Configuring at Axe-Fx 3 for wireless (e.g., differential line in on Input 2 "left")

+24dB is line.
+18dB is instrument.
-6dB is mic.
So I got the Shure QLXD and I wanted to make sure the level from the wireless going into the back input 1 was the same as the front. It seems like if I set the receiver to -18db the levels match. I'm just curious if anyone else has the same unit and if this is also how they had it set up. The only small concern I have is the manual states the receiver should have 3-4 bars on the input meter and typically it's 2-3 bars when set to -18db. But everything sounds fine at home levels. Just want to make sure I'm not setting up some kind of issue come show time.
 
I'm surprised, in passing, that wirelesses receivers don't also put out the guitar as S/PDIF, as that would be perfect for so many applications.
There are very expensive wireless receivers which output AES, they are more expensive than the Axe itself. Line 6 had a guitar wireless system that was advertised with AES output but they changed the specs and deleted the feature at the last minute before release.

IMHO, an AES or SPIDF outputting receiver would be the bees knees, but only if it means the A/D is at least as good as the one in the Axe. And how could you fit those components in a small transmitter pack? Then I guess there would be the clocking issue, you wouldn’t want the Axe or any other modeler syncing to the wireless receiver’s clock, unless it was a really good clock...I guess now I understand why the AES outputting wireless units are sooo expensive...:-(
 
There are very expensive wireless receivers which output AES, they are more expensive than the Axe itself. Line 6 had a guitar wireless system that was advertised with AES output but they changed the specs and deleted the feature at the last minute before release.

IMHO, an AES or SPIDF outputting receiver would be the bees knees, but only if it means the A/D is at least as good as the one in the Axe. And how could you fit those components in a small transmitter pack? Then I guess there would be the clocking issue, you wouldn’t want the Axe or any other modeler syncing to the wireless receiver’s clock, unless it was a really good clock...I guess now I understand why the AES outputting wireless units are sooo expensive...:-(
The high end shure ones are expensive enough. Very reliable though from all I’ve read. I guess I’ll see for myself. I think in a live situation any degradation from the ADA of the Shure wouldn’t be noticeable by even those with great ears.
 
The high end shure ones are expensive enough. Very reliable though from all I’ve read. I guess I’ll see for myself. I think in a live situation any degradation from the ADA of the Shure wouldn’t be noticeable by even those with great ears.
Maybe true if the wireless is only used for live and you never bother adjusting your sound at the gig.

However, most people with wireless don’t use them only for live, they almost certainly will use them at rehearsal or at home, tweaking parameters all the while and having to compensate for their sound. Then having to compensate again when they go back in the studio and plugging a guitar straight into the Axe.

In a live situation there is also the added latency of that final D/A conversion in analog out receivers, then you add the latency of the new DSP laden wedges you may own or that are installed in the venue at your gig.

I won’t go wireless until there’s an affordable digital out sufficiently transparent enough that I won’t have to adjust all my presets again for the studio.
 
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Maybe true if the wireless is only used for live and you never bother adjusting your sound at the gig.

However, most people with wireless don’t use them only for live, they almost certainly will use them at rehearsal or at home, tweaking parameters all the while and having to compensate for their sound. Then having to compensate again when they go back in the studio and plugging a guitar straight into the Axe.

In a live situation there is also the added latency of that final D/A conversion in analog out receivers, then you add the latency of the new DSP laden wedges you may own or that are installed in the venue at your gig.

I won’t go wireless until there’s an affordable digital out sufficiently transparent enough that I won’t have to adjust all my presets again for the studio.
The shure QLXD says 2.9ms of latency. The Axe is 1ms. I don’t think an extra 3.9ms is making or breaking anyone.

I don’t use the same presets to record as I do live so that’s not an issue. I’d think most people wouldn’t but maybe I’m mistaken.
 
