Axe-Fx with "Amp in the Room sensation" .. Wireton by Meyer Amps

I am currently using a FRFR powered cab and while it's cool to be able to use different IRs with that, it's a little awkward to carry to the gig and there's a lot of excess cables, power supplies, blah, blah. I was looking for this EXACT solution not too long ago and was disappointed that I couldn't find one. BEHOLD. I think a combo would be fantastic. Now, the real question is price.
 
Great thread. The head looks beautiful. Will never get one as FRFR (with floormonitor as stage sound) is enough for me as a badass amateur. Sounds like you did the perfect job there.
 
Hi Jbmetal, since we are in a development phase we are focussing on the technical issues at the moment. We have not yet figured out the production costs and hence we can't give any price information. However, its clear that for the combo the retail price will greatly depend on the brand/type speakers which are used.
 
+1 for 2x12 combo w/slant baffle and convertible (open/closed) back.

I have been thinking about something like this with different speakers on each side (vintage/modern). I figure by panning L or R I could choose the speaker that most closely matches the sims I'm sending to FOH. So, would want the ability to run in mono or stereo.
 
Currently, I have been using my AFX with a Matrix GT1000 and have been experimenting with the following cabs:

1. Xitone 1x12 FRFR
2. Carvin Legacy 2x12 G12M cab (traditional)
3. Matrix NL212

Each has a pro/con to it, but none has satisfied me 100%. This has been the most frustrating part of working with the AFX, IMO. When acquiring the AFX, my main goals/hopes were the following:

1. Lighten my rig as compared to my tube amp, rack, pedalboard setup.
2. Utilize IR's so that I can create presets that will sound great both in person (with cab), straight to FOH and recording without having to create new presets for each use.

So far, I cannot find a cab that can offer me that. Yes, the FRFR route gives you the ability to use IR's, but it isn't that "real cab" sound that I am used to. The traditional guitar cab is nice at moving air and giving me the nice tone, but leads me back to having to mic up my amps live and for recording and doesn't allow me to utilize a major part of the AFX's features... the IR's. And the NL212 I'm trying... well, it's a guitar cab, but more neutral-voiced, so I find that I don't care for it with IR's, but when not using my traditional cab (G12M), it sounds bright and a bit "plain", if that makes sense.

I would love to find a cab that can offer me a great balance of it all and allow me to use my AFX in any situation with confidence. Maybe I'm looking for too much and it's just not achievable with any rig. Either you're stuck going FRFR without having to mic stuff up or you're going to have to use mics and run into more traditional setups, using the AFX as just an amp simulator and effect processor.

I'll be interested in seeing what can be developed by Meyer Amps that can possibly bridge the gap that so many of us are looking for. :)
 
Meyer-Amps said:
When a little over a year ago Will Schut, one of Hollands premier guitarplayers and known to be inseparable from his JCM800 and Tubescreamer for decades, wandered into our workshop and started raving on about some sort of effects processor we knew instantly something had to be up.

So the next day we visited Will in his studio to hear this supposedly magic box and were simply swept away by the great and tubelike sounds it produced when hooked up to the console. Off course we’re talkin’ about the Axe FX from Fractal Audio here. Therefore we were a little surprised when Will visited us a couple of weeks later and telling us that he had tried to amplify the sounds of the Axe FX through a varity of power amps and cabinets, but basically had the feeling it came up short. They sounded okay, but Will was convinced there should be a way to make them sound as awesome as they did in his studio, while retaining a definite amp in the room vibe that is.

Quite a challenge, but we at Meyer Amps rose to it and sat down with Will to come up with a poweramp and cabinet configuration that would meet all of his demands. Long story short, we’ve built him this:

attachment.php


Will preferred a hybrid power amp because to his ears a full valve power amp added to much character to the sound, taking away from the power amp simulations of the Axe FX while a transistor power amp generated, what Will called, too much of a hifi vibe. Be that as it may, we feel that the dude had some valid points there and the end result, well, let’s put it this way, we’re proud to put our name on it. Although here at Meyer Amps we are certified valve geeks building amplifiers some even call “boutique”, we absolutely think this amp, called the Meyer Wireton by the way, is absolutely awesome. In fact, we think is so awesome that we now consider designing a whole line catering to the specific needs of the Axe FX users.

