Compact gig-able amp ideas...?

P

Paultergeist

Inspired
Greetings,

This has probably been covered previously, but I am not finding this answer in particular. I am wondering if the following idea might work:

Use a small, solid-state power amp (I am looking at the Seymour Duncan Power Block 170) along with an existing 2 x 12 guitar cabinet I own as a “amp” set-up for those situations where I would need to show up with a more traditional amp.....? I am trying to stream-line the amount of of gear I need to acquire in order to test-drive an AX8 and create a functional set-up for myself.

I wonder if anyone has tried this or a similar approach?

Thanks very much for any insights.
 
I have used the EHX 44 Magnum power amp and a 1x12 for this purpose. Works great if we are talking a small club or bar.
 
Paultergeist said:
Greetings,

This has probably been covered previously, but I am not finding this answer in particular. I am wondering if the following idea might work:

Use a small, solid-state power amp (I am looking at the Seymour Duncan Power Block 170) along with an existing 2 x 12 guitar cabinet I own as a “amp” set-up for those situations where I would need to show up with a more traditional amp.....? I am trying to stream-line the amount of of gear I need to acquire in order to test-drive an AX8 and create a functional set-up for myself.

I wonder if anyone has tried this or a similar approach?

Thanks very much for any insights.
Click to expand...
I picked up a 1x12 cabinet on craigslist, installed an Eminence Speaker Beta 12CX with the ASD1001 driver, fabricated a new back panel to the cabinet for the Dayton PMA800DSP power amp. I only carry the AX8 and the Cabinet.
You can also pick up a FRFR from Xitone or Atomic etc - either way it is down to 2 small pieces of gear
 
Honestly one of the things that for me are not perfectly emulated is the power amp tube sound.

Going straight to an FRFR sounds good and convincing enough, but, when you hear your AX8 into a real tube power amp you can clearly hear a difference (I can).

So, after a lot of setups, my best (and actually cheaper than any good FRFR) yet is to buy an used Fender Hot Rod Deluxe and plug the AX8 directly to the “Power Amp In”.

So, your setup gets super simple: AX8 and HRD. Done! :)

Try it! You will not believe how good this setup is. You can try that on any guitar store since the HRD is super common everywhere.

But remember, turn off cab sim and power amp sim. :)
 
You might also consider a product like the Matrix GM-50, if you'd like to integrate a lightweight, clean power amp into your existing speaker cabinet.

http://usa.matrixamplification.com/amplifier-modules/gm-50.html

gm50_main_1.jpg
 
bsas said:
Honestly one of the things that for me are not perfectly emulated is the power amp tube sound.

Going straight to an FRFR sounds good and convincing enough, but, when you hear your AX8 into a real tube power amp you can clearly hear a difference (I can).

So, after a lot of setups, my best (and actually cheaper than any good FRFR) yet is to buy an used Fender Hot Rod Deluxe and plug the AX8 directly to the “Power Amp In”.

So, your setup gets super simple: AX8 and HRD. Done! :)

Try it! You will not believe how good this setup is. You can try that on any guitar store since the HRD is super common everywhere.

But remember, turn off cab sim and power amp sim. :)
Click to expand...
I suspect what you like is more the cab in the room vs the sound of a mic'd speaker (that you hear via FRFR) rather than the difference between a modeled power amp and solid state power vs a tube power amp.
 
bsas said:
Honestly one of the things that for me are not perfectly emulated is the power amp tube sound.

Going straight to an FRFR sounds good and convincing enough, but, when you hear your AX8 into a real tube power amp you can clearly hear a difference (I can).

So, after a lot of setups, my best (and actually cheaper than any good FRFR) yet is to buy an used Fender Hot Rod Deluxe and plug the AX8 directly to the “Power Amp In”.

So, your setup gets super simple: AX8 and HRD. Done! :)

Try it! You will not believe how good this setup is. You can try that on any guitar store since the HRD is super common everywhere.

But remember, turn off cab sim and power amp sim. :)
Click to expand...

What is the difference between going into the "Power Amp In" instead of one of the inputs, especially since you're turning off cab sim and power amp sim?
 
unix-guy said:
I suspect what you like is more the cab in the room vs the sound of a mic'd speaker (that you hear via FRFR) rather than the difference between a modeled power amp and solid state power vs a tube power amp.
Click to expand...

That is correct and I totally agree!
When I record at home, I just use the AX8 directly to my interface and it sounds great.

My issue is with the FRFR sound vs "cab in the room" sound. But, I also tested solid state flat power amps (like the recommended Matrix GM-50) and I still feel a lot better with a tube power amp. I tried all combinations of solid state / tube power amp / FRFR and with cab sim and power amp sim on/off.

