Block Order Question

Miseria

Member
Is there any specific reason to put the CAB block before blocks like REVERB?

I ask because I currently use my AxeFx III (thanks Black November sale!) two different ways. Primarily I run outs 1 & 2 to my Apollo Twin and into studio monitors (I am clearly not too bright as I trusted Amazon reviews a few years back and bough krk 5s...I digress). I also have a power stage 170 and a really nice 2x12 with V30s.

Back to the original question - if I put my CAB block right before OUT1 then I can run a tap before it with OUT3 and get the same amp/fx signal. The manual seems to suggest this type of layout but every preset I see in demos or downloads seems to put the CAB block before time based effects.

Now off to the speaker/cab board to look for advice on better monitors when the piggy bank refills.
 
Is there any specific reason to put the CAB block before blocks like REVERB?

I ask because I currently use my AxeFx III (thanks Black November sale!) two different ways. Primarily I run outs 1 & 2 to my Apollo Twin and into studio monitors (I am clearly not too bright as I trusted Amazon reviews a few years back and bough krk 5s...I digress). I also have a power stage 170 and a really nice 2x12 with V30s.

Back to the original question - if I put my CAB block right before OUT1 then I can run a tap before it with OUT3 and get the same amp/fx signal. The manual seems to suggest this type of layout but every preset I see in demos or downloads seems to put the CAB block before time based effects.

Now off to the speaker/cab board to look for advice on better monitors when the piggy bank refills.
it mimics the typical setup where reverb is added in the studio after the guitar is recorded. so physically it would be amp+cab then reverb.

most people are just used to seeing it that way, conceptually. amp and cab are typically "together." there are some intricacies with block order, but simply, that's basically it.
 
it mimics the typical setup where reverb is added in the studio after the guitar is recorded. so physically it would be amp+cab then reverb.

most people are just used to seeing it that way, conceptually. amp and cab are typically "together." there are some intricacies with block order, but simply, that's basically it.

Hey Chris, since you are the King of Knowledge in regards to all things Fractal, I would love to hear your take someday on the intricacies of block order:D
 
Cool. So for a yahoo like me just jamming in their basement I prob wouldn't be able tell the difference 99% of the time it sounds like.

Thanks for the wiki link - that helps a ton
 
Is there any specific reason to put the CAB block before blocks like REVERB?

I ask because I currently use my AxeFx III (thanks Black November sale!) two different ways. Primarily I run outs 1 & 2 to my Apollo Twin and into studio monitors (I am clearly not too bright as I trusted Amazon reviews a few years back and bough krk 5s...I digress). I also have a power stage 170 and a really nice 2x12 with V30s.

Back to the original question - if I put my CAB block right before OUT1 then I can run a tap before it with OUT3 and get the same amp/fx signal. The manual seems to suggest this type of layout but every preset I see in demos or downloads seems to put the CAB block before time based effects.

Now off to the speaker/cab board to look for advice on better monitors when the piggy bank refills.
Ambient effects like Reverb and Delay will sound the same before or after the Cab block as they are LTI (Linear Time Invariant).

I think many place them after the Cab block as this would be similar to studio post processing. The common "live" use (in a traditional rig) would be in the amp's effects loop, but since we can do that on the Axe Fx you will often see them placed between the amp and cab, which is basically impossible in a real world rig.

Some of what I wrote Chris already mentioned, but I had been writing the reply and got interrupted... So I just left the part in.
 
Ambient effects like Reverb and Delay will sound the same before or after the Cab block as they are LTI (Linear Time Invariant)

If there is any modulation, or distortion in any of those effects, it makes a difference weather it goes in front of the cab or after. The only way to tell is to try it out. I didn't believe them the other day and tried it in the DAW, reverb by itself is totally LTI. But if it's a dirty ass memory man, or a reverb that's dripping with modulation, that syrup and hair will totally get filtered down by the cab if it's in front.

@unix-guy are you still mad at me? :(
 
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The primary reason is to prevent collapsing the stereo image. If only use one IR in the cab block you'll destroy the imaging if you put the reverb before the cab.
 
So, setting the cab block to stereo and using the same IR on both sides would save the stereo image from collapsing?
 
I usually put spring reverbs in between the amp and cab. Maybe it doesn't make a difference in sound but it helps me with the patch layout to show that it's the amp's spring reverb as opposed to room ambiance or whatever.
 
I run a similar set up, mainly because I use a PS170 into real cabs for live and rehearsal. I always have a cab block before out 1 incase I want to run direct live, or if I take it with me on the road I have an 8” monitor to play through, or headphones if late, in the hotel. Not sure I hear a difference, but never been a stereo guy either.

I have also found that we play at a lower volume when I run out 1 to the PA and out 2 to the PS/cab. We all can hear it through the monitors, but still have the amp in the room feel too.

Keep in mind that the reverb and delay is always before the speaker in a real amp/speaker set up for live use.
 
You can use different IRs too. But the important point is they must be panned if you want things panned.

Now the question of the OP was if putting the cab block pre or post delay and reverb will sound the same.
This is not about getting some nice stereo tone, it's about moving blocks for a different reason, keeping the sound exactly like it was before.

To have the same sound as before when moving the cab block from pre to post you'd need the IR processing in stereo, so two times the same IR hard panned L/R and that should keep the sound as it was before.
I will move the cab block as well in my presets, I like the idea.
 
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