But before we start, we would like to hear from you, the Axe Fx owners!

Quite simply, what would you prefer, a separate head and cabinet like Will, or maybe a 2x12 combo with the Axe FX on top to look a bit like a JC120, or sunken into the cab so it kinda looks like an AC-30? Something else? And how about looks. Traditional black or cream tolex, maybe go snakeskin or something even wilder, hey, we’re listening, we’re really anxious to receive your input on this.

So give us your opinion on this forum, or drop us a line at Meyer Amps - handbuilt combo's, heads and cabinets | Your sound!. If you have a question rather than a suggestion, that’s fine to, just shoot from the hip, we can take it, gloves are off, anything goes! We know Will is one happy camper right now, so why would you sell yourself short, this is your chance to give some direct input straight to an amp builder and maybe even see it realized!

The lines are open, shoot!

Thanx,
Click to expand...

There's something very odd going on here (to me) regarding the goals of Mr. Schut and of your company.
Most Axe-FX users will tell you that the sound we get when using the Axe's Cab Sims into a studio monitor is NOT the sound of an "amp-in-the-room" and most of us have given up on that "amp-in-the-room" feeling being achievable when using the Cab Block and/or any other cabinet simulation technologies currently available.

I.e. The sound that Mr. Schut was getting in the studio from his Axe-FX that he was so gassed about is the sound of a "mic'd up cabinet in the studio", not the elusive "amp-in-the-room" sound.
And most of us feel the the "amp-in-the-room" sound/vibe/feel can only achieved when monitoring the Axe through a power amp driving a real guitar cab with the Axe's Cab Sims defeated.

[I personally feel that the best power amps for this purpose are solid-state with the best specs and possible and very high head-room. E.g. Anything made by Bryston.
The idea is to not distort the signal that the Axe-FX is feeding the power amp as much as is possible with today's technology.
Most of us feel that Cliff's modeling technology should be doing all the work of mimicking the tone of a tube guitar amp.
But there are still some hold outs out there who insist on using a tube power amp to colour the tone of their power amp + guitar cab rigs.]

Now, Mr Schut may have noticed that most currently available FRFR monitors (which are designed for far-field listening and high SPLs) are not as satisfying to use live with the Axe as a pair of hi-end studio monitors are (which are designed for near-field listening and not so high SPLs).
That's a currently accepted fact in the guitar modeling world at the present moment.
Most of us feel that the best monitors available right now that come close to meeting those goals, that's not ridiculously expensive, are the Atomic CLRs.

Based on the few posts I've seen of yours so far in this thread it's not clear to me whether or not you're trying to design an FRFR system for Mr. Schut or a power amp + guitar cab system.
But it seems like it's probably the former.
And if so, unless you guys do something significantly different to the signal than most other FRFR systems are designed to do, in order to somehow make a mic'd cab IR sound more like an "amp-in-the-room", the most you can hope to achieve is to surpass the abilities of the already available CLR technology.
And if you do have some new audio tricks for making a close-mic'd IR (or any other mic'ing technique used to acquire an IR) sound more like an "amp-in-the-room" what you'll really be doing is distorting the signal that the Axe-FX is feeding to that monitor.
It may be a distortion of the signal that many Axe-FX users enjoy the sound of, but I wouldn't count on that.

[IMO The real problem with achieving the "amp-in-the-room" tone/feel/vibe has more to do with the limitations of how microphones work than it has with the nature of IR convolution technology.
I.e. A mic is simply not capable of capturing the sound of a "guitar-cab-in-the-room" (especially an open back guitar cab).
Neither is any current mic'ing technique possibly utilizing several mics, as far as I can tell.
So until somebody figures out some other way to mimick the "guitar-cab-in-the-room" vibe most of us feel quite confident that IRs sound every bit as good as physically mic'ing a cab is capable of sounding (within limits of course) and we're just trucking along trying to be content with the current state of the art.]

The extra design consideration of having 2 rack spaces within your chassis to mount an Axe-FX could be a nice touch, depending on the implementation as well as all the other design factors of course.

Then again, perhaps I'm missing something.
Either way I'm wishing you the best of luck in achieving your design goals, whatever they are.
 