In case anyone in the MI business is listening, I consider anything under 2k affordable for a high quality guitar specific wireless that outputs digitally. That’s why I suggested elsewhere on this forum that Cliff might be uniquely able to design the best possible solution. If he could put a high quality converter and the analog input circuitry of the Axe guitar input into a transmitter, with a digitally outputting receiver that could clock optimally with the Axe, I bet he’d sell a lot. I could even see people buying a FAS wireless system then getting an Axe just because it would be a very tidy integrated system for live performance.
 
The shure QLXD says 2.9ms of latency. The Axe is 1ms. I don’t think an extra 3.9ms is making or breaking anyone.

I don’t use the same presets to record as I do live so that’s not an issue. I’d think most people wouldn’t but maybe I’m mistaken.
It may not make or break anyone, but it will affect the way you play whether you know it or not. If you add the DSP in most current monitors, its probably 5+ ms for a wireless and modeler system.

A big part of why I committed to the Axe is how much easier it makes live performance: minimal weight, footprint and much more reliability. Part of that convenience and reliability is being able to create sounds that translate between home, rehearsal, stage and studio. Any time I can shave off tweaking sounds can be spent on playing and music.

If you have good monitors at home, good FR wedges at rehearsal, which you may or may not bring to the gig, you stand a good chance of being able to get sounds at home on your own time that translate well enough in all situations so all you need to do at any given moment is adjust your volume. That’s the goal, and I think it’s a realistic one. If a band like Metallica, who have enough money to do whatever they want, use the Axe, obviously it’s possible to achieve great consistent results in all situations. At their ages, I’m sure those guys are as tired of fiddling with gear as I am...
 
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Wireless guitar units are a fairly niche market within a niche market within a niche market. Not every guitarist wants a wireless, not every person interested in wireless units is a guitarist, and not every sound guy or audio designer wants a wireless guitar. So it falls under so many requirements in the Music and Audio industry as to make it more economical for companies to use the same tech for much higher in demand wireless mics for wireless guitars. That is most likely why companies are adverse to wireless units with digital out, in addition to a greater number devices in the most current live audio environments still using the ubiquitous XLR and 1/4 inch connections. Using XLR and 1/4 inch TRS and TS makes the units easier to sell to a wide market.

And if noise is a concern then there may be more in the environment around that needs addressing for those noise issues. I do a lot of work in a venue with a radio/cellular tower about 100 yards away, and while it is a headache to dial in wireless frequencies, once they are dialed in I do not experience greater noise through my cabling. And I understand every noise environment is different with it’s owns issues.

On the latency front, the only thing that could minimize it is a cable straight to the Axe with the AES out to a dedicated monitor with an AES in. Most venues use digital boards which will introduce latency into the signal as well, which would appear in the monitors and the mains, but with listening positions and human ability to perceive latency, it is not humanly detectable for the audience. With latency discussions I feel like the mixer’s aspect is often overlooked. Latency is everywhere, but it is getting better as tech progresses. And it could be “felt“ but there is still debate as to how that effects the player, because there are numerous variables to those systems.

With sounds dialed across venues, a good sound should sound good in any venue and be able to be dialed in for general use in my opinion. Well it may not always be perfect, it will sound hopefully 99% there. I think of it like the masters of most music. It has to be mixed and mastered to sound good on every system including phones, TV‘s, laptops, audiophile headphones, cars, expensive home systems, studio monitors, everything. It will not sound exactly like the record studio’s monitor system, but it will still sound like the mix and that is the goal of mixing and mastering. The commercial preset packs for the Axe are a good example, they are made with different players, guitars, and listening systems in mind and come across very well on multiple systems. Also some people just enjoy making different patches because it‘s fun for them! I know I like to sit down and make a new patch, especially when I am in a playing rut and want a new sound to play with!
 
Wireless guitar units are a fairly niche market within a niche market within a niche market. Not every guitarist wants a wireless, not every person interested in wireless units is a guitarist, and not every sound guy or audio designer wants a wireless guitar. So it falls under so many requirements in the Music and Audio industry as to make it more economical for companies to use the same tech for much higher in demand wireless mics for wireless guitars. That is most likely why companies are adverse to wireless units with digital out, in addition to a greater number devices in the most current live audio environments still using the ubiquitous XLR and 1/4 inch connections. Using XLR and 1/4 inch TRS and TS makes the units easier to sell to a wide market.

