Can someone help explain this to me? Losing my mind again here.

So I normally ignore any other AFX recordings and just stick to my own couple of presets that work decently for me, but the moment I go check out anything from any of the FAS celebrities, I'm slapped in the face with "holy cow, THAT'S how it's sounding for other people?" It can get really demoralizing.

Like for example, I LOVE the rhythm tone this Cooper Carter gentleman has at 10:17 of this video:



Tight, crunchy, beefy, has that scratchy "chock chock" presence to the palm mutes - it's ALIVE. So I find the same preset, adjust the amp to the one he's using in the video, copy his amp settings, EQ and IRs, and here's how a simple rhythm riff sounds on my end:



You'd have a very hard time convincing me those are at all similar preset settings, let alone the same one.

So my simple question is: why such a huge difference? Do people like this who demonstrate presets do extra mixing and producing to make it sound more "polished" than the preset actually is? Is he using a different signal chain not mentioned in the video? My clip was played through an Ltd H-1001 with a SD Pegasus bridge, but I found no more success with my BKP Juggernaut or my SD Custom. Am I just using terrible pickups for that kind of metal tone?

Help please, I really don't get it.

Guitar and pickups play such a huge role! Not to mention hands!
 
Louder, different player, different guitar, quieter might be not be coming direct out of the axe but into outboard gear like a mixer. There could be lots of reasons it sounds different but thats where I would start.
 
What Coop says about the pick gets glossed over a lot, but it’s a big deal with tone. Try a thinner pick to brighten the edge on the attack. You’ll be shocked at the difference in some presets. Great point, @Cooper Carter!

I guess I haven't changed my pick in a while... I only use 1.0mm, what would you recommend?
 
Your clips sound a bit more tubby in the low end. Your guitars are probably just more bass heavy than his Majesty in the video. Try pushing the Low cut frequency up in the Input EQ section of the amp block to around 80 or 100 Hz or so to help tame the low end going into the amp. Should tighten it right up.

I frequently have to do that with with my Les Paul to tighten things up. She's a bit well endowed in the low end too.
 
I guess I haven't changed my pick in a while... I only use 1.0mm, what would you recommend?
I have an assortment from very thick (essentially inflexible) to very thin (almost papery). You hear it most clearly on acoustic playing, but it is apparent on electric as well. I was using some 1.14 Dunlops and liked them but noticed how much brighter a swap to a regular Fender style medium or thin was. lt’s been a help to have an assortment of shapes and thicknesses available since that revelation.
 
Huge fan of your playing, and I'd agree if it was something more I was comparing than a few chords being played, but I can't see those causing a drastic difference in this case. Sometimes that feels like someone saying "distortion is in the fingers" when my 5150 is broken.
Im gonna try the preset later and see what I get! Did you check your Global EQ?
 
Im gonna try the preset later and see what I get! Did you check your Global EQ?

I did! I've think it might just be the pickups the more I analyze it, I can make them sound good, but then when I hear someone else's, I realize how small and characterless they sound (in my opinion). Researching them a bit more, that seems to be a common complaint for these pickups. And after playing around with my two other guitars for a bit longer, they don't seem nearly as bad and bring some excitement to the preset with some minor adjustments - which is kind of what should be the case.

I dunno, it's been a rough day, I'll come back to it tomorrow but that's probably it. Sorry for ranting, everyone.
 
Ernie Ball-Music Man pickups are pretty hot. At least the one's that I have tried. My Axis guitars are similar in output as my EMG equipped guitar, But more tonally balanced to me. The EMGs have a lot of upper mids.
 
Ernie Ball-Music Man pickups are pretty hot. At least the one's that I have tried. My Axis guitars are similar in output as my EMG equipped guitar, But more tonally balanced to me. The EMGs have a lot of upper mids.
Yes and no. The Mariposa and Stingray Pickups are more Vintage output like. The Pickups in my Luke are hot, like the Dimarzios in the Axis.

But yeah, to me the main difference is the guitar.
The Mariposa with the EBMM Pickups sound just glorious.
More open, transparent and crisp sounding. The Clip is very good example of that.
 
It's the difference between your guitar / pickups and his.

I have to dial in presets for the specific guitar I'll be using. If I use a different guitar than the one I dialed the preset in with it will not sound the same. Sometimes a little off, sometimes way off.
 
The biggest reason, (and I'm not just saying this because over there on the left) is you're not using the same guitar. I have it, and my tone sounds pretty much the same, except for how it comes across in my headphones because I don't play at that volume level. When I first heard your clip, before I watched the video to see what you were referring to, right away I thought: PU's.

The Majesty has a 20dB boost, with the amount of boost adjustable with a trim pot, which could be in play. One of the things that constantly puts a smile on my face is the harmonics that guitar produces.
And this preset wasn't done with Cygnus. (Although with Cygnus, it should sound even better.)

But I'm with you on the hands not being the reason here. That's a very easy riff to replicate, and based on your clip, I'm guessing if JP himself handed you his guitar and you played the opening rhythm riff to Pull Me Under through his rig, it'd sound exactly the same, or at least close enough that you wouldn't be asking yourself, "How am I playing this differently, because it doesn't sound the same?"
 
Dude I actually like your tone a lot more than Cooper's.Increase level as everybody said said and maybe just add a lil bit more presence or engage bright switch with a tiny pf if you haven't already, that add's some life in many cases.

