Block levels showing red and no output what is it?

S

skolacki

Fractal Fanatic
I was playing around with the 2203 low and there was a small pop and then no output. So I paged right on the layout UI to see block levels. From the drive block before the amp block to the output the horizontal lines were showing red. The drive block showed level changes but also had red horizontal lines. From the amp block to the output there were no level changes only the red lines. Can’t recall what I changed when this happened. I rebooted and all good again. This is a new one to me and I can’t recall seeing this before. So what is that?
 
Do you mean there were solid red lines running the full length of the meter? That usually means there was a crash, and the fix is a reboot, as you discovered.

Remember that in Layout > Meters, each block has four meters in it. Two of them are the input to the block, and two of them are the output of that block. When reading the meters, it's important to know which is which.
 
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Pretty sure it was a fluke. Firmware is the latest. Not too concerned, just didn’t know what it was.
 
unix-guy said:
happens again, post the preset... And the firmware version is important, too.
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It never happens on the same preset twice.
Just last week I had this on one of my main presets. I've added Formant block, and after a couple of hours exactly this issue happen.

I've tried to troubleshoot it hy removing all blocks one by one to see if this helps. Only when In and Out blocks are on the grid you can hear the sound. Adding literally any block makes it red on the meters and there is no sound.

I've had this issue in different presets and different firmwares and was never able to troubleshooitor reproduce it on purpose. One of the reasons the suggestion "always turn on FM3 last, turn off last" is not a final solution. Only reboot fixes this issue.
 
Chromatizm said:
It never happens on the same preset twice.
Just last week I had this on one of my main presets. I've added Formant block, and after a couple of hours exactly this issue happen.

I've tried to troubleshoot it hy removing all blocks one by one to see if this helps. Only when In and Out blocks are on the grid you can hear the sound. Adding literally any block makes it red on the meters and there is no sound.

I've had this issue in different presets and different firmwares and was never able to troubleshooitor reproduce it on purpose. One of the reasons the suggestion "always turn on FM3 last, turn off last" is not a final solution. Only reboot fixes this issue.
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The OP reported that Drive block was the first one showing red. It could be a bug in the Drive block (could also be elsewhere).

Once it is in this "broken" state, removing blocks won't help because the unit is in a broken state... Not only the responsible block.
When this happens, posting the preset is one of the best clues because it can help narrow the scope.

Perhaps every time it happens, the preset has a certain amp model or drive model or IR active.

If you don't share a preset and/or detail what you were doing when it occurred, there's very little chance it can be fixed.

One of the reasons the suggestion "always turn on FM3 last, turn off last" is not a final solution
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Sorry, I don't understand what you're trying to say there...
 
unix-guy said:
When this happens, posting the preset is one of the best clues because it can help narrow the scope.

Perhaps every time it happens, the preset has a certain amp model or drive model or IR active.

If you don't share a preset and/or detail what you were doing when it occurred, there's very little chance it can be fixed.
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^This^

Cliff’s “How to” for reporting bugs:
When reporting bugs:
1. Post an example preset.
2. Do NOT post a preset bundle.
3. Simplify the preset as much as possible. Remove any blocks that are not relevant.
4. Unlink all blocks from global blocks.
5. Use factory cabs if possible.
6. Include clear and concise instructions on how to recreate the bug.
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Some bugs are really hard to duplicate and the more we do to help isolate it the easier it is for them to fix it.
 
unix-guy said:
The OP reported that Drive block was the first one showing red. It could be a bug in the Drive block (could also be elsewhere).
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I had this issue more than a few times, and I can report it happens to different kind of blocks. It starts with some block having one channel (usually the lower one) as red, as the other channel as empty, no signal. All blocks after that are always red.

That's why I fail to reproduce it every time. But it's very similar to this bug which is reproducible on many FWs, and might (or might not) be a key to the issue reported here:
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...-between-rows-mutes-fm3-until-restart.208462/

I also don't attach presets to issues which are reproducible on every preset in a box, like https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/fm3-firmware-version-9-01.208627/post-2609950.

I also didn't report this issue because of exactly this line:
Greg Ferguson said:
3. Simplify the preset as much as possible. Remove any blocks that are not relevant.
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Once the issue happened, you can create a blank preset with different number, and the sound will be there while only In and Out blocks are connected. Adding literally any block, Volume, GEQ, Amp, doesn't matter, automatically marks it as red on Meters page. Removing if from the grid doesn't help as Out is also red at the point. You have to remove-add Out again for sound to come back.
Once the unit is restarted, the issues goes away for many weeks.

I've attached a preset to the issue in the first link ("moving Send") because this I can reproduce. I'm pretty sure Fractal support cannot spend days on the issue which is reported by a couple of people once in a blue moon, so I see no reason to bug them with the report of issue in this thread. But I'll attach the preset next time, you are right, maybe it's the combination or anything.
 
I also don't attach presets to issues which are reproducible on every preset in a box, like https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/fm3-firmware-version-9-01.208627/post-2609950.
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Unless you've had it happen on every preset then you can't really say that.

Not attaching a preset does nothing to help...

Once the issue happened, you can create a blank preset with different number, and the sound will be there while only In and Out blocks are connected.
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As I already mentioned above, once it's in this state it is broken. Nothing you do after that (besides reboot) is relevant because you're already in the broken state.

Basing any additional testing after it's in that state is basically pointless...
 
unix-guy said:
Unless you've had it happen on every preset then you can't really say that.
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Let me rephrase: I have this issue on every preset I use with FW9.01.
Just for fun I just reproduced it on M5 JV preset. Cab pre to Vintage, High quality, Drive to 4, double click on Drive, hear the pop.
 
Chromatizm said:
Let me rephrase: I have this issue on every preset I use with FW9.01.
Just for fun I just reproduced it on M5 JV preset. Cab pre to Vintage, High quality, Drive to 4, double click on Drive, hear the pop.
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This thread is about a "crash" not a "pop"... you are talking about a noise when bypassing a block.
 
unix-guy said:
This thread is about a "crash" not a "pop"
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Yes, I know. I've provided all I know about the issue above.
The extra discussion started with me trying to explain why I saw no reason to post the preset for the OP issue. Next time it happens I'll make sure to share the preset.
 
Chromatizm said:
Yes, I know. I've provided all I know about the issue above.
The extra discussion started with me trying to explain why I saw no reason to post the preset for the OP issue. Next time it happens I'll make sure to share the preset.
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Hey @cromatizm, i have this kind of issues. I followed a reply to your other post. Did you guess how to fix this meanwhile?
 
No, as I have to idea why it happens. But it happens so rarely that I'm not trying to hunt it. I had it recently but forgot about this thread and that I planned to share the preset, and now I can't remember which one had the issue.
 
To me it was a faulty xlr cable. Swapped, and now all right!

EDIT:

nothing to do with faulty xlr. Read my follow up below...
 
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This happened to my FM3 for the 1st time at rehearsal last night. My bandmate was using it and 3 times in the span of a couple hours the output level would be gone, I'd page over to the blocks meters page and about halfway down my chain all the blocks showed red outlines with red meters maxed out. I tried switching presets but they were all the same. Only fix was to power cycle.

Could this have happened due to clipping? His guitar has a hotter output than mine and I noticed the input meter showing a lot of red while he was playing.
 
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