Does playing through an FRFR make you really feel like you gotta amp?

I have a Friedman 212 and BE-50...well had...I just sold them both this week. I have a JJ Jr. and matching 1x12 cab. I have the Axe III with a couple of Friedman 10” monitors. All of it sounds fabulous. There are days when I want what comes out of the Axe III and there are days when I feel like my amp. I kept both options for this reason. Playing live I now almost always use the Axe III.
 
You know, so many people have one of the big 3 and something else meaning
Friedman + X
Atomic + X
Xitone + X
And everyone says they love all their stuff lol...and thast fine
I guess after a certain price point, its all good in its own way as long as it does what it says it does
I’m very confident the xitone will be fine, I’ve read so many active that i didnt read the passive reviews and they are even better
So the active has to be as good if not more

Anyhow, id still love to hear if someone has both and what youd compare? If you have anything to say
Thanks again guys
 
Well,

the benefit - for me as a player with 10++ gigs a month - is convenience. But - at the same time - also good sims and amazing effects.
The most important thing ist how it sounds over the PA. Remember, you play for the audience. They pay for you ;-).


So I have to live with that the venue has to offer. My tech always said, “Each venue was like a box of chocolates . You never know what wedge you're gonna get.” ;-)

I don't use a specific FRFR cab. Why? First it is a waste of money, second I am to lazy for carrying them around. Furthermore, there isn't that much room in my Tesla 3 for big cabinets ;-).

So I expect from my AXE 3 that it sounds - at least - ok over a cheap 1x10 wedge. As long as I can hear my playing, all is good.
Amp in the room feeling? Hmm. Sometimes, but I don't care.

A few days ago I had the pleasure to play over two Meyersound MJF-212. That was fun, but you seldom find those wedges at a venue.
So the day after I had to use a t-box from Thomann ;-)
 
It's just slightly different, "equally otherwise" but I wouldn't get back to real tube amps no way. Doing blues with a single CLR in backline mode. Add some low mids and you're in the ballpark. Only purists will say that a real tube amp sounds better after they see you're digitalised as they can't hear the difference in an audience. Nobody ever said "ah I'm smelling there's a typical fractal sound in there", but rather "that sounds crazy".
 
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Screw it, Xitone it is - anyway

Its going to sound like a cab, more or less, than the CLR at least.....thats the biggest difference i could gather, the CLR sounds more like a PA (which is true, as I had the kemper with one), flat response is right....so if there is some oomph and it reproduces the sound nearly identically, that’s all i care about now......plus, its subjective anyway, not everything sounds good out of a CLR just because its a CLR, sometimes crap is just that.....

And tbh, id rather have a brand new Xitone 2019 than an NOS atomic CLR from 2015
 
There's these people that have their real amps standing on the floor aiming at their knees. They dial in lots of highs, silly highs, so they get enough highs to theirs even though they are off axis. Then they move around until they find their sweet spot, a place where they like the sound the most. Everyone else is off their sweet spot, since it isn't free anymore, and get a worse sound....at least a different sound, because maybe other listeners would prefer other places as their own sweet spot.
This kind of playing is pure chaos...but it's not unusal. No, the axe-fx can't emulate that and no FRFR monitor can. Maybe lay it with the front on the ground or turn it the way it blows away from you, to get something similar. But I don't think it's the same.

Then there's these people that had always aimed their cabs at thrir ears. They won't be disapointed by an FRFR monitoring. Small step for them.
 
Your right, perspective and impression and preference is going to be key to all of this hypothetical sound stuff.....’
Its fine, i had a CLR so now im going to own the newer Xitone and hope its as good as everyone says
 
White Light of Death,

As I understand it, the "extra mid range thump" is the thing that leads to the perceived difference. Indeed, I think the Wiki has a section that also points to this as a way to get to the traditional cab feeling with a pointer on how to EQ it in.

Therefore - EQ it in if required? I went for CLRs and have no complaints either in my studio or out of it.