@joegold

First of all thanks for your honest and therefore valuable response. Now I'm a bit of a buffoon when it comes to the mechanical aspects of what's happening under the hood of my amp, so I'm afraid the good people at Meyer will have to adress your questions and remarks there.

Your observations regarding my ideas and experiences with the Meyer amp were right on the money though. It's true that I did not really get the so-called "amp in the room feeling" when using FRFR amplifiers. Now all valve amps got me there, but, at least to my ears, colored the overall sound a bit too much.

Regarding my experiences in the studio, I did get the "amp in the room feeling" standing next to my stack in the recording room and this was somewhat proven (I say somewhat) by the results when we recorded some tracks with the Axe FX and the real amps that were in the studio. I have to admit that the difference on tape was slightly more noticeable compared to my exeprience in the room and the mic influence was, as you described, huge.

So all in all, I feel it's a journey well worth taking and not over yet. The results the Meyer Wireton is giving me , to me, are so far unmatched by any other set up I've tried.

Mr. Gold, I've checked your website and it's more than obvious that you know a thing or two about sound, period. Therefor I for one would welcome any future observations and thoughts from you when the people at Meyer start to release more info (audio/video?) about the Wireton. Reactions like yours were the reason Meyer posted this thread in the first place I'm sure. And thanks for your good luck wishes, much appreciated.

Having said that, thanks to all other responders, it almost feels like we're trying to crack a code together :)

@dutch

Ja, best wel he, bedankt man! (You said it man, thanks!)
 
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Will Schut said:
@joegold

First of all thanks for your honest and therefore valuable response. Now I'm a bit of a buffoon when it comes to the mechanical aspects of what's happening under the hood of my amp, so I'm afraid the good people at Meyer will have to adress your questions and remarks there.

Your observations regarding my ideas and experiences with the Meyer amp were right on the money though. It's true that I did not really get the so-called "amp in the room feeling" when using FRFR amplifiers. Now all valve amps got me there, but, at least to my ears, colored the overall sound a bit too much.

Regarding my experiences in the studio, I did get the "amp in the room feeling" standing next to my stack in the recording room and this was somewhat proven (I say somewhat) by the results when we recorded some tracks with the Axe FX and the real amps that were in the studio. I have to admit that the difference on tape was slightly more noticeable compared to my exeprience in the room and the mic influence was, as you described, huge.

So all in all, I feel it's a journey well worth taking and not over yet. The results the Meyer Wireton is giving me , to me, are so far unmatched by any other set up I've tried.

Mr. Gold, I've checked your website and it's more than obvious that you know a thing or two about sound, period. Therefor I for one would welcome any future observations and thoughts from you when the people at Meyer start to release more info (audio/video?) about the Wireton. Reactions like yours were the reason Meyer posted this thread in the first place I'm sure. And thanks for your good luck wishes, much appreciated.

Having said that, thanks to all other responders, it almost feels like we're trying to crack a code together :)

@dutch

Ja, best wel he, bedankt man! (You said it man, thanks!)
Click to expand...

Hi Will

Thanks for taking my post in the spirit in which it was offered and for not getting bent out of shape about any of it.

I think that what might be perplexing me may have more to do with language and/or cultural differences between where you live and where I live etc.
It looks like when you say you loved the "amp-in-the-room" sound/feel that you achieved in the studio with the Axe-FX, that you were really talking about how well the Axe performed at duplicating your real amp's sound when the real amp was mic'd while you were listening through the studio's monitors.
So you weren't really admiring the Axe's ability to achieve the "amp-in-the-room" sound.
You were admiring the Axe's ability to achieve the "amp-in-the-the-room-after-it's-been-mic'd-and-played-back-through-studio-monitors" sound. :)
If I'm still not understanding you please try to correct me again.

So, yeah, most commercially available and reasonably priced FRFR systems are designed as vocal monitors and overemphasize the upper mids in order to achieve a sound that cuts on stage so the vocalists can hear themselves.
The ones that do attempt a flat response usually have some sort of a peak here and there too that screws the tone up when used with the Axe-FX or other guitar amp modeler.
Most Axe-FX users seem to prefer monitors with a coaxial driver so that the highs and the lows all emanate from a single source.
The coaxial powered monitors from Italian company RCF were very popular here for a while but the CLR monitors from Atomic are the current fave at the moment.
You can easily get by with other monitors, coaxial or not, but currently the CLR is enjoying the best reputation from Axe users as well as users of other modellers.
Many people claim that they are as good sounding as some very good studio monitors, just louder with a better dispersion pattern.

