Confused about when/why to reset amp block - could use some help

Q

quark

Experienced
My understanding of presets and firmware is that the firmware does the processing of input signals via it's algorithms which can, in principle, be different with every firmware release. Presets on the other hand, are collections of parameters which customize exactly how the algorithm will do its processing for a given preset.

So when I load new firmware and run presets that were created with old firmware, my input signal will be processed by the new algorithms but they will be using parameters that were relevant to a previous firmware. These old parameters may not be ideal for the new firmware, may contain parameters which are no longer relevant to the new firmware or may be missing parameters which are relevant to the new firmware.

So when I reset an amp block, it sounds like I am bringing into my preset default parameters that are relevant to the new firmware. It also sounds like by doing that I might destroy the careful balance among all parameters that I had with the old preset and now, after the amp reset, I need to basically build the preset again.

Also, I would guess that resetting the amp block just brings in default parameters for that amp block and I doubt that many presets keep the amp block parameters at their default values. These default values may not bring out the intended character of the preset and so even these will probably need to be adjusted.

So, the question is, what is the purpose of just resetting the amp model? You still have to go back in and readjust other parameters just as if you had created a new preset from scratch.

Would like to hear how others view this and what their approach is to updating presets and resetting amp models.
 
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Resetting sets all the advanced amp block parameters to their new defaults. A lot of folks never touch any of the advanced parameters, and resetting is a quick way to ensure you've got the latest defaults selected. How much you'll need to tweak presets after an update will depend on what was changed in the update and how far you've strayed from the default settings. For a major update like Cygnus, you can expect to need more tweaking.
 
mr_fender said:
Resetting sets all the advanced amp block parameters to their new defaults. A lot of folks never touch any of the advanced parameters, and resetting is a quick way to ensure you've got the latest defaults selected. How much you'll need to tweak presets after an update will depend on what was changed in the update and how far you've strayed from the default settings. For a major update like Cygnus, you can expect to need more tweaking.
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Say I re-install my preset packs and load up the factory banks again after updating firmware, will any advanced parameters in the amp block of these presets be reset, or do I still have to go through each preset and do a soft reset on the amp block?
 
Purplestrats said:
Say I re-install my preset packs and load up the factory banks again after updating firmware, will any advanced parameters in the amp block of these presets be reset, or do I still have to go through each preset and do a soft reset on the amp block?
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A preset is a backup of settings... If you restore a preset it will have the same settings as when it was backed up.
 
And why can’t we have a “reset all amp blocks and keep all advanced parameters the same” -button? :)

I’m a bit of a newbie to this stuff. Even though I played an AX8 for years, I was just using 3 different presets and never updated anything. The Axe 3 is a whole new beast...
 
when a major amp update happens, i like to completely start from scratch on my amp tones. i'll try my presets as is, but i'm ready to just reset and dial in. every time this has happened, i got my desired tone faster, and with less adjustments.

let's say in firmware 1.xx, a Bass knob setting of 5 sounded boomy. so i would turn it down to 3. then i save the preset.
then i update to 2.xx, and let's say it makes the bass tighter and better. so now my setting of 3 has less bass than i want.

i would probably have to increase the Bass knob a bit to get the right amount of low end given the new amp modeling. let's say 6 is the new setting.

with this example, you can see that if i just reload my old preset, it will put the bass back to 3, which on this 2.xx firmware sounded too thin. reloading a preset just puts the paramters back to the values that were saved. it doesn't compensate for a change in sound in any way.

it was saved at 3, but now "3" sounds different because of the amp block changes. so if i reload my old preset, i'd have to adjust some things regardless.

this is a pretty general example and a bit exaggerated, but that's how i view what's happening. the number values might mean different things in a new firmware. 5 was bassy before, but it isn't now, or maybe there's more bass, etc.

as mentioned above too, various advanced parameters have new defaults that may sound better or intended to be used. that's why resetting or soft-resetting is recommended, so you start with those new defaults.

