Wish Double Tap for Foot Switches

The_Logod

Member
While I’m sure I haven’t even scratched the surface of what’s possible with the 3 foot switches of the FM3, I sometimes wish I could use the tap and hold for functions like utilities and bypassing certain effects more easily. Flipping “pages” in the layouts could be done via a fast double tap instead.
Would this be something more people find useful?
 
That would essentially mean we have 3 functions per switch which would definitely be nice.

The thing is, how would it know that you're going to double-tap, and not fire the single-tap function as soon as you step on it? Seems like we wouldn't be able to time our single-tap precisely any more...
 
That would essentially mean we have 3 functions per switch which would definitely be nice.

The thing is, how would it know that you're going to double-tap, and not fire the single-tap function as soon as you step on it? Seems like we wouldn't be able to time our single-tap precisely any more...
Probably similar to how Hold works now: for things that require tight timing don't also assign Hold or Double Tap functions to that switch.
 
That would essentially mean we have 3 functions per switch which would definitely be nice.

The thing is, how would it know that you're going to double-tap, and not fire the single-tap function as soon as you step on it? Seems like we wouldn't be able to time our single-tap precisely any more...

Or I'd imagine similar to a single and double click on a computer mouse. Maybe the time intervals can be adjusted in settings depending on how you interpret single- and double-taps.
 
If the FW has to wait a predefined amount of time to determine whether a double-click is incoming, could that make a single-click event sluggish? It’s one thing for a mouse to mait a few milliseconds for a double-click, but tapping a foot switch is not typically executed as quickly as a double-click on a mouse. The unit might have to wait a bit longer than a typical mouse double-click event.

Regardless, I like this request as long as the implementation does not noticeably effect single-click events.
 
Probably similar to how Hold works now: for things that require tight timing don't also assign Hold or Double Tap functions to that switch.
If the FW has to wait a predefined amount of time to determine whether a double-click is incoming, could that make a single-click event sluggish? It’s one thing for a mouse to mait a few milliseconds for a double-click, but tapping a foot switch is not typically executed as quickly as a double-click on a mouse. The unit might have to wait a bit longer than a typical mouse double-click event.

Regardless, I like this request as long as the implementation does not noticeably effect single-click events.
 
If the FW has to wait a predefined amount of time to determine whether a double-click is incoming, could that make a single-click event sluggish? It’s one thing for a mouse to mait a few milliseconds for a double-click, but tapping a foot switch is not typically executed as quickly as a double-click on a mouse. The unit might have to wait a bit longer than a typical mouse double-click event.
It seems like the IA switches function opposite to how mouse clicks work. A single mouse click does happen right away; the software tells it "execute single-click function immediately (like activate a link or move the cursor to that spot). However, if there's a second click within X time, execute the double-click action."

For the current hold function, FAS gear says "wait after the first tap for X time to see if the switch is being held down. if not, execute the single tap on the release, or if it's held long enough, execute the hold function." So I'd assume it would work the same way with a double tap: "wait for 1/2 second to see if it's tapped again. If it is, execute the double tap function. If not, then execute the single tap function."

The mouse method wouldn't work for us, because the single tap would execute right away when you don't want it to. Also, hold would also have to be long enough so as not to confuse the processor.

Regardless, I like this request as long as the implementation does not noticeably effect single-click events.
I agree, if there's a way to still have single tap happen immediately.
 
If the FW has to wait a predefined amount of time to determine whether a double-click is incoming, could that make a single-click event sluggish? It’s one thing for a mouse to mait a few milliseconds for a double-click, but tapping a foot switch is not typically executed as quickly as a double-click on a mouse. The unit might have to wait a bit longer than a typical mouse double-click event.

Regardless, I like this request as long as the implementation does not noticeably effect single-click events.
I like the idea of double-click.
I wish to choose whether activate or not the double-click function (that address your consideration)

1) When inactive there is no double click (same as now).
2) When active, there should be max second-click time (interval within you have to click to consider it 2nd click). Also there could be some need for first click function: 2.1 activate function immediatly, 2.2 activate when there is 2nd click or after max time expire; 2.3 don't activate if there is a second click (wait max time).

Each of these behaviour may be useful, depending on the use and functions. 2.1 address sluggishness but could lead to conflict or incoerence (recall a layout, read the 2nd switch as a first switch and do something in conflict with 2nd-click function) (but we may want the function to active as we tap, and then the second tap... let say we want activate a scene and then boost it). 2.2 is slaggish, but allow you to activate first click function then 2nd click (if any); 2.3 allow you to "ignore" first click function and go directly to 2nd click function (if any; when max time expire activate 1st click function, so it is the slaggish-est...!)

