Breath controllers with the Axe-Fx...Anyone used one?

soularflair

soularflair

Inspired
I'm very much into the type of sounds you can get when using a MIDI breath controller to alter guitar tone.
Here are 2 great examples of the tones obtainable:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDs2z6wsBX8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBMWyfgKFIY
I believe these guys are actually using the 33 unit designed by Johan Haake (brother of Tomas from Meshuggah)...
-> http://www8.tfe.umu.se/personliga/jh/index.html
I eventually wanna pay someone who is electronically inclined to build me one, since only a few were originally made, but the schematics are available.

Has anyone here had any experience using one of these, or any other breath controller for that matter, with the Axe?
And if so, what parameters do you have it mapped to via MIDI on the Axe?
 
pauliusmm said:
This is amazing!
thanks for posting this, i really like the idea.
I did a search and found this:
http://www.patchmanmusic.com/midisolutions.html
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Thanks for the response. Yeah, the Yamaha BC3A and Midi Solutions converter was one option I'd seen. Heard some mixed reports about the BC3A though.
The 33 seems to impress everyone though, and I've certainly never seen one available second-hand.
It's definitely more expressive than the BC3A due to that movable joystick that gives and X and Y axis control as well as breath velocity.
I'm actually also chatting to a guy on Youtube who built what appears to be an even more versatile version of the 33.
Discussing potential improvements. If it could be head-mounted somehow, like the BC3A, that would be incredible, although quite a design-challenge.

Hoping someone on the forum has actually used a breath controller with the Axe before - it seems like an awesomely expressive tool.
 
So "33" is not available to order?
If so what are the prices of other potential solutions?


how about using simple expression pedal along with this yamaha thing?
 
pauliusmm said:
So "33" is not available to order?
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Not now, no. But the schematics are available for those who are electronically inclined (not me :cry: )
pauliusmm said:
If so what are the prices of other potential solutions?
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I hadn't seen any others besides the Yamaha option.
pauliusmm said:
how about using simple expression pedal along with this yamaha thing?
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Kinda defeats the purpose - the whole point of the breath controller is it gives you far finer control than any pedal would. Plus, you get the 2 extra planes of control with the moveable joystick with the 33.
I'm hoping I can find someone I can pay to build me one.
 
[/quote]Kinda defeats the purpose - the whole point of the breath controller is it gives you far finer control than any pedal would. Plus, you get the 2 extra planes of control with the moveable joystick with the 33.
I'm hoping I can find someone I can pay to build me one.[/quote]

well i mean there's 3 controls in "33": breath, X and Y.
with yamaha bc3a plus expression pedal you get 2 controls : breath and X.

So its pretty close, or i am missing something?

by the way, if you find someone else who builds them let me know :)
 
Hi there

I am also very interested in hearing if anyone has used the BR33 along with the Axe-Fx.

Or perhaps other midicontroller equipment?

I bought an BR33 from Johan Haake back in 2006 and have used it with the Clavia Nord Modular G2 Engine. It works well, but I would like to shrink my setup, which currently consist of:

- Line6 POD Xt Pro
- TC Elecronic G-Force
- Rocktron MidiMate
- Clavia Nord Modular G2 Engine.

It would be awsome, if i could reduce all this down to the 2 unit Axe-Fx Ultra.

For your information the G2 Engine responds to midi note-on/off messages from the breath and 3 different midi CC from the x/y joystick.

Thank you
 
spismund said:
Hi there

I am also very interested in hearing if anyone has used the BR33 along with the Axe-Fx.

Or perhaps other midicontroller equipment?

I bought an BR33 from Johan Haake back in 2006 and have used it with the Clavia Nord Modular G2 Engine. It works well, but I would like to shrink my setup, which currently consist of:

- Line6 POD Xt Pro
- TC Elecronic G-Force
- Rocktron MidiMate
- Clavia Nord Modular G2 Engine.

It would be awsome, if i could reduce all this down to the 2 unit Axe-Fx Ultra.

For your information the G2 Engine responds to midi note-on/off messages from the breath and 3 different midi CC from the x/y joystick.

Thank you
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The Axe-Fx will not replace your Midimate (the MFC101 would) or Nord Modular G2 Engine.
The Axe-Fx is not a sound module/synthesizer and doesn't respond to note on/off messages.

(Yes, the Ultra has a very cool "synth" block but that is triggered by the input signal, not MIDI note messages)

I doubt you'll ever look back to the Pod and G-force though.

S.R.
 