On the latency front, the only thing that could minimize it is a cable straight to the Axe with the AES out to a dedicated monitor with an AES in. Most venues use digital boards which will introduce latency into the signal as well, which would appear in the monitors and the mains, but with listening positions and human ability to perceive latency, it is not humanly detectable for the audience. With latency discussions I feel like the mixer’s aspect is often overlooked. Latency is everywhere, but it is getting better as tech progresses. And it could be “felt“ but there is still debate as to how that effects the player, because there are numerous variables to those systems.
I doubt anyone thinks every guitarist will want a wireless system, that’s not my point. But more people will want them when they are improved and have fewer drawbacks. And those improvements will be made by people who are technically able and financially motivated to. Industry standards are often the result of one person or small company innovating and pushing standards higher. 10 years ago, I could not have dreamed a small company like FAS would make my entire refrigerator rack obsolete.

Latency is something you fight against, with digital audio it’s an inevitable part of all our lives. You cannot eliminate latency entirely, but you can try to reduce it to whatever degree you reasonably can. For me, that means using studio and stage monitors with analog crossovers, no wireless, and recording AES out. Whatever latency happens in FOH is not something I can reasonably hope to control. I am only concerned with how I and others hear me onstage or during live tracking in a studio. For me the latency battle is one of inches, not all or nothing.
 
I doubt anyone thinks every guitarist will want a wireless system, that’s not my point. But more people will want them when they are improved and have fewer drawbacks. And those improvements will be made by people who are technically able and financially motivated to. Industry standards are often the result of one person or small company innovating and pushing standards higher. 10 years ago, I could not have dreamed a small company like FAS would make my entire refrigerator rack obsolete.

Latency is something you fight against, with digital audio it’s an inevitable part of all our lives. You cannot eliminate latency entirely, but you can try to reduce it to whatever degree you reasonably can. For me, that means using studio and stage monitors with analog crossovers, no wireless, and recording AES out. Whatever latency happens in FOH is not something I can reasonably hope to control. I am only concerned with how I and others hear me onstage or during live tracking in a studio. For me the latency battle is one of inches, not all or nothing.
Wireless will develop further and get better, it too is a slow climb, especially in this world of growing wireless devices. But with all of that development, so too will new wireless units.

On the latency side, I personally choose the control, ease, and convenience of digital and accept the whatever latency there may be. Oftentimes there are other parts live that would effect me more than the latency anyway. And almost everywhere I play I use IEM’s and can’t run a floor monitor. But I think it is a great sound, and don’t feel any latency myself. Especially with the IEM’s, I don’t feel latency in those. In recording I direct monitor off of the Axe to studio monitors.

But part of the beauty of the Axe Fx is the ability to use it in so many various ways!
 
Wireless will develop further and get better, it too is a slow climb, especially in this world of growing wireless devices. But with all of that development, so too will new wireless units.

On the latency side, I personally choose the control, ease, and convenience of digital and accept the whatever latency there may be. Oftentimes there are other parts live that would effect me more than the latency anyway. And almost everywhere I play I use IEM’s and can’t run a floor monitor. But I think it is a great sound, and don’t feel any latency myself. Especially with the IEM’s, I don’t feel latency in those. In recording I direct monitor off of the Axe to studio monitors.

But part of the beauty of the Axe Fx is the ability to use it in so many various ways!
Good for you that you can take advantage of all those digital perks, I envy you. But for some of us who need acoustic coupling with a speaker for feedback of all types, IEMs are not an option. Most of my music is instrumental with some dense playing, which means accuracy is particularly important for myself, the other players and ultimately the audience. With the time it takes to write and rehearse things to performance standards, I definitely don’t need any extra challenges..:)
 
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