Firmware V2 vs. V3 A/B test... discouraged

randolfo said:
Stratman,

I think you're looking at the amp "Power" page, which shows "Power Amp Low Cut" and "Power Amp Hi Cut". Grape is referring to the "Tone" page (one down) values for "Low Cut" and "High Cut". It's one below the "Power" page.
Click to expand...

No, Stratman was right. He was looking at the Amp Tone section for a Wrecker and the defaults for that amp are 10-20000. Each amp has its own defaults which I didn't realize until he posted.

PS
I've done some more research and it appears that more often than not, the lo/hi cut for my presets are set to the default. Only a few presets benefitted from changing it to full range. I'm updating the top of my original post with more solutions. This time, I had a AC30TB preset that required the Amp Basic Treb to be set at 0.00 instead of 5.00. Another only required an increase of Drive by 1 or so.
 
I started working on some of the more overdriven crunchy sounds and I'm still having issues. I'm noticing two things:

1. upper mid distortion is lacking in the amp models or drive+amp combination. Eq in various places isn't getting this back - in fact changing the eq to recover some of that range is introducing more noise.
2. the sound as a whole is missing an even balance. This is harder to describe but it seems the spatial (3d, not just left right) quality that I heard in some presets has shifted. 2.0 sounded well balanced while 3.0 sounds too close. Changing the cab room settings some helps but doesn't quite do it.

I want to do some more testing before posting examples but thought it was worth mentioning since my experience is similar to a few other threads.
 
grape said:
I started working on some of the more overdriven crunchy sounds and I'm still having issues. I'm noticing two things:

1. upper mid distortion is lacking in the amp models or drive+amp combination. Eq in various places isn't getting this back - in fact changing the eq to recover some of that range is introducing more noise.
2. the sound as a whole is missing an even balance. This is harder to describe but it seems the spatial (3d, not just left right) quality that I heard in some presets has shifted. 2.0 sounded well balanced while 3.0 sounds too close. Changing the cab room settings some helps but doesn't quite do it.

I want to do some more testing before posting examples but thought it was worth mentioning since my experience is similar to a few other threads.
Click to expand...

Do you have a patch to share? I'd love a shot at breaking down what you are doing.

Clips offer context to understand your preset construction; but until I can 'peek under the hood' at what you are doing and how your preset is built, any suggestions from me are a waste of your time.

No one, IMHO, can help you until you open up the preset and see what you've got going on. Many of your comments really don't make sense to me because they are so counter what I am getting from my machine here; I need to see what you are doing and put it on my machine to hear it before I can offer help.

Can't say my help will be of any good to you; but I'm willing to reach out and try.
 
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I took the louder part from the following clip in your post and reamped it in 2.0 and 3.0 for a few presets. I'm spending way too much time on this but will post the results from a few presets in Bank A.

Reamp Wars - Digital Hardware, Software, and Analog Re Amp with Angus's Clip - The Gear Page

I also have a preset that is giving me trouble and will post that for comparison. Amp : Boutique 1, Drive : Tube Drive, Cab 1x12 and 2x12 G12065 Far-Field (JM) are in this one.
 
grape said:
I took the louder part from the following clip in your post and reamped it in 2.0 and 3.0 for a few presets. I'm spending way too much time on this but will post the results from a few presets in Bank A.

Reamp Wars - Digital Hardware, Software, and Analog Re Amp with Angus's Clip - The Gear Page

I also have a preset that is giving me trouble and will post that for comparison. Amp : Boutique 1, Drive : Tube Drive, Cab 1x12 and 2x12 G12065 Far-Field (JM) are in this one.
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Well, I can already tell you I do not like the Far-Field IR's from Jay - nothing against Jay; but really not my flavor of ice cream. That's problem #1 right there. Even if you love that speaker IR... it's IMHO the wrong speaker choice for that amp. Don't even need to see the patch to tell you that.

Before you spend much time reamping; just save off your preset and upload it here. You'll save yourself a lot of frustration - and if you don't like what I do to your patch, then you can tell me to bugger off and I'll leave you alone. ;) :D
 
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Scott Peterson said:
then you can tell me to bugger off and I'll leave you alone. ;) :D
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How about I tell you to bugger off right now ;)

The preset in question is half baked but it had an element of truth in it under 2.0. It's really bad under 3.0. I'm not posting the preset. It won't make any sense outside of my setup. I can post the audio though when I get a chance. As for the amp cab pairing, I'm using my ears, not what physically makes sense. In fact I started out with what's right (AC30TB + blues) but that doesn't work.

