I've posted about this before. In the real amps you can hear a percussive impact, more rasp and more thump (what's being called 'chirp' here). I don't know how to dial that in. The closest I've come is with dialing dynamic presence way up, dynamic depth up a bit and sometimes pick attack.
Here's a plexi clip I did (using a semihollow).
The original has much more percussive bounce.
Yes Mofo, I think I can hear some improvement over the last few firmwares but I still don't know how to get there.
Here's another intro clip, done in 8.01.
Couldn't get that close tone-wise b/c I'm not really good at this kind of thing. You can def hear the pronounced percussive attack in the real clip.
II know exactly what you mean. it's like a little explosion going off when digging in. the Axe has become real close with recent updates, but there's still a little more roughness and for lack of better term "impoliteness" in real Plexis. very subtle though.. Can you hear that top end squish once he digs in?
Are you refering to the comparison clip where both amps can be heard in the same clip or are you just talking about the two individual clips that I posted at the very top?
Here's my third attempt:
https://instaud.io/VSV
I increased dynamic presence and crunch quite a bit, as well as motor drive, speaker drive, harmonics and I put a tilt EQ in front of the Plexi simulation. I basically did everything to accentuate and enhance the top end, even to the point of exaggeration, just to let that top end shine through. The clip was also matched to the Mojave EQ response with Ozone.
I still don't hear it. The top end response is just not the same. You can hear it in this clip, too:
Every cranked Marshall Plexi has that distinct sizzling top end that I just can't get no matter how much I play around with the advanced settings. We can argue that there are minor differences between each manufacturer, but at the end of the day, those are still just Plexis. It should be possible, even without advanced parameters, to get a similar response from one of the many Plexi models inside the Axe FX II...
Have you ever dialed in a Plexi tone with the Axe that had that elusive top end, Thomas?
For me, this whole issue got started a few years ago when I tried to dial in the outro Satriani's Champagne? You can hear it starting at 5:03
I don't know if this is a plexi, I would guess a strat through a bassman but it's 100% an amp through an IR and has that explosive attack. Tone is the fingers, but I don't think it accounts for all of it.
I haven´t heard your new experiments yet but the IR can make a huge difference. Or maybe you are recording through a real speaker.?
That's very kind of you. The soundcloud link in my signature should have all the songs (https://soundcloud.com/stevenschechter)I also think that it has to be some old Fender amp, but then again, the Plexi is a direct derivative of the Bassman, so we can't rule out the Plexi, either. How do you know that he used an IR? Has he already changed to digital recording at that point in time?
And yes, I agree with the "tone is in the fingers" sentiment, but I somehow can't imagine Larry Carlton getting a Dumble-esque tone out of an Engl Savage.
On a different note: I've heard your songs on lonely tone (can't remember exactly what the site's called) and I remember you having a very keen sense of melodies and unique chord progressions, unfortunately, I couldn't find any of your songs on your soundcloud profile. Would you mind re-uploading them there?
What you are hearing is output transformer high frequency resonance. Old Plexis didn't do this because they had good transformers. New transformers are crappy and resonate at the cutoff frequency because they are underdamped. This causes a raspy, fizzy texture to the distortion. The transformer resonance is adjustable but the parameter isn't exposed to the user. When you turn it up you get that same squishy rasp that you are hearing. For the Plexis I have the damping set to flat with no resonance because that's how our vintage Plexis measure. Our 50W is a little underdamped but people complain about raspy high frequencies so I erred on the safe side.
That's very kind of you. The soundcloud link in my signature should have all the songs (https://soundcloud.com/stevenschechter)
Chapagne? is on the album "engines of creation" which was entirely recorded through real amps into a Palmer simulator. I love the tone on that outro.
What you are hearing is output transformer high frequency resonance. Old Plexis didn't do this because they had good transformers. New transformers are crappy and resonate at the cutoff frequency because they are underdamped. This causes a raspy, fizzy texture to the distortion. The transformer resonance is adjustable but the parameter isn't exposed to the user. When you turn it up you get that same squishy rasp that you are hearing. For the Plexis I have the damping set to flat with no resonance because that's how our vintage Plexis measure. Our 50W is a little underdamped but people complain about raspy high frequencies so I erred on the safe side.
Never found a use for the palmer ir's. Always seemed to pale in comparison.Have you tried using Palmer IRs that a guy posted a couple of years back on this forum? I liked those Palmer IRs very much. They all had a very distinct, mid-focused tone...
Are you refering to the comparison clip where both amps can be heard in the same clip or are you just talking about the two individual clips that I posted at the very top?
Here's my third attempt:
https://instaud.io/VSV
I increased dynamic presence and crunch quite a bit, as well as motor drive, speaker drive, harmonics and I put a tilt EQ in front of the Plexi simulation. I basically did everything to accentuate and enhance the top end, even to the point of exaggeration, just to let that top end shine through. The clip was also matched to the Mojave EQ response with Ozone.
I still don't hear it. The top end response is just not the same. You can hear it in this clip, too:
Every cranked Marshall Plexi has that distinct sizzling top end that I just can't get no matter how much I play around with the advanced settings. We can argue that there are minor differences between each manufacturer, but at the end of the day, those are still just Plexis. It should be possible, even without advanced parameters, to get a similar response from one of the many Plexi models inside the Axe FX II...
Have you ever dialed in a Plexi tone with the Axe that had that elusive top end, Thomas?
What you are hearing is output transformer high frequency resonance. Old Plexis didn't do this because they had good transformers. New transformers are crappy and resonate at the cutoff frequency because they are underdamped. This causes a raspy, fizzy texture to the distortion. The transformer resonance is adjustable but the parameter isn't exposed to the user. When you turn it up you get that same squishy rasp that you are hearing. For the Plexis I have the damping set to flat with no resonance because that's how our vintage Plexis measure. Our 50W is a little underdamped but people complain about raspy high frequencies so I erred on the safe side.
To eliminate most of the EQ differences, I matched the EQ with an Ozone plugin. This is the result:
https://instaud.io/VGx
It sounds very close, but there's still something in the Scorpion top end that's not there in the Fractal version. Can you hear the "squishing" that happens in the Scorpion clip? I know it's just a detail, but every real cranked Plexi clip I've heard has that squish or chirp. You can hear it in this clip, too:
Is there a way to make the Fractal Plexi top end response a bit more similar to the real world equivalents?
I've found the IR's do make a difference but haven't had much luck with the dynamic controls outside of dyn pres and dyn depth.Now they sound closer but as you say, the attack just isn´t there in the fractalversion. It sound a little more compressed. I guess you could tweak the dynamic preamp stuff but I really don´t like to have to dive in to much in those parameters. There is probably an easier way. I know that IR´s don´t have any dynamic life but sometimes they can bring out stuff like that because of some frquenzy or phase-behaviour