I tested fancy tube power amps like the Fryette Power Station too. It sounds better, but, the difference between it and the HRD was, at least for me, negligible... I still keep my Friette Power Station because that thing is AWESOME! But, for practically and price/performance nothing bets the HRD for me.

So, for me, the simplest and most effective solution is this:
- Record: AX8 direct to interface with power amp and cab sim on: AWESOME! I can't hear the difference between this and my tube amp mic.
- Play: AX8 into the "power amp in" of the Hot Rod Deluxe with cab sim and power amp sim off.

That is it. :D
 
ax8guitarist said:
What is the difference between going into the "Power Amp In" instead of one of the inputs, especially since you're turning off cab sim and power amp sim?
Click to expand...

blues_freak already answered that perfectly.

Simply put, the "Amp" block on Fractal is basically a "Preamp" emulator. The HRD is famous/infamous because of it's preamp (specially it's "high gain" section). Going directly to the "Power Amp In" you are ignoring that. The preamp colors the sound A LOT (for the worse sometimes)!

So, basically you can think of your AX8 as a collection of preamps and pedals, and the HRD "power amp" as just a 40W 6L6 power amp and a 1x12 cab with whatever speaker you have into it (I love V30's on mine). Also, the HRD reverb still works, so, another thing you can do is disable/remove the "reverb" block from your AX8 to save a lot of CPU :D
 
bsas said:
That is correct and I totally agree!
When I record at home, I just use the AX8 directly to my interface and it sounds great.

My issue is with the FRFR sound vs "cab in the room" sound. But, I also tested solid state flat power amps (like the recommended Matrix GM-50) and I still feel a lot better with a tube power amp. I tried all combinations of solid state / tube power amp / FRFR and with cab sim and power amp sim on/off.

I tested fancy tube power amps like the Fryette Power Station too. It sounds better, but, the difference between it and the HRD was, at least for me, negligible... I still keep my Friette Power Station because that thing is AWESOME! But, for practically and price/performance nothing bets the HRD for me.

So, for me, the simplest and most effective solution is this:
- Record: AX8 direct to interface with power amp and cab sim on: AWESOME! I can't hear the difference between this and my tube amp mic.
- Play: AX8 into the "power amp in" of the Hot Rod Deluxe with cab sim and power amp sim off.

That is it. :D
Click to expand...
Just to be clear, this means you're happy with only using that one (real) cab for everything, as well as only getting the poweramp "coloring" from the same tube amp. Not saying it's bad, but it won't be very authentic depending on the Amp model you use.
 
unix-guy said:
Just to be clear, this means you're happy with only using that one (real) cab for everything, as well as only getting the poweramp "coloring" from the same tube amp. Not saying it's bad, but it won't be very authentic depending on the Amp model you use.
Click to expand...

Yes, that is correct!
But, for recording, I still have all the flexibility in of the power amp sim and cab sim :D
 
All,

I just want to express my sincere gratitude for the insights and opinions expressed in response to my initial query. I am learning a lot and gaining additional perspective from reading all of your responses.

Thanks very much to all!
 
bsas said:
blues_freak already answered that perfectly.

Simply put, the "Amp" block on Fractal is basically a "Preamp" emulator. The HRD is famous/infamous because of it's preamp (specially it's "high gain" section). Going directly to the "Power Amp In" you are ignoring that. The preamp colors the sound A LOT (for the worse sometimes)!

So, basically you can think of your AX8 as a collection of preamps and pedals, and the HRD "power amp" as just a 40W 6L6 power amp and a 1x12 cab with whatever speaker you have into it (I love V30's on mine). Also, the HRD reverb still works, so, another thing you can do is disable/remove the "reverb" block from your AX8 to save a lot of CPU :D
Click to expand...

So you're going out of the AX8 like you would for any amp, but instead of plugging into the traditional "Input", you're plugging into the "Power Amp In" on the HRD, correct?
 
ax8guitarist said:
So you're going out of the AX8 like you would for any amp, but instead of plugging into the traditional "Input", you're plugging into the "Power Amp In" on the HRD, correct?
Click to expand...

Correct. You can plug to the input too to hear the difference if you are curious, nothing will burn. :)

Just beware that the AX8 signal is quite strong (line level) so adjust the volume accordingly to avoid overdrive the power amp.
 
bsas said:
Correct. You can plug to the input too to hear the difference if you are curious, nothing will burn. :)

Just beware that the AX8 signal is quite strong (line level) so adjust the volume accordingly to avoid overdrive the power amp.
Click to expand...

Cool. Thanks for the help!
 
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