I have to switch to 2.0 and 3.0 again (3rd time) to get the sounds so this might take some time as I've burned my tweak time.
 
Here's an example.
AxeFX II 2.00b vs 3.00 by plum-55 on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

Two clips, A and B. Reamped through FW 2.00b and 3.00 (not telling which is which). First 4 presets of Bank A (3.00 has the latest Bank A). See the comments for preset breaks. It is much easier to compare in a DAW soloing each track at will but this will suffice for now.

Source was taken from:
Reamp Fun - Digital Hardware, Software, and Analog Re Amp with Angus's Clip - The Gear Page

Which ones do you like?
 
Without a preset to see/hear/test/analyze; there is no way to discuss this or help out at all. Listening tests can be skewed any number of ways, so I don't play that game really. I could make a Standard running 3.00 sound better than a II running 3.0 if that was the goal for instance.

Sorry man; until you add something to get my arms around I cannot help here.

If you really wanted help, it takes a few seconds to save off and upload a preset. Refusing to do so just says to me that you really don't want/need help and just want to make a point instead.

Nothing personal, just calling it like I see it.

Buggering off... :D
 
grape said:
Here's an example.
AxeFX II 2.00b vs 3.00 by plum-55 on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

Two clips, A and B. Reamped through FW 2.00b and 3.00 (not telling which is which). First 4 presets of Bank A (3.00 has the latest Bank A). See the comments for preset breaks. It is much easier to compare in a DAW soloing each track at will but this will suffice for now.

Source was taken from:
Reamp Fun - Digital Hardware, Software, and Analog Re Amp with Angus's Clip - The Gear Page

Which ones do you like?
Click to expand...

They all sound good but different. All that matters is what sounds good to you. If you prefer Ver 2.00 firmware then use that. You are in a very small minority but that's nothing to be ashamed of.
 
grape said:
Here's an example.
AxeFX II 2.00b vs 3.00 by plum-55 on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

Two clips, A and B. Reamped through FW 2.00b and 3.00 (not telling which is which). First 4 presets of Bank A (3.00 has the latest Bank A). See the comments for preset breaks. It is much easier to compare in a DAW soloing each track at will but this will suffice for now.

Source was taken from:
Reamp Fun - Digital Hardware, Software, and Analog Re Amp with Angus's Clip - The Gear Page

Which ones do you like?
Click to expand...

Interesting.
What guitar/pickups are you using? Maybe I missed that in this thread.

Why don't you tell us what you think about the two clips?
 
grape said:
I started working on some of the more overdriven crunchy sounds and I'm still having issues. I'm noticing two things:

1. upper mid distortion is lacking in the amp models or drive+amp combination. Eq in various places isn't getting this back - in fact changing the eq to recover some of that range is introducing more noise.
2. the sound as a whole is missing an even balance. This is harder to describe but it seems the spatial (3d, not just left right) quality that I heard in some presets has shifted. 2.0 sounded well balanced while 3.0 sounds too close. Changing the cab room settings some helps but doesn't quite do it.

I want to do some more testing before posting examples but thought it was worth mentioning since my experience is similar to a few other threads.
Click to expand...

Hi Grape,

I do agree with your comment. I have experience a fairly same problems. I have spend last evening trying to work on Friedman HBE and Cameron 2 Channel and it took me some time to get some decent gain sound. What I have experience is the following: I had to crank the Drive to 10 and put distortion in front to get more gain (for lead), which usually was set to up to 3.5 but this time around I had increase to 7.36 in order to get more gain. Once I have increased the drive more noise were coming, which forced me lower the gain. I have also notice that is was very important how you choose the tone stack and cab's and there was more work I have to do on the advance menus using Scott's tips for v.3. I do respect Cliff very much and I do not mean to be critical here. I am big fun of yours creation . I am just expressing my observation and I must say there is complete different game how to teak the Axe Fx in v.3. I do hope the next firmware upgrade will do the trick.

I must say that Scott's tips how to tweak Axe Fx in v.3 were very helpful. Thank you Scott!
 
