Bundles are the new black!

Manny Fufish said:
I've never technically understood the idea that presets need to be built up specifically for each user []
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People play differently, so that the exact same gear set up the exact same way will sound entirely different. David Curcurito tells a story (excerpted here from an Esquire article)...

It's all in the fingers, man. [Eddie] tells a story about when the band first hit. Van Halen was opening for Ted Nugent back in 1978 at the Capital Centre. Ted was cool enough to give the band a sound check. He's standing off to the side and he's listening to me, and he comes up and says,"Hey, you little shit! Where's your little magic black box?" I'm going, Who the fuck is that? And it was Ted. Hey Ted, it's nice to meet you, thanks for the sound check. And he's going, "Let me play your guitar!" I go, "Okay, here you go." He starts playing my guitar and it sounds like Ted. He yells,"You just removed your little black box, didn't you? Where is it? What did you do?" I go, "I didn't do anything!" So I play, and it sounds like me. He says, "Here, play my guitar!" I play his big old guitar and it sounds just like me. He's going, "You little shit!" What I'm trying to say is I am the best at doing me. Nobody else can do me better than me.
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I'm certainly no Eddie or Ted, but I get the same thing here when people come over and want to play my rig. A preset that works great for me will sound all sorts of wrong when someone else uses it. How you pick and/or strum, your legato/vibrato technique, the way you hammer/tap/pull, where you set the dreaded knobs/switches on the guitar, etc. all change the signal going into the rig, which responds accordingly.
 
I bought the bronze and I'm a fan of the concept .that said with the conversion rate it cost me $60 australian . def the top end of what I would pay . there's no way I would go for the higher teirs .

did I need it ? not really I can make my own patches .But I like the idea of a pretty much ready to go sound for when I'm just looking for something Sometimes . I enjoy just drinking a beer or 3 and trying a few sounds when I just want to play and not tweak much .And I think they are better than the factory presets . there's lots I'll never use but damn how many IR's do people have that they have never tried once in the cab packs ?

I still havent gone through it all but I've found more than enough to make it worthwhile . would I buy another pack ? it would have to have some impressive things I really wanted. I'd much rather buy on a per speaker or per amp basis
 
I you feel like buying them, then go ahead. If you don't then don't.
I think buying Coke a Cola and the like is a waste, personally. I drink water.
Buy if you want to spend 1.50+ to drink something that will contribute to both getting yourself even more overweight and certainly contribution to diabetes, and a host of other reasons not to, well hell, knock yourself out.

It is totally a matter of personal choice. You are all correct here..... For yourself.
Peace
 
I'd like to clarify a few things here, as from what Ive read there are a few people that dislike this idea, and that's fine.. you cant please everybody all of the time.

What is a Preset.. well a preset is just that.. a pre-set based on your set sound, for your speakers, your guitar and song/style - its a personal thing. you set your effects, levels, gain range and EQ, your ducking the flange amount etc etc..this will not translate well to someone else playing a different song/genre & guitar.. or at least not to the mass amount.

In my mind a "Preset" is something specific for a specific thing/sound/vibe whatever you want to call it.

The ones I created for Platinum Bundles etc are not that, this is well documented in various topics, that I did not create "presets" I created a "Package" an "Amp with a matching speaker" or label this whatever you want. - its suppost to be a one click solution to a Amp+IR that's setup perfectly balanced in terms of amp+cab, and likewise (As documented again) its not science what I did with the choice of amp with the speaker, in fact I highlighted that this was my own choice wrongly or rightly, but it sounded good so that's what matters.. IT takes the HIT and MISS Ratio out of the equation for everyone.

Did it take me 8 hours as someone suggested per each preset, no. but it did still take a long time before building it, pairing, listening, adjusting. capturing, building, then scoping the speaker for freq ranges to match the amp, so who knows maybe 8 hours in total!. - a LOT of work went into them. I wanted to assure people that I gave them solid foundation to work upon.. and hey, if they liked it right off the bat, then that's great!. - you don't need to get to technical with the axe.. all my "presets" were ridiculously basic in design. amp+cab+verb and sometimes a few others... and I think out of the 450+ I did 2 or 3 with full effects for fun!.