Any thougths?
 
Another option would be a long hold. It would function exactly like the existing hold funcion, but only be activated if held for some longer time interval. The tap function would still fire on a quick release as it does now. The hold and long hold functions would just need to time the hold length and activate accordingly. You can have hold set to say 1 second and long hold set to 2 seconds. Make each interval user selectable. Logic would be something like: switch is pressed start timing. If released before 1 second, fire the tap function. If release before 2 seconds, fire the hold function. If still held after 2 seconds, fire the long hold function. The activation delay would only need to be as long as the switch is actually held or the long hold interval length, whichever comes first.
 
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Seems a bit difficult to time your hold functions, 1 sec, 2 sec etc while performing. I'd like a way to access 2 switch functions quickly i.e. tap, double tap.

For example; I select a preset and it goes right to the effects layout. Now I need to get to scenes quickly. Currently, I have to hold to go home, then press scenes. That's too much time, thinking and tapping. Whereas if I could double tap the middle switch and go directly to scenes? Very slick!
 
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Seems a bit difficult to time your hold functions, 1 sec, 2 sec etc while performing. I'd like a way to access 2 switch functions quickly i.e. tap, double tap.

For example; I select a preset and it goes right to the effects layout. Now I need to get to scenes quickly. Currently, I have to hold to go home, then press scenes. That's too much time, thinking and tapping. Whereas if I could double tap the middle switch and go directly to scenes? Very slick!
The unfortunate fact is that for double tap to work, either single taps won't take effect until it waits long enough to make sure it's not a double, or doubles have to trigger both the single and double tap actions, single immediately, then double after the second tap.

That's just the logic of the situation.
 
The unfortunate fact is that for double tap to work, either single taps won't take effect until it waits long enough to make sure it's not a double, or doubles have to trigger both the single and double tap actions, single immediately, then double after the second tap.

That's just the logic of the situation.
I don’t think double-tap is as user friendly as people think it would be; the added irritation or confusion of a single-tap being accidentally triggered, and the changes to timing, would override any advantages. Personally, I would not use it. If I needed more switches I’d add a MIDI controller or another FC.

An extra long hold might work though.
 
A single mouse click does happen right away; the software tells it "execute single-click function immediately (like activate a link or move the cursor to that spot).
Actually mouse-clicks don’t work that way. There are two events triggered by the click action, a mouse-down, and a mouse-up. Mouse-up is when the actual action occurs, to provide the user the opportunity to change their mind by moving away from where they initially clicked.

Fractal gives us the option of switching to activate on release instead of on press. See page 70 in the FM3 manual or page 14 of the FC6/FC12 manual.
 
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I don’t think double-tap is as user friendly as people think it would be; the added irritation or confusion of a single-tap being accidentally triggered, and the changes to timing, would override any advantages. Personally, I would not use it. If I needed more switches I’d add a MIDI controller or another FC.
2.3 address your issue.
I'm on a dark stage with cables, I wish a single click recall rhythm, while double click activate lead in the middle of the song without have to step to another midi controller. Long press could activate function that don't require accurate timing (between song, or when you could paid attention to the controllers).
 
2.3 address your issue.
I'm on a dark stage with cables, I wish a single click recall rhythm, while double click activate lead in the middle of the song without have to step to another midi controller. Long press could activate function that don't require accurate timing (between song, or when you could paid attention to the controllers).
The existence of a double-click action has to affect how SINGLE clicks are handled, as noted above.
Similarly, having a long-press action means short presses have to take effect on release, or after enough time that it knows it's not a long press.

I don't mind the delay for long- or double-press so much; as you say, you'd choose that trigger only for actions where you could live with that.
I'm way less happy with short single presses not happening instantly.
It's an unfortunate conundrum, since I'd really really like having 2 or 3 times as many switch actions available, I just don't see a way around it.
 
All the issues raised here seem to be related to timing and calibration which I'd assume is something that can be worked out eventually?
 
I don't mind the delay for long- or double-press so much; as you say, you'd choose that trigger only for actions where you could live with that.
I'm way less happy with short single presses not happening instantly.
I wish to have some setting to choose from.
First tap function mode: a) on press b) on release c) wait for long press or second tap.

a) could be the default if no other mode are associated to the switch.
 
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