Now guitar players in general, and certain Axe users especially, are often prone to not using their gear in the way the engineers who designed that gear expected it to be used.
And that's all fine.
If you get a tone or effect that is what you want to hear then that is what you want to hear.
But the design philosophy of the Axe-FX is such that the signal that is output from the Axe-FX (whether it's being used in an FRFR rig or a power amp + guitar amp rig) should already contain all of the desirable qualities that a tube driven guitar amp posseses.
Any system used to amplify the Axe-FX's signal should, in a perfect world, simply make that signal louder without distorting it in any appreciable way.
Still, as I said earlier, many Axe-FX users don't seem satisfied with their tone unless they run the Axe-FX's signal through a tube power amp and there are very few tube power amps around that are not designed to colour the signal that is fed to them in some way.
[This is true mostly for guys using a power amp + guitar cabs rig but there are certain hold-outs who insist on using tube power amps to drive passive FRFR monitors as well.]
And the audiophile tube power amps that *are* out there usually don't have enough headroom so that when used by a guitar player on stage they do not go into their non-linear range.
Of course, it's that non-linear response that these guys actually are craving in their tone.
So if you like that tone, it's fine, but it's not really the tone that the Axe-FX was designed to achieve, IMO.
Of course, on the other hand, any tone that can be achieved with the Axe-FX IS a tone that the Axe-FX was designed to create. :)

So, IMO, whether you're driving guitar cabs or an FRFR monitor, the best choice for a power amp will be the one with the flattest response and suitable headroom from driving your speakers at live playing levels.
The power amps made by Canadian company Bryston have the best reputation (that I am aware of).
Of course weight and form factor are issues too and Bryston's power amps are quite heavy (even the 1U @B LP Pro that I own).
Many of us got into using the Axe-FX as a way to reduce the bulk and the weight of our rigs, so lightweight 1U power amps are in fashion among Axe-FX users.
The best sounding 1U, high-power, power amps out there at the moment are being made by Matrix in the UK.
Most Axe-FX users seem to like their GT1000FX 1U power amps for driving their Axe-FX rigs (both FRFR and guitar cabs).

I own and use a GT1000 myself and it does sound very good with the Axe-FX.
But IMO it does seem to colour the tone somewhat but in a way that's fairly musical.
I much prefer the tones I get with my Bryston 2B LP Pro though.
But the 2B weighs as lot more and has a lot less power when I'm using a stereo rig so I usually use the GT1000 which is very lightweight and has tons of power.
Matrix designed the GT1000 specifically for users of guitar modelers like the Axe-FX.
It's predecessor was the GT800 which is also still available.
At some point I plan on buying a GT800 myself because I have a sneaking suspicion that it will have a more linear response than the GT1000.
They modified the response of the GT1000 compared to the GT800 to be more guitar-tube-amp-like and whatever that involved, most Axe-FX users tend to like it.
To me, my GT1000 seems "scooped" compared to my Bryston and I trust the Bryston's accuracy.
The GT800s were modified designs of Matrix's XT800 P.A. amps.
The XT800s have the same type of design philosophy as the Brystons, flat and loud.
The GT800s merely had better connectors and a better input sensitivity than the XT800s but they are essentially P.A. amplifiers too.
Still, most Axe-FX users seem to like the GT1000s over the GT800s.

The Matrix amps are all mosfet, Class A/B designs which is a big part of the reason why they sound somewhat tube-like.
I have yet to hear a Class D power amp that has a pleasing top end, but the Atomic CLRs are using Class D power modules and they sound real good.

So if Meyer is trying to design something that pushes FRFR guitar amp modeling tone to the next level these are the main products and concepts that they will need to somehow transcend.

IMO, of course.

Good luck.
 
Here’s what went down in the studio that day:

After I recorded my parts (as a ghost-player for a wellknown Dutch rockband) the two engineers more or less wanted to put my Axe FX Wireton combination to the test.
So I dialed in some tones of amps that were also present in the studio and played, both the Axe FX simulations and the real amps, through the Wireton cabinet. I didn’t use a drive block and the cabsim was off.