It saddens me that IR vendors create a LOT of IR's and spent time at creation for them to get lost and ignore overtime because people get overwhelemd/confused/lost...., - this is a solid way, of getting to know them, using them, and using them correctly as they were meant to be too. - plus it helps a lot of folks out who don't know how to build chains, or fancy IR's they struggle and this will be perfect for them.. - I don't expect Season Fractal experts to jump in and to find them spectacular, that was not my target audience (although I welcome anyone & everyone)

A "Preset" will either work or it wont. - Some of these that I did wont work for a lot of people, but they will also work for Many too!. - but the bottom line still remains...

They have a great solid work platform they can build upon. - and that's important to a lot & also important to me.
Its important that if you want to dial up a quick amp that your not familiar with for a client, song recording session, its there, already matched, that you can treat like a real amp and adjust the controls. - THATS the point. THAT'S what I was aiming for.

Im not here to convince anybody, ive been around long enough not to fight or worship, but to simply express clarity in a confusing topic as this has become.

Be well all.
A
 
TheAmpFactory said:
...a one click solution to a Amp+IR that's setup perfectly balanced in terms of amp+cab, and likewise (As documented again) its not science what I did with the choice of amp with the speaker, in fact I highlighted that this was my own choice wrongly or rightly, but it sounded good so that's what matters.. IT takes the HIT and MISS Ratio out of the equation for everyone.

Did it take me 8 hours as someone suggested per each preset, no. but it did still take a long time before building it, pairing, listening, adjusting. capturing, building, then scoping the speaker for freq ranges to match the amp, so who knows maybe 8 hours in total!. - a LOT of work went into them. I wanted to assure people that I gave them solid foundation to work upon.. and hey, if they liked it right off the bat, then that's great!. - you don't need to get to technical with the axe.. all my "presets" were ridiculously basic in design. amp+cab+verb and sometimes a few others... and I think out of the 450+ I did 2 or 3 with full effects for fun!.

It saddens me that IR vendors create a LOT of IR's and spent time at creation for them to get lost and ignore overtime because people get overwhelemd/confused/lost...., - this is a solid way, of getting to know them, using them, and using them correctly as they were meant to be too. - plus it helps a lot of folks out who don't know how to build chains, or fancy IR's they struggle and this will be perfect for them.. - I don't expect Season Fractal experts to jump in and to find them spectacular, that was not my target audience (although I welcome anyone & everyone)

A "Preset" will either work or it wont. - Some of these that I did wont work for a lot of people, but they will also work for Many too!. - but the bottom line still remains...

They have a great solid work platform they can build upon. - and that's important to a lot & also important to me.
Its important that if you want to dial up a quick amp that your not familiar with for a client, song recording session, its there, already matched, that you can treat like a real amp and adjust the controls. - THATS the point. THAT'S what I was aiming for...
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Ok, I'm up for a try... Which bundle gets me a toe in the water for Fender 'Sultans' to Marshall 'AC/DC'?
 
lqdsnddist said:
Question though as I see it, both with the the factory presets, user stuff, commercial 3rd party stuff et al., is what is a perfectly matched amp/cab ?

I think a Bassman 4x10 is probably the "right" cab for a Bassman head, but I've never liked that sound. I always paired my real Bassman amps with Greenback loaded 4x12's.

Likewise, a V30 loaded Marshall cab is consider ideal by a lot of folks to go with an Marshall style amp, but again, I simply never liked V30's and as such never used them in anything. I ran G12H Creambacks in mine.

In my Deluxe Reverb I never used the Jensen speaker, preferring Alnico Blues or Eminence speakers.

Its not to say my pairings were more right, nor more wrong, than what some others liked, but simply were my taste.

Heck, now with the Axe, I'm actually using some of the Cab Pack 7 V30 loaded cabs with my Tuscana patches, and even on some cleaner stuff. Is that correctly paired ? Who knows, but it sounds good
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You misunderstood me. I'm not saying there is a perfect amp and cab pairing, I'm saying the amp and cabs placed together in these bundles have been adjusted by Andy to work nicely together.
 
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Cagey said:
People play differently, so that the exact same gear set up the exact same way will sound entirely different. David Curcurito tells a story (excerpted here from an Esquire article)...



I'm certainly no Eddie or Ted, but I get the same thing here when people come over and want to play my rig. A preset that works great for me will sound all sorts of wrong when someone else uses it. How you pick and/or strum, your legato/vibrato technique, the way you hammer/tap/pull, where you set the dreaded knobs/switches on the guitar, etc. all change the signal going into the rig, which responds accordingly.
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If you only knew how much you are preaching to the choir on this one! Different people sound different through the same rig... Amen brother... We hold these truths to be self evident...

