect through the songs both live or in the studio. If you listen close, it goes off eventually in both Ain't Talkin' and Unchained.

I have two versions of me landing this just like Ed. Again, as I stated, my 2101 had a reset on it each time I clicked on the patch that had the flange. So when I clicked on that patch, if I started instantly, the flange would be perfect for about 8 times when used and then it would drift just like Ed's did on the albums. Now he may be doing something different now when he plays live, but it was definitely coincidence on the records but was probably recorded that way. Meaning, if by chance I missed the flange part I wanted in say Unchained, I'd re-record until the flanger hit just the way I needed it to. Ed claims coincidence for the records and I believe him on that. The reason being, when my flanger drifts during the song, it drifts the same way Ed's did nearly on the same parts. Trust me on this one....I've been studying it and working with it since 1983. :)

-Danny
 
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