I was standing in the room next to my cabinet and in that acoustically optimised room the difference in feel and sound was (at least to my ears) too close to tell. Hence I got the “amp in the room feel”. This was not a cranked hifiset, this was “the real thing”.

It all got recorded using a mike. So the mike did color the sound I’m sure, but this coloring was the same in all recordings, real and simulated.

Only then I went into the control room to hear what was recorded. Well, the recorded speakerwaves so to speak sounded very alike. The character and gain matched really close and after some knobdialing on the board (no effects, just EQ) the recordings became almost identical.

So I got the amp in the room sensation standing next to my cabinet in an acoustically optimised studioroom and this was (for lack of a better word) more or less “proven” when I heard the recordings back in the control room.

Again, this is not a technical account of what was going on that day, I kinda know my way around a fretboard but, like a said before, I’m somewhat of a buffoon when it comes to the mechanical side of things. I know the Meyer Wireton has some sort of secret gizmo inside but I’m really not sure how that works, I just know how to use it. So I leave it up to the good people at Meyer to pull up that curtain whenever they feel like it.

As for your take on things, that totally makes sense. Too bad you’re on the other side of the globe because I would really like to hear what you would have to say after plugging in to a Wireton. Based on your exeprtise your comments would probably benefit both sides seeing as the Wireton is still a prototype being roadtested by yours truely. But in my opinion (and that’s all it is) Meyer seems to be in the progress of bridging a gap/filling a void here. They are really on to something as far as I’m concerned.
 
Great to see more variety regarding amplification.

Like to hear to the Wireton at some time, and put it up against my CLRs or GT1000 with cab.

Ziet er goed uit, jongens!
 
Will Schut said:
Here’s what went down in the studio that day:

After I recorded my parts (as a ghost-player for a wellknown Dutch rockband) the two engineers more or less wanted to put my Axe FX Wireton combination to the test.
So I dialed in some tones of amps that were also present in the studio and played, both the Axe FX simulations and the real amps, through the Wireton cabinet. I didn’t use a drive block and the cabsim was off.

I was standing in the room next to my cabinet and in that acoustically optimised room the difference in feel and sound was (at least to my ears) too close to tell. Hence I got the “amp in the room feel”. This was not a cranked hifiset, this was “the real thing”.

It all got recorded using a mike. So the mike did color the sound I’m sure, but this coloring was the same in all recordings, real and simulated.

Only then I went into the control room to hear what was recorded. Well, the recorded speakerwaves so to speak sounded very alike. The character and gain matched really close and after some knobdialing on the board (no effects, just EQ) the recordings became almost identical.

So I got the amp in the room sensation standing next to my cabinet in an acoustically optimised studioroom and this was (for lack of a better word) more or less “proven” when I heard the recordings back in the control room.

Again, this is not a technical account of what was going on that day, I kinda know my way around a fretboard but, like a said before, I’m somewhat of a buffoon when it comes to the mechanical side of things. I know the Meyer Wireton has some sort of secret gizmo inside but I’m really not sure how that works, I just know how to use it. So I leave it up to the good people at Meyer to pull up that curtain whenever they feel like it.

As for your take on things, that totally makes sense. Too bad you’re on the other side of the globe because I would really like to hear what you would have to say after plugging in to a Wireton. Based on your exeprtise your comments would probably benefit both sides seeing as the Wireton is still a prototype being roadtested by yours truely. But in my opinion (and that’s all it is) Meyer seems to be in the progress of bridging a gap/filling a void here. They are really on to something as far as I’m concerned.
Click to expand...

Hi Will

Thanks for taking the time to try and clarify what it is that you folks have been doing.
But I'm not really sure if I'm less or more confused now. lol
It sounds like you had a pretty typical experience of running your Axe through a power amp + guitar cab and that you dug the results.
Guitar cabs sound like an "amp-in-the-room" because they are an "amp-in-the-room" as opposed to a mic'd up amp through studio monitors.
I get that same experience every day when I run my Axe-FX into my Matrix GT1000 (or Bryston 2B LP Pro) into my open-back 1 X 12 EVM-12L loaded cabs.
Before I got into Fractal gear I was mainly using Mesa amps through open back 1 X 12 EVM-12L loaded cabs.
One of the things that confirmed for me that the Axe-FX was worth keeping and using was comparing the sound of the Axe's Mesa sims next to my real Mesa amps going through the same cabs.
The Axe sounded as good or better to me.
And I was using an Ultra back then and a ART SLA 1 power amp.
I've since sold off nearly all of my Mesa gear (for some reason I've held on to my Simul-Satellite though) so I can't do that type of comparison any more.
FWIW I also own 2 Atomic CLR powered wedges but have not started using them on gigs yet because I am so addicted to the tone I get through my guitar cabs.