Rezonans said:
Hi Grape,

I do agree with your comment. I have experience a fairly same problems. I have spend last evening trying to work on Friedman HBE and Cameron 2 Channel and it took me some time to get some decent gain sound. What I have experience is the following: I had to crank the Drive to 10 and put distortion in front to get more gain (for lead), which usually was set to up to 3.5 but this time around I had increase to 7.36 in order to get more gain. Once I have increased the drive more noise were coming, which forced me lower the gain. I have also notice that is was very important how you choose the tone stack and cab's and there was more work I have to do on the advance menus using Scott's tips for v.3. I do respect Cliff very much and I do not mean to be critical here. I am big fun of yours creation . I am just expressing my observation and I must say there is complete different game how to teak the Axe Fx in v.3. I do hope the next firmware upgrade will do the trick.

I must say that Scott's tips how to tweak Axe Fx in v.3 were very helpful. Thank you Scott!
Click to expand...

That much tinkering with adv. settings to get a good tone should not be necessary.
Are you ab-so-lu-te-ly sure everything is set default/optimal, from global settings (incl. Amp Gain), to I/O settings (Instr Level) to cab parameters such as Cab Size?

Because I just tested it:
- blank preset
- added an Amp and Cab
- set Amp to Friedman HBE, turned up Drive to 7
- set Cab to OH H75
- nothing else.

Result: great hi-gain Marshall tone.
 
grape said:
I started working on some of the more overdriven crunchy sounds and I'm still having issues. I'm noticing two things:

1. upper mid distortion is lacking in the amp models or drive+amp combination. Eq in various places isn't getting this back - in fact changing the eq to recover some of that range is introducing more noise.
2. the sound as a whole is missing an even balance. This is harder to describe but it seems the spatial (3d, not just left right) quality that I heard in some presets has shifted. 2.0 sounded well balanced while 3.0 sounds too close. Changing the cab room settings some helps but doesn't quite do it.

I want to do some more testing before posting examples but thought it was worth mentioning since my experience is similar to a few other threads.
Click to expand...

Hi Grape,

I do agree with your comment. I have experience a fairly same problems. I have spend last evening trying to work on Friedman HBE and Cameron 2 Channel and it took me some time to get some decent gain sound. What I have experience is the following: I had to crank the Drive to 10 and put distortion in front to get more gain (for lead), which usually was set to up to 3.5 but this time around I had increase to 7.36 in order to get more gain. Once I have increased the drive more noise were coming, which forced me lower the gain. I have also notice that is was very important how you choose the tone stack and cab's and there was more work I have to do on the advance menus using Scott's tips for v.3. I do respect Cliff very much and I do not mean to be critical here. I am big fun of yours creation . I am just expressing my observation and I must say there is complete different game how to teak the Axe Fx in v.3. I do hope the next firmware upgrade will do the trick.

I must say that Scott's tips how to tweak Axe Fx in v.3 were very helpful. Thank you Scott!
 
yek said:
That much tinkering with adv. settings to get a good tone should not be necessary.
Are you ab-so-lu-te-ly sure everything is set default/optimal, from global settings (incl. Amp Gain), to I/O settings (Instr Level) to cab parameters such as Cab Size?

Because I just tested it:
- blank preset
- added an Amp and Cab
- set Amp to Friedman HBE, turned up Drive to 7
- set Cab to OH H75
- nothing else.

Result: great hi-gain Marshall tone.
Click to expand...

Hi Yek,

Thank you for chiming in. I have uploaded my old preset and tweak it using Scott's tips for v.3. However, I will do create a brand new patch from a scratch as you advised and see what happens. I may as well be mixing old patch in a new parametric setting in v.3. I will report my findings later.

Thanks!
 
yek said:
That much tinkering with adv. settings to get a good tone should not be necessary.
Are you ab-so-lu-te-ly sure everything is set default/optimal, from global settings (incl. Amp Gain), to I/O settings (Instr Level) to cab parameters such as Cab Size?

Because I just tested it:
- blank preset
- added an Amp and Cab
- set Amp to Friedman HBE, turned up Drive to 7
- set Cab to OH H75
- nothing else.

Result: great hi-gain Marshall tone.
Click to expand...

Just tried this. Agree it is quite good.
 
Listening to the clips here in the studio I prefer the sounds of Clip A except for the brownface that I prefer B.
There is a huge difference in the sounds. All the parameters are set correctly? Is it just the firmware difference?
 
IMHO. Grape's Group A crush Group B. No contest.

But... Group B are not tweaked nor setup correctly just on how they sound and what I am hearing. Something's wrong with Group B; and it ain't the firmware.

No matter what firmware each is.

Here's my take on the same clip with Firmware 3.00 and my personal Bogner Red preset as I use it for 'reals':

 
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