Bug? Help debugging Blackglass b7k

A

aravind

Member
I'm trying to dial in a bass tone with just a b7k drive block. The b7k model on my axe fx sounds nothing like what I get out of the neural darkglass plugin or from what I'm hearing in demo videos. It barely distorts at max drive and sounds super weak until I boost it in front with a PEQ block set at +13.5dB (I arrived at this value by comparing the response to the darkglass plugin). I have no idea why and this issue seems to be only with this pedal since my guitar patches sound fine and I even compared against a video of someone demoing the b7k model on the axe 3 and it sounds fine in their video

Axe FX III v15.01
USB Firmware v1.08
 
yyz67 said:
Is the raw bass input signal okay and/or similar to your guitar signal level?
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My guitar seems to be tickling the red on the input meter of the axe fx. I adjusted the input level in the I/O menu to set the bass to also tickle the red. The level was set to 50% on the guitar and 67% on the bass. From what I've read, this value does not affect the sound hitting the effects grid which lines up with what I observed. In a completely unscientific test, I tried to see what my bass would sound like on a guitar patch and it behaves as I expect it to
 
I've just tried a really basic preset with the B7K drive block (straight into the SV1 model and cab), and I agree, this isn't the behaviour I'd expect. I seem to remember it being a lot nastier and with a whole lot more distortion on tap.

I've also tried an existing preset that I made a while ago with the B7K, and it has a lot less distortion than I remember.

Perhaps a bug that has crept into a recent update?
 
Andy G said:
I've just tried a really basic preset with the B7K drive block (straight into the SV1 model and cab), and I agree, this isn't the behaviour I'd expect. I seem to remember it being a lot nastier and with a whole lot more distortion on tap.

I've also tried an existing preset that I made a while ago with the B7K, and it has a lot less distortion than I remember.

Perhaps a bug that has crept into a recent update?
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Sounds like what I remember. I have a friend who tested it out on his axe 2 on the last firmware update and he experienced the same thing. My hypothesis is this was introduced in ares but I don't have an axe 2 anymore to test that out
 
+1 . I’ve test all the real pedals from darkglass and the sim is far from the original . Don’t know why . So I use other dist for bass as they are plenty of it in the axe . Hm. So I wasn’t dreaming about a "problem" with it . Thank you 😅
 
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aravind said:
Sounds like what I remember. I have a friend who tested it out on his axe 2 on the last firmware update and he experienced the same thing. My hypothesis is this was introduced in ares but I don't have an axe 2 anymore to test that out
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I've just rolled back to an older firmware (12.06) and then back to 15.01, and I'm less sure now. They sound the same. Probably just misremembering things.

It might also be the difference between active pickups and passive pickups? I'm using a P Bass, whereas I think a lot of the video demos online are with active pickups.

Can you share a preset? I've attached a really rough one here that I threw together. I'm getting a decent amount of distortion with this one without needing to boost anything in front.
 

Attachments

  • B7K.syx
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I am trying your preset andy, yes it s what I remembered ...
the original in the end sound similar, just a little more gain, and with the switches you have a short little boost .

 
Andy G said:
I've just rolled back to an older firmware (12.06) and then back to 15.01, and I'm less sure now. They sound the same. Probably just misremembering things.

It might also be the difference between active pickups and passive pickups? I'm using a P Bass, whereas I think a lot of the video demos online are with active pickups.

Can you share a preset? I've attached a really rough one here that I threw together. I'm getting a decent amount of distortion with this one without needing to boost anything in front.
Click to expand...

This is what I'm testing with. Like I said I'm comparing it against the darkglass plugin and against other people's videos demoing the pedal. My bass is an active bass with aguilar dcb pickups and a darkglass tone capsule preamp and a fresh battery. I'm comparing against these videos. The drive block on my axe fx barely distorts at max drive in either passive or active mode. I'm considering completely wiping my axe fx and reinstalling the firmware but I have no idea what is the safest way to go about doing that
Also before someone asks, I know that different pots have different tolerances and two pedals might sound different with the same knob positions. I'm saying the model is almost clean at 9-10 on the drive knob


 