the axe doesn't automatically reset these because people may not want them to be forcibly changed. i believe the Axe2 did have an Amp Reset function a long time ago, but a lot of people... said a lot of things about it and i think the feature was removed.

the Axe3 has been very good about not changing settings with firmware updates, as many people requested that over the years. so we have the option to do so by selecting another amp, then back to the one we want - this is called a soft-reset when Ideal mode is selected.

perhaps with all the feedback gathered during this public beta, something will be figured out. but in general, if you update and it sounds good without making any changes, then it's good. if you want to try the default settings, you can with the soft-reset. this is a potentially major change depending on your specific presets, so if you're in the middle of a session or gig run, i would wait to update when it's done.
 
Thanks Chris, that makes sense. It almost sounded like presets made with previous firmwares would be using the old algorithms somehow. But a soft reset of the amp block just dials up the default settings for any advanced parameters (in ideal mode) then, and leaves basic settings however you had them before de-selecting/re-selecting your amp.
 
Purplestrats said:
Thanks Chris, that makes sense. It almost sounded like presets made with previous firmwares would be using the old algorithms somehow. But a soft reset of the amp block just dials up the default settings for any advanced parameters (in ideal mode) then, and leaves basic settings however you had them before de-selecting/re-selecting your amp.
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yup. to be more clear for others:

Ideal mode doesn't reset your Basic Bass Mid Treble, etc settings when you soft reset.
Authentic mode does reset those things.

both modes have Advanced Parameters reset when you soft-reset.

when you update firmware, the new algorithms are used always since that's all that's there due to the update. resetting or soft-resetting puts changes many things to new default settings which are the intended values for the new changes. it's optional to use them or not.
 
It would be helpful if FM3-Edit (don't know if Axe-Edit has one) had a menu item that let you save a textual representation of the settings in the patch. At the moment I have to create text files manually and write down every setting one by one and then copy\paste similar settings over and over. Having all the settings written down you can easily restore them if they're changed by an update
 
Akeron said:
It would be helpful if FM3-Edit (don't know if Axe-Edit has one) had a menu item that let you save a textual representation of the settings in the patch. At the moment I have to create text files manually and write down every setting one by one and then copy\paste similar settings over and over. Having all the settings written down you can easily restore them if they're changed by an update
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Or make pictures of the settings with your Mobile Phone.
 
Akeron said:
It would be helpful if FM3-Edit (don't know if Axe-Edit has one) had a menu item that let you save a textual representation of the settings in the patch. At the moment I have to create text files manually and write down every setting one by one and then copy\paste similar settings over and over. Having all the settings written down you can easily restore them if they're changed by an update
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FracTool can show you all the settings in a saved preset. I think it has the option to export them, too, but I don't recall for sure.
 
chris said:
Ideal mode doesn't reset your Basic Bass Mid Treble, etc settings when you soft reset.
Authentic mode does reset those things.

both modes have Advanced Parameters reset when you soft-reset.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. I forgot about that Global setting and was wondering why the tone stack kept resetting on me.
 
The Amp Resetter in Fractool gives you the option of determining which parameters to leave untouched and which will be updated to the new defaults that match the new algorithms in the firmware update. It also does it in batch mode. Really quite handy - for so many things.
 
I tried to do a soft reset of the Plexi, after changing the global setting mode to Ideal. A soft rest will rest the Input Drive, Bass, Mid, Treble to 5.
BEFORE REST:
Plexi Amp Ideal.png

AFTER RESET:
Plexi Amp After Reset.png
Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Thanks in advance for any help.
 
Joe.Buerger said:
I tried to do a soft reset of the Plexi, after changing the global setting mode to Ideal. A soft rest will rest the Input Drive, Bass, Mid, Treble to 5.
BEFORE REST:
View attachment 79345

AFTER RESET:
View attachment 79346
Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Thanks in advance for any help.
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i'd have to try it myself, that's how it used to work and how other's have described it on Cygnus.

are you certain you change the mode in Setup and not just clicked the Ideal tab in Edit? that's always available there regardless of the Setup choice.
 
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