So, the picture in the OP of the Wireton shows some sort of a power amp combined with a speaker cab with at least 2 drivers.
Is that the Wireton "cab" you played in the studio that day or were using using a different cab of theirs and some other sort of power amp?
Assuming the former....
What type of speakers are in the cab and how many of them are in the cab?
I'm assuming it's not an FRFR cab and that there is no tweeter involved. Correct?
The Meyer rep said something about a hybrid power amp involving mosfets (I think).
Usually when folks talk about "hybrid" amps they mean a combination of tubes and solid state of some sort.
Does the Meyer power amp have one or more preamp tubes or power tubes or is it all solid state?
Assuming the latter...
Please describe what power amp you were using to drive the Wireton cab and please give some more details about the actual cab.

Have you tried your Axe-FX yet with any other power amps and guitar cabs and if so were the results markedly inferior to what you achieved that day in the studio with the Wireton rig?
If so, please give us some more details of what types of gear you've already tried that seems to be inferior to what you're achieving with the Wireton.

And I really appreciate the kind words you've sent my way in your last 2 posts.
Thanks.
But...
I have very little "expertise" in anything. lol
I'm just some guy on the Internet.
I *have* been playing guitar professionally for over 40 years though and do have some experience in some relevant areas.
 
Hi Joe,

The good people at Meyer told me they are going to adress your questions very very soon. And just to tell the whole story, for some reason a FRFR amp with a guitarcab, no matter how loud it is, doesn't evoke te amp in the room sensation for me, I keep feeling some sort of hifi vibe there, so it wasn't the cab, it absolutely was the Wireton.

And yes, it was my Wireton cab combined with the Wireton amp (just like in the picture). I think the people at Meyer will tell you more about that cab, all I can say is that it has 4 G12-T 75 Celestion speakers mounted from the outside en can be switched from stereo to mono. However I'm gonna experiment with other speakers, just to find out how that's going to sound. Next up is a set of four Celestion Sidewinders. I just love those speakers, always have and probably always will.
 
Will Schut said:
Hi Joe,

The good people at Meyer told me they are going to adress your questions very very soon. And just to tell the whole story, for some reason a FRFR amp with a guitarcab, no matter how loud it is, doesn't evoke te amp in the room sensation for me, I keep feeling some sort of hifi vibe there, so it wasn't the cab, it absolutely was the Wireton.

And yes, it was my Wireton cab combined with the Wireton amp (just like in the picture). I think the people at Meyer will tell you more about that cab, all I can say is that it has 4 G12-T 75 Celestion speakers mounted from the outside en can be switched from stereo to mono. However I'm gonna experiment with other speakers, just to find out how that's going to sound. Next up is a set of four Celestion Sidewinders. I just love those speakers, always have and probably always will.
Click to expand...

Ah. OK then.
Like I said in my first post in this thread...
Lots of Axe users seem to feel the way you do, namely that the Axe, all by itself, is not capable of fully reproducing the tone and feel of a real tube amp unless the rig that is amplifying the Axe possesses some extra tube, or simulated tube, mojo.

I'm obviously not one of those people.
The design of the Matrix GT1000 is an example of that type of thinking.
Supposedly, it has a little bit extra in its design that makes it respond in a more "tube-like" manner than its predecessor the XT800 which is a P.A. amplifier.
Likewise, lots of folks around here swear by using a Fryette tube driven power amp with their Axe in order to feel like they're getting a true tube amp experience.
The Fryette power amps are probably as flat as you'll find for a guitar-oriented tube power amp at present, but they are by no means flat and do colour the tone.
Several people insist on using a Mesa 2:90 power amp with their Axe despite the knowledge of how much that power amp colours the tone.
Etc., etc.