Not sure how that relates, but you are spot on with that one!

Eddie gets the same EVH 5153 head and cab that we do when we buy one. He plugs his guitar in, tweaks the knobs on the front and there it is! Done!

When I open a TAF bundle that has an amp and cab together, it's sounds better to me then when I start with a blank preset and just drop the amp and cab (reverb, delay, etc..) into it. He seems to know what he's doing. If you try the bronze pack you may feel the same. If you then reset all the blocks to default values it looses something. This step that Andy provides is well worth the very small investment when I look at what I have spent in the rest of my rig.

Those who feel their presets sound better for them when not using this step, much respect and have at it!
 
TheAmpFactory said:
The ones I created for Platinum Bundles etc are not that, this is well documented in various topics, that I did not create "presets" I created a "Package" an "Amp with a matching speaker" or label this whatever you want. - its suppost to be a one click solution to a Amp+IR that's setup perfectly balanced in terms of amp+cab, and likewise (As documented again) its not science what I did with the choice of amp with the speaker, in fact I highlighted that this was my own choice wrongly or rightly, but it sounded good so that's what matters.. IT takes the HIT and MISS Ratio out of the equation for everyone.

Did it take me 8 hours as someone suggested per each preset, no. but it did still take a long time before building it, pairing, listening, adjusting. capturing, building, then scoping the speaker for freq ranges to match the amp, so who knows maybe 8 hours in total!. - a LOT of work went into them. I wanted to assure people that I gave them solid foundation to work upon.. and hey, if they liked it right off the bat, then that's great!. - you don't need to get to technical with the axe.. all my "presets" were ridiculously basic in design. amp+cab+verb and sometimes a few others... and I think out of the 450+ I did 2 or 3 with full effects for fun!.
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Well said.

Whatever black magic is involved in the process explained above, everything just sounds... 'better'... Well worth the price of admission!

Might not be for everyone, but it works for me. Thanks again Andy!
 
Manny Fufish said:
Tweaker - "You need to be on Linux! You can do anything with Linux!"
Non-Tweaker - "But I like (Insert favorite OS here) and it does exactly what I need it to do..."
Tweaker - "But you can do ANYTHING with Linux!"
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Nice analogy. I am normally the tweaker/Linux guy in the computer/technology situation but am a presets advocate on the Axe, so I get both sides of it. We have had this conversation here many times and the same set of people come in and say "presets are pointless" unilaterally and it is tiresome. Yes, some people are so type A that they must control everything themselves and will hate every single thing that they did not personally select to the smallest detail. The rest of us can use a Mac and be happy. ;)

I think your point and also AZG's points regarding the fact that not all presets are created equal are very relevant to those who are somewhat open minded about presets. I know I bring these up but a great example is the Guitarjon tone matches. Those completely blew my mind and I know they did many other user's too; they created a huge stir and even got a nod from someone in Metallica's own camp, IIRC. So very clearly, some things can be done in such a way that they work for most people and it also highlights the idea that preset creation might be viewed as a skill/art, too; just like playing and production.

I have a couple of other tone matches and presets from other folks that I have tweaked and modified through FW updates because I liked them so much. Fremen, Mark Day, ProgressiveRocco, Simeon, Yek, and Swedish Chef, all produce presets that seem to impress many people here or other use as base points. I know I personally have found gems from all these folks.

Also in the case of the Cab Factory, those Speaker settings are critical and a huge value added to me... you can port them to other amps too and benefit. That is the big deal with bundles and another example of FAS is always trying to take this product up a notch even after they have your dough.

Also your goals make a difference... some people are trying to nail other people's recorded tones to minute detail or are chasing some VERY specific "sound in their head"... others are looking for starting points or great sounds that are relevant to a style and inspire them to take action on a project or exercise but do not have a very specific reference point for comparison.

Anyway, bottom line is, like the OP, I really want to see this trend continue when it is really well done; like the TCF stuff.
 
