Fender FR or Celestion F12?

toesalad

toesalad

Inspired
I have decided to explore FRFR and am wondering what a good approach might be... I currently have a PowerStage 200 and an EVH 1x12 cab. I am thinking I could either:
  • Sell the PowerStage and the cab, and buy something like a Fender FR10 or FR12. In this case I will come out ahead financially. Slightly less flexible, as I can't use a regular cab in the future if I want. Simpler as there are less things to carry and setup.
  • Sell the EVH speaker and buy a Celestion F12-X200 or F12M-150 speaker. In this case I am close to break-even financially. More flexible, as I can pair the PowerStage with other cabs in the future if I want. More complex because there is more to carry and setup. Probably louder, and maybe better quality (buy-it-for-life?).
At the moment, I see this as an either/or scenario... I currently am not interested in collecting more stuff than I need. At home I play through my studio monitors. The use-case for the FRFR would be for going out and jamming with friends. I currently don't gig (maybe one day, but I would re-evaluate my options when I get there).

So given those options, which would you choose, and why? For those of you who would choose the Celestion option, which speaker would you choose for this application (1x12 closed-back)? The 200 or the 150?
 
I am actually aware of those two options, however I am currently putting them in the category of “more financial outlay than I am willing to do right now”. Here in Canada, the Redsound and EV will be roughly double the cost of the Fenders. Also, seeing this video leads me to believe the Redsounds may not be much better than the Celestion option anyway:
 
I haven't tried the F12-X200 or 150 so I can't speak to those. I can say that if Fender is really producing the FRs with quieter opamps, I think it'll be tough to go wrong with one of those.
 
Deadpool_25 said:
I haven't tried the F12-X200 or 150 so I can't speak to those. I can say that if Fender is really producing the FRs with quieter opamps, I think it'll be tough to go wrong with one of those.
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Is that the rumour? That they have made a change?
 
I’ll most likely be buying the FR-10 or 12 this month as a birthday gift to myself. This is to complement my F12 cab. I’m happy with the F12 but my cab is a combo with a Crown amp mounted below the ported cabinet. So it’s a tank. The FR’s are light carries and the price is right. Look good too.

I have only seen the one post about a factory reworked preamp in the FR-12. I’m hoping this is real news.
 
toesalad said:
Is that the rumour? That they have made a change?
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Yeah. @Lysander posted about someone who bought an FR-12 directly from Fender, opened it up, and saw that it's already been modded. Looks like the factory did it. @Famous_Snack stopped by to report that he was the person who bought that one and provide a little more detail.

We haven't heard other corroborating reports from others yet but there should be a few reports coming soon.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...the-hissterectomy.198759/page-27#post-2500954
 
I haven't tried the other options but the FR-12 is pretty cool and the neodymium speaker mag makes it nice and light. I'd like to try the 10 too, but the size and weight savings are fairly insignificant.

The one I tried had about 25% of the hiss level of a tube amp idling. It's hearable over breathing, but not talking. That said if they make the changes to eliminate that, all the better. I could totally live with it myself though. I'll probably stick with my Bose S1 Pro monitors because I like the battery operation functionality and the two are similar in size and weight to the one Fender, but it's very tempting to pick up one or two of the FR-12s because it has "Real guitar amp" vibes.
 
Hellbat said:
I haven't tried the other options but the FR-12 is pretty cool and the neodymium speaker mag makes it nice and light. I'd like to try the 10 too, but the size and weight savings are fairly insignificant.

The one I tried had about 25% of the hiss level of a tube amp idling. It's hearable over breathing, but not talking. That said if they make the changes to eliminate that, all the better. I could totally live with it myself though. I'll probably stick with my Bose S1 Pro monitors because I like the battery operation functionality and the two are similar in size and weight to the one Fender, but it's very tempting to pick up one or two of the FR-12s because it has "Real guitar amp" vibes.
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I tried an FR-10 today, and the hiss was definitely there. My PowerStage has no hiss… so I guess I am not thrilled with the idea adding hiss to my current setup.

I have been intrigued by the idea of the S1 Pro too. I am not sure they would hold up that well to a drummer though. How do you use them?
 
toesalad said:
How do you use them?
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Stereo Floor monitors facing me. As a stereo pair they'll push enough to compete with a hard hitting drummer for stage volume, but I also go through the PA for FOH sound. In a jam situation they may be slightly anemic. The Fender definitely gets louder.
 