Attachments

  • b7k test.syx
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aravind said:
This is what I'm testing with. Like I said I'm comparing it against the darkglass plugin and against other people's videos demoing the pedal. My bass is an active bass with aguilar dcb pickups and a darkglass tone capsule preamp and a fresh battery. I'm comparing against these videos. The drive block on my axe fx barely distorts at max drive in either passive or active mode. I'm considering completely wiping my axe fx and reinstalling the firmware but I have no idea what is the safest way to go about doing that
Also before someone asks, I know that different pots have different tolerances and two pedals might sound different with the same knob positions. I'm saying the model is almost clean at 9-10 on the drive knob


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The preset you shared looks like it's just the default parameters, with drive at 5. When I knock drive up to 10 I get a decent amount of distortion with a passive P Bass. I also like to knock the low cut down as well (to simulate the 'Grunt' switch). If the drive block is barely distorting at 10, then something's wrong. It's much more likely to be cables or bass than firmware.

You should also check your Input 1 Gain is set to 1.0 under Setup>I/O (under the 'Input' tab). https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=I/O_menu#Input_1_Gain
 
Andy G said:
The preset you shared looks like it's just the default parameters, with drive at 5. When I knock drive up to 10 I get a decent amount of distortion with a passive P Bass. I also like to knock the low cut down as well (to simulate the 'Grunt' switch). If the drive block is barely distorting at 10, then something's wrong. It's much more likely to be cables or bass than firmware.

You should also check your Input 1 Gain is set to 1.0 under Setup>I/O (under the 'Input' tab). https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=I/O_menu#Input_1_Gain
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Ok so I tried it against a real b7k v2 today. New cable, new battery, and another borrowed bass and I got the same result. The b7k was set with attack and grunt switches in the middle position because that's what yek's writeup says the fractal model was built with. All EQ/Blend controls set to flat. Model has very little to no distortion up until 7.5 and very weak distortion around 8 - 9. At 10, the model starts to distort at the equivalent of a 1'o clock position on the b7k. Getting it even close to the level of distortion achieved by the real pedal requires the input signal to be boosted up by around 10 - 15dB. Input gain is set to 1.0.

I want to completely wipe and clean reinstall the firmware on my axe fx to test if this is some freak corruption that occurred on my end or if it's a real bug but I have no idea how to go about doing that
 
aravind said:
also before someone says that "the knobs won't line up exactly", etc I know but 1'o clock to full drive is a big difference
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No need to reinstall. This is the way the model have always been.
Sometimes i boost infront 4-5 Db with a GEQ, that gives me some dirt in the model
And when you place the b7K infront of a SVT Bass amp, you can use the level in the B7k, to boost the input also, pluss the mix in the B7k also gives you more dirt :)
 
aravind said:
Ok so I tried it against a real b7k v2 today. New cable, new battery, and another borrowed bass and I got the same result. The b7k was set with attack and grunt switches in the middle position because that's what yek's writeup says the fractal model was built with. All EQ/Blend controls set to flat. Model has very little to no distortion up until 7.5 and very weak distortion around 8 - 9. At 10, the model starts to distort at the equivalent of a 1'o clock position on the b7k. Getting it even close to the level of distortion achieved by the real pedal requires the input signal to be boosted up by around 10 - 15dB. Input gain is set to 1.0.

I want to completely wipe and clean reinstall the firmware on my axe fx to test if this is some freak corruption that occurred on my end or if it's a real bug but I have no idea how to go about doing that
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[edited] No need to reinstall everything. Just perform a system reset (Utility menu). This will not affect your presets. Make sure to take a note of non-default parameter values in Global, I/O and MIDI/Remote, before doing this. Also, save your FC settings before doing this.
 
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yek said:
Need to reinstall everything. Just perform a system reset (Utility menu). This will not affect your presets. Make sure to take a note of non-default parameter values in Global, I/O and MIDI/Remote, before doing this. Also, save your FC settings before doing this.
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Going to try this out soon. Going to roll back and then install 15.01 fresh just to make sure my update was applied correctly and there was no accident on my end
FractalAudio said:
I'll get the pedal out later this week and verify the model. Last time I tested it the model was very close but it's possible something got inadvertently changed when the Drive block received that last major update.
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Thank you! Really appreciate it. Fingers crossed there's nothing wrong with the model
 
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