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I think the "it's all in the fingers" mindset is not the point or has anything to do with this concept! It's about matching amps and cabs with the correct settings in a basic unit ! Yes, different players sound different, different guitars sound different, but if the interaction between the correct Cab and interaction of the power amp settings are correct it will give a good starting point to anyone ! And should provide a good starting point for different guitars as well! Let's face it , If Eddie buys a 5150 , and Joe Blow buys a 5150 ,his won't sound like Eddie's that's a given! But he won't be guessing at dozens of cabs and the settings that make it interact , nor "tweaking by ear to match his head to the cab" ! he will twist knobs on the amp to make it work for him , or not ! If not on to something that works! I have purchased pretty much every IR pack that's came out , ( spending quite a chunk of money I might add) and quite honestly pretty much use the stock selections. Really losing motivation to buy more IR's to fill hard disk space !! Don't get me wrong , I am very pleased with the current presets I've built , but I look at the reality of it , I have spent so much time jacking with tones and tweaking the last few years, which has replaced my practice time , my playing ha suffered substantially ! I would be awesome to have a simpler load and adjust option! Andy's concept here is excellent! A matched amp and cab for a great starting point! If I am to continue spending money on packages, the producers need to follow Andy's lead here! The correct settings should be part of what were spending our money for !!
 
I guess I'm missing how these work. Do you actually get a new amp in your amp inventory and a new Ir as well or are they just on your computer to bring up with Axe edit? I would only buy if they were in the Axe itself to use at shows without a computer. Or, are they using amps already in the axe? Thanks
 
REDD said:
I guess I'm missing how these work. Do you actually get a new amp in your amp inventory and a new Ir as well or are they just on your computer to bring up with Axe edit? I would only buy if they were in the Axe itself to use at shows without a computer. Or, are they using amps already in the axe? Thanks
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Amps in the Ax , Andy's new IR's with cab speaker page settings matched to the amp and cab.
 
REDD said:
I guess I'm missing how these work. Do you actually get a new amp in your amp inventory and a new Ir as well or are they just on your computer to bring up with Axe edit? I would only buy if they were in the Axe itself to use at shows without a computer. Or, are they using amps already in the axe? Thanks
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They are like any other preset except they come with an IR embedded.

The IR is put into the scratchpad when you import the preset, so the preset makes sound straight away.

After you store the preset and store the IR in a user IR slot, you are good to go without a computer.

So, the IR is new but the amp block just references amp models already in the firmware.
 
What I'd be interested to test is how a baked preset in the TAF paradigm sounds vs. my own preset of the same elements. I'm under this impression that there is a little more magic in an amp speaker page that has been dialed exactly to the cab IR attached to it. Today, I'm mostly using OH IRs and I try to pick the cab/speaker combo that goes with the model and just accept Fractal's defaults. But, OH IRs like the Marshall CB 4x12 sound very woofy and bassy at standard Marshall low res frequencies of 114 which is where a lot of those Plexis default to. But, the 1959SLP defaults to 72Hz so it's a crap shoot. I just do my best though to shape what sounds good to me. Not having to dial at that level and keep it strictly to TMB adjustments in a baked combo/preset might be cool.

Question to those that might know...when the Axe FX is updated to 19.1...or whatever...and you have to reset the amp block if that changed a lot, will one of those packages offered come with ongoing updates to match FW. Or, will you have to copy your settings ahead of time and redo the speaker page after FW updates where you changed the amp block?
 
mtmartin71 said:
What I'd be interested to test is how a baked preset in the TAF paradigm sounds vs. my own preset of the same elements. I'm under this impression that there is a little more magic in an amp speaker page that has been dialed exactly to the cab IR attached to it. Today, I'm mostly using OH IRs and I try to pick the cab/speaker combo that goes with the model and just accept Fractal's defaults. But, OH IRs like the Marshall CB 4x12 sound very woofy and bassy at standard Marshall low res frequencies of 114 which is where a lot of those Plexis default to. But, the 1959SLP defaults to 72Hz so it's a crap shoot. I just do my best though to shape what sounds good to me. Not having to dial at that level and keep it strictly to TMB adjustments in a baked combo/preset might be cool.

Question to those that might know...when the Axe FX is updated to 19.1...or whatever...and you have to reset the amp block if that changed a lot, will one of those packages offered come with ongoing updates to match FW. Or, will you have to copy your settings ahead of time and redo the speaker page after FW updates where you changed the amp block?
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IIRC the presets won't be update unless there"s a substantial need for it .
 
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