Alternatively, EQ out some of the FRFR lows and highs, again in the Wiki :

FRFR and amp/cab-in-the-room

Use the parameters below to get the sound of FRFR amplification closer to the familiar "amp/cab in the room" sound.
Cab block:

  • Room Level
  • Floor Reflection
  • select a "far-field" IR. The stock ones have "JM" in their name. Or: select a stock cab which has been captured with a neutral mic, such as the Red Wirez ones, and set Proximity to its lowest value for simulate far-field coloring
  • create the so-called "HAAS" effect by using two IRs in stereo, with a very short delay in the Cab block on one of them
  • use De-Phase / Smoothing
  • use Low Cut and High Cut to shave off excessive low and high frequencies and mimic the frequency range of a traditional guitar speaker
 
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White Light of Death,

As I understand it, the "extra mid range thump" is the thing that leads to the perceived difference. Indeed, I think the Wiki has a section that also points to this as a way to get to the traditional cab feeling with a pointer on how to EQ it in.

Therefore - EQ it in if required? I went for CLRs and have no complaints either in my studio or out of it.

Alternatively, EQ out some of the FRFR lows and highs, again in the Wiki :

FRFR and amp/cab-in-the-room

Use the parameters below to get the sound of FRFR amplification closer to the familiar "amp/cab in the room" sound.
Cab block:

  • Room Level
  • Floor Reflection
  • select a "far-field" IR. The stock ones have "JM" in their name. Or: select a stock cab which has been captured with a neutral mic, such as the Red Wirez ones, and set Proximity to its lowest value for simulate far-field coloring
  • create the so-called "HAAS" effect by using two IRs in stereo, with a very short delay in the Cab block on one of them
  • use De-Phase / Smoothing
  • use Low Cut and High Cut to shave off excessive low and high frequencies and mimic the frequency range of a traditional guitar speaker
Thank you for the tip, ill try it
 
absolutely. I do it 2-3 times every week with this rig for the last 4 years. I played tube amplifiers for 35 years. They sound great but in small clubs with varying levels of voltage, lights, etc, tube amps can act weird. I went to Fractal products to have a consistently great sound. Works great every time without fail. You can get any sound you want. Takes some time time learn but worth the effort.
 
Sometimes I ponder what would happen if, somehow, we went the other way and replace all the line-arrays and subs with guitar cabs, powered by guitar amps. Imagine the disaster it would be, only thing I know is don't wanna to be right in front of it getting 'beamed up', haha.

Always tried to tell people how any modeler is as capable of delivering the sounds they want as the medium they use to amplify it... For starters, I always tell them that the ampsim+IR combo is ultimately designed to deliver the sound of a real amp+cab+mic combo directly to a PA or recording system. Grab your favourite tube head, cab and mic, record it to your daw and then play it thru some good FRFR system: See how despite sounding awesome you still won't get the amp-in-the-room experience, THAT'S the Modeler Sound in a nutshell.

If you really want the 'amp-in-the-room' experience, IMHO the only way is to disable IRs (and power amp modelling in case your are using a tube power amp) plug into you favorite power amp and into you cab and let it rip.

The beauty of this generation of modelers is that you can have the best of both worlds at the same time, you just need to put some work on it: Have your amp+ir go directly to FOH trusting it will sound AWESOME and routing a parallel signal without IRs to your backline poweramp and cab to feel the rumble onstage. :cool:
 
If you want the sound of a well mic'd amp and cab (meaning you want both the sound of a studio recording and the sound of what you'll hear through a live PA) then get a good set of FRFR speakers.

If you want a cab-in-the-room experience, plug the Axe-Fx into a solid state amp and a real guitar cab and you will %100 get there.

FRFR and a guitar cab in the room sound are simply fundamentally different beasts. However, the Axe-Fx can do both perfectly well with the right equipment.
 
Well,

the benefit - for me as a player with 10++ gigs a month - is convenience. But - at the same time - also good sims and amazing effects.
The most important thing ist how it sounds over the PA. Remember, you play for the audience. They pay for you ;-).


So I have to live with that the venue has to offer. My tech always said, “Each venue was like a box of chocolates . You never know what wedge you're gonna get.” ;-)

I don't use a specific FRFR cab. Why? First it is a waste of money, second I am to lazy for carrying them around. Furthermore, there isn't that much room in my Tesla 3 for big cabinets ;-).

So I expect from my AXE 3 that it sounds - at least - ok over a cheap 1x10 wedge. As long as I can hear my playing, all is good.
Amp in the room feeling? Hmm. Sometimes, but I don't care.

A few days ago I had the pleasure to play over two Meyersound MJF-212. That was fun, but you seldom find those wedges at a venue.
So the day after I had to use a t-box from Thomann ;-)
I did an outdoor event and played thru a Meyersound 212 MJF....WOWW!!! What punch, power, detail..
 
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