@srooijens:

Thank you for the fast reply. I'm sorry, but I meant the Rocktron PatchMate Loop 8 :) I use the PatchMate because the Pod has only one stereo send/return (quite normal), and I didn't want to constantly have to route the G2 Engine through the G-Force, as it alters the sound a bit.

To bad about the Axe-Fx not responding to midi on/off messages, but I could live with that :)

Yes, it is funny that I stumbled upon the Axe-Fx in my search for some gear that would give me a better amp and cab sound than the Pod - As a bonus it also looks like the Axe-Fx is supperior to my 10 year old G-Force :)
 
srooijens said:
The Axe-Fx is not a sound module/synthesizer and doesn't respond to note on/off messages.

(Yes, the Ultra has a very cool "synth" block but that is triggered by the input signal, not MIDI note messages)S.R.
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not true.

i have been using the Synth block as a stand alone FM synth. in the synth tracking parameters there is the option to turn tracking off. you can then assign a controller to the pitch value of the synth. you can also assign a controller to either the mix or level controls for the synth. i use momentary switches from my gordius little giant midi controller to do all this. in this manner you are selecting the pitch of the note and also momentarily fading it in and out using the momentary switch. you can set up ordinary stomps as well and have long drones. lots of fun, upto you. let me know what you think.
 
have to say i was very disappointed with the demos of this, i don't think they really showed off the expressive possibilities of a using a breath controller at all

having been a fan of allan holdsworth for many years and loving his synthaxe playing, i can see that using a breath controller with the synth in the axefx might provide some pretty interesting possibilities. to hear the master using a breath controller with his synthaxe go here - http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/allanholdsworth3 and listen to the clip of "Spokes".
i'd be very interested in getting a breath controller if it was affordable

sim
 
simeon said:
have to say i was very disappointed with the demos of this, i don't think they really showed off the expressive possibilities of a using a breath controller at all

having been a fan of allan holdsworth for many years and loving his synthaxe playing, i can see that using a breath controller with the synth in the axefx might provide some pretty interesting possibilities. to hear the master using a breath controller with his synthaxe go here - http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/allanholdsworth3 and listen to the clip of "Spokes".
i'd be very interested in getting a breath controller if it was affordable

sim
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I second that, Sim
 
mission said:
Hmm, sounds like a breath controller would be appropriate to think about as a Mission product. I'll look into it. Anyone who has any input can email me directly at james@mission-engineering.com.
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i think there could be a market for a very simple one that plugs into the cv input on the back of your pedalboard, in place of a regular expression pedal. one that simply controls volume. if it had a good mouthpiece, so you could use some of the "tounging" techniques that reed players use, it would be great. i think fixing it on a stand is a bit naff. you'd want to be able to hang it round your neck on a strap and just pop it in your gob when needed.

you could have a more expensive model as well, with extra functionality, i guess.

yamaha make the bc3, but i don't think it's compatible without this extra midi box http://www.midisolutions.com/prodbth.htm
 
I think the reason why Johan Haake recommended us to use the Nord Modular along with the BR33, was because midi on/off messages give the fastest response. I can for instance use the "learn" funktion of my G-Force to connect the BR33 to the main volume of the G-Force, but it doesn't come close to the speed/response of the G2 Engine. When playing alot of quick notes (or doing that freaky fart thing with your thounge and lips), then the G-Force simply doesn't deliver.

If mission where to build some breathcontrollers, then my advice is to include an on/off power switch. From using the BR33, I also miss the opportunity to somehow choose how much to move the x/y joystick before the BR33 begins spitting out midi. That is of course something I can control in the G2 Engine, but I find the BR33 a littlebit to sensitive overall and would like to make some constant adjustments.
 
I share the disappointment felt by simeon and gearhead. I expected to hear the equivalent of the wide dynamic range I associate with bowed instruments where a very slow bowing motion starts at pianissississimo and rises with a very vigorous bowing to a fortissississimo and everything in between.

The applications shown in the videos certainly have their merit , but I had completely different expectations.
 
I've actually got a 33 built by Johan. I've been meaning to plug it in and see how it could work with my Axe. I'll try and do this when I get a chance.
 
I have plans to build one and perhaps more after that. I'll keep you posted. It'll be a while though...

shotgunn
 
iam using the yamaha and midi solutions setup...have to go to work but will explain it at a later post...it works great, and I really like it...I spoke to Johan awhile back he isnt building these, but i am in the process of modifying my unit....
 
christen meigs said:
iam using the yamaha and midi solutions setup...have to go to work but will explain it at a later post...it works great, and I really like it...I spoke to Johan awhile back he isnt building these, but i am in the process of modifying my unit....
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Any more info you can give us? Maybe even a sound clip with the synth?
 
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