Maybe also add a M.comp for more popping palm mutes.

Never compare preset tones unless you using exact same gear with same settings, firmware etc.
 
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This is strange to mention for me, because my guitar signal strength was vastly weaker than his, and I A/B'd with a similar guitar with the same pickups. I couldn't even touch his preamp gain levels. I came to my own conclusion that he was boosting it or cranking input trim, but I can see that not being the case. So now I'm even more confused.
And PU's have more differences than just signal strength. The EQ, & how far they are from the strings and the bridge also give different sound characteristics.
 
The biggest reason, (and I'm not just saying this because over there on the left) is you're not using the same guitar. I have it, and my tone sounds pretty much the same, except for how it comes across in my headphones because I don't play at that volume level. When I first heard your clip, before I watched the video to see what you were referring to, right away I thought: PU's.

The Majesty has a 20dB boost, with the amount of boost adjustable with a trim pot, which could be in play. One of the things that constantly puts a smile on my face is the harmonics that guitar produces.
And this preset wasn't done with Cygnus. (Although with Cygnus, it should sound even better.)

But I'm with you on the hands not being the reason here. That's a very easy riff to replicate, and based on your clip, I'm guessing if JP himself handed you his guitar and you played the opening rhythm riff to Pull Me Under through his rig, it'd sound exactly the same, or at least close enough that you wouldn't be asking yourself, "How am I playing this differently, because it doesn't sound the same?"

This is really helpful, thank you for giving an in-depth response. I need to get my hands on something with that type of tone, I'm gonna starting my look into higher output ceramics with some extra grease behind them. If you know the specific pickups, let me know!

Also thank you for not telling me "it's because you're terrible, and your hands are useless arm ornaments" or something like that.
 
Also consider wood, hardware, meassurements and strings as parts of the equation. Thick necks with an 1 11/16 or 43mm nut sound bigger compared to thin ones with a 1 5/8 or 42mm nut. It's not much, but it's there.
Bigger string gauges make the tone bigger.
Hard wood and goid hardware will give you more stable highs and mids.
So besides the pickups, they can't fix everything, a big neck, good woods, good quality hardware and using bigger strings make a stable and fat and direct tone. Everything comes with a price though :-(
 
This is really helpful, thank you for giving an in-depth response. I need to get my hands on something with that type of tone, I'm gonna starting my look into higher output ceramics with some extra grease behind them. If you know the specific pickups, let me know!

Also thank you for not telling me "it's because you're terrible, and your hands are useless arm ornaments" or something like that.
Lol! Yeah sure, no problem. Glad to try to help.
The specific PU's in that Majesty are Dimarzio Dreamcatcher (bridge) & Rainmaker.

Just keep in mind, slapping those into your guitar still may not get you where you want to be for other reasons stated. For example, Petrucci says he can tell the difference between cables! And I'm not talking about the difference between a cheap, high-capacitance cable, using non-active PU's, and a high-quality cable. Plus EBMM makes Majesties using basswood bodies that also sound a bit different, but I can't tell the difference when I hear him playing one vs. the other.

So the point is, the differences start to become more subtle. But I have no idea how much closer you'd get to that tight, chuck chuck, sound you're talking about, by trying those PU's. Also, they have electrical connector clips on them (at least in the Majesty; maybe they don't sell them that way...?), but I suppose you could just cut them off if required. (Just want you to be aware of that possibility, in case you may plan to buy them and return them if they don't do the trick.)

Or, I have to say it, you could just buy a Majesty. ;) :guitar: (How many is that now? LOL) I have 2, I love them that much!

Oh, and did anyone ask what you're monitoring with? That also makes a big difference. Someone else would have to weigh in on how much that contributes to getting that tight, percussive palm mute, or whether it's more of how the AF3 faithfully reproduces various amp tones. Whichever, the speakers need to be flat response.

Edit: One other thing I thought of, since PU location definitely matters... in the Majesty, the center of the PU's from the end of the G string are 1-13/16 and 5-1/32. I'd make sure you can get pretty close to those dimensions before I'd drop a couple hundred bucks on new PU's.
 
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Dude I actually like your tone a lot more than Cooper's.Increase level as everybody said said and maybe just add a lil bit more presence or engage bright switch with a tiny pf if you haven't already, that add's some life in many cases.

Maybe also add a M.comp for more popping palm mutes.

Never compare preset tones unless you using exact same gear with same settings, firmware etc.

Same. Cooper is a monster, and it is not meant as a slight to him. Just to me that tone is
really too sandpapery and abrasive. OP's clip sounds better to me, but not to him. And so
it goes in the tonequest. :)
 
Same. Cooper is a monster, and it is not meant as a slight to him. Just to me that tone is
really too sandpapery and abrasive. OP's clip sounds better to me, but not to him. And so
it goes in the tonequest. :)

I think the lessons I'm learning here is that
1. Pickups and guitar matter a TON, and I think it's downplayed a lot on here. Even though I can tweak the heck out of my axe and get things close to where I want them to be if I need to, the right pickups/guitar for the job (and my ears) will get me there much quicker.

2. While others seem to enjoy my unaltered tone using that preset, I'm learning that I really don't like this bridge pickup and the tones it brings. I haven't had much good luck with chunky abrasive ceramics in the past, but hearing others play them keeps making me want to give them another shot.

Either way, in hindsight this probably should've been a Lounge post about pickups, because that seems to be the consensus difference.
 
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