So, just to follow-up... I bought a Celestion F12M-150 and put it in my EVH 1x12 cab. It sounded alright at low volume, but got boomy with a nasty resonance at the lower frequencies when I turned it up. I remember reading around online about the suggestion to put some batting in the cab to eliminate this kind of thing, so I took an old memory foam pillow and cut it down to size so that it covers the back panel behind the speaker (this is a closed-back cab). This solved the resonance issue and changed the cab from sounding good to sounding great (IMHO). It translates very well from my studio monitors (Focal Alpha Evo 80).

I don't have a ton of experience with FRFR. I had a Friedman ASC-10 for a while, but I wasn't happy with how it sounded a lower volumes. I also had a Headrush 108 which I didn't enjoy at all, so I returned it. I also tried a Line6 PowerCab for a few days but didn't enjoy that either. I began to think that maybe FRFR wasn't for me, though I liked the sound of my guitar through studio monitors. This experiment with the Celestion comes after a 2 year hiatus of playing with FRFR. I would say that this setup I have is so far my favourite.
 
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When I bought my F12 I loaded it into a open back 112 with an old pillow shoved in the back. Coming from the Headrush 112 I was very happy with it. Then I built a ported cab for it and I can’t say it sounded better. It sounds good but it was fine in the open back too. These speakers seem to be pretty forgiving. Glad you’re happy with the new speaker!
 
toesalad said:
I don't have a ton of experience with FRFR. I had a Friedman ASC-10 for a while, but I wasn't happy with how it sounded a lower volumes. I also had a Headrush 108 which I didn't enjoy at all, so I returned it. I also tried a Line6 PowerCab for a few days but didn't enjoy that either. I began to think that maybe FRFR wasn't for me, though I liked the sound of my guitar through studio monitors. This experiment with the Celestion comes after a 2 year hiatus of playing with FRFR. I would say that this setup I have is so far my favourite.
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The trick to running FR is in the cab block high and low cut settings and the volume at which you are dialing in your tones! If you have the chance try a good Coaxial floor wedge! I know they might be outside your budget at this point but until you play through one and spend the time it will be really hard to get a good idea of how they can really sound.
 
skolacki said:
When I bought my F12 I loaded it into a open back 112 with an old pillow shoved in the back. Coming from the Headrush 112 I was very happy with it. Then I built a ported cab for it and I can’t say it sounded better. It sounds good but it was fine in the open back too. These speakers seem to be pretty forgiving. Glad you’re happy with the new speaker!
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That is good to know. A local guitar store has a VBoutique Celestion spec ported cab, but if it won't make much difference in sound quality, it is good to know. I guess that spec was technically designed for the F12-X200 anyway, so perhaps it doesn't do the same for the 150.

I will be interested in hearing how you feel the Fender FR-10/12 compares against your Celestion setup.
 
Sixstring said:
The trick to running FR is in the cab block high and low cut settings and the volume at which you are dialing in your tones! If you have the chance try a good Coaxial floor wedge! I know they might be outside your budget at this point but until you play through one and spend the time it will be really hard to get a good idea of how they can really sound.
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I am interested in trying one at some point. Do you think a floor wedge is a better experience than the Celestion speakers?
 
toesalad said:
That is good to know. A local guitar store has a VBoutique Celestion spec ported cab, but if it won't make much difference in sound quality, it is good to know. I guess that spec was technically designed for the F12-X200 anyway, so perhaps it doesn't do the same for the 150.

I will be interested in hearing how you feel the Fender FR-10/12 compares against your Celestion setup.
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Yeah I’m getting ready to pull the trigger on the Fender. Still not sure which one though. I’m leaning towards the FR-10 since I read the posts about it from @hippietim.

My F12 cab is an oddball. The volume and port is per spec but the baffle is tilted back so it’s not a squared box. Celestion didn’t release a spec cab design for the 150 and I haven’t seen any indication that the F12 cab is supposed to be ideal for the 150. Since a local store has the spec cab maybe they would let you bring in your modeler and give it a go.
 
Ive been using F12 x200 since they came out in a pair of xitone passive wedges and a Matrix GT100fx 2u and I keep trying other things but so far I have stuck with it.
 
I have F12M-150s in ported cabs powered by Matrix GT1000FX. Happy with them for lower volume mancave usage with a low cut and small push at 10k. I have futzed with putting foam / insulation in the the port tube / cab just to see if I could refine / tweak the sound any, but without much overall difference - I've come to the conclusion it's just a fluke luck thing: stuff something in there and it might or might not make a positive change - not a very scientific / measured approach, but easy, so worth a try I guess.
 
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