As for me, I wouldn't be using the Axe-FX if it wasn't giving me all the tube driven vibe I need.
If I thought that the Axe was lacking in that I'd go back to using a Triaxis rig of some sort.
I've also tried my Axe through my guitar cabs with several power amps some very good some not.
Generally speaking, I've been able to get a satisfactory tone out of all of them with a certain amount of tweaking to the Amp Block's Advanced Parameters.
With my Bryston power amp (the best one that I own or have tried) I don't need to do much extra tweaking at all to the Advanced Parameters.
The default Amp Block Advanced Parameters for the various amp sims tend to sound real good and all I need to do is to set the basic tone/drive controls to my needs.
The GT1000 is also pretty good in that respect.
It does sound more scooped in the mids than the Bryston (which is the amp I trust the most for accuracy) but it's a fairly musical sounding effect.

[The only Advanced Parameter that I always use is to set the Speaker Low Resonance to 65 hz because my EV's in an open back cab have a resonant frequency that's pretty close to that, or so I've been told.
Setting it that way does seem to make the amp sims behave more realistically, i.e. as if they are really driving a cab like that, than the usual default settings for this parameter.]

So again I ask, what other power amps have you tried through a 4 X 12 cab using those same Sidewinder drivers?
You can't really make any decent conclusions about one power amp over another unless you've played them through the same cab.

It seems to me that most of the folks who insist on using tube power amps with their Axes are playing heavy rock or metal.
I'm mostly a jazz/R&B guy so I may not be noticing in my tones what they are noticing in theirs.
Still, I really think that if they spent a bit more time tweaking the Advanced Parameters that they could probably achieve just as good a tone from a SS power amp.
That's really what the Advanced Parameters are there for (IMO), i.e. to tailor the Axe's signal to any monitoring system.
 
Thanks for all the comments so far. We are very grateful for this feedback 'from the field'.

First, let me explain a few things what went through our minds when we discussed the idea with Will Schut when designing and building the prototype amp.
The two most important considerations we had to make was:

i) head or combo and
ii) what kind of technology for amplification would it the needs

The choice for building a head or a combo was a bit more complex than only the pro and contra's which hold for all guitar and bass amp in general. All connectors on the back side of the axe-fx should be accessible at all times. Initially this would be easy to accomplish when the axe-fx is build in a head. On the other hand, with the axe-fx built in a combo there are some neat options to redirect all connectors to an easy accessible panel on the back side of the combo.

Another issues for mounting the axe-fx in a head is the depth of the axe-fx itself. With 14.25" (362mm) for te axe-fx II and XL this would make a head with at least this depth and some one or two inches more for construction, so definatly not a small head. The depth of the axe-fx is no issue for a 2x12 combo. The top panel of the axe-fx could be mounted flush to the back panel of the combo with its front panel facing upward.

We realize that the head or combo paradigm largely depends on personal preference. It is also a fact that the head version has a lot of similarities with an axe-fx build together with an 19” stereo amplifier in a rack. On the other hand, a lot of guitarist would like to enter the stage with a guitar case in one hand and an amplifier (combo) in the other hand, ready to set-up and to play. Using the axe-fx in a powered combo like the Wireton would serve this guitar man his needs.

Than we have the technical considerations for powering the axe-fx. Our company is based on al tube technology, so our initial thoughts about amplifying the axe-fx would be using tube technology. Considering the capabilities of the axe-fx we realized that these two technologies do not comply. As mentioned in the feedback, we would need a full range with flat response amplifier with sufficient stereo power. We did extensively experiment with conventional bi-polar semiconductors (transistor), mosfet and digital class-D technolgy. Soon it showed that mosfet technology was the way to go, not saying that both other techniques are not capable to serve our needs, but the results did show such good results with respect to continuous and peak power, flat response and still some kind of tube feel, although we were not looking for that specifically.

Well, some noticed a control on the front panel of the Wireton of Will Schut, reading “ terrestrial reflection”. Of course this is just a bit of fun. This control makes it possible to adapt the power amp / speaker interaction. The technical explanation would take too much space here, but it controls the amount of speaker characteristics what is heard back in the total sound of the complete amplifier. In fact it controls the output impedance (or damping factor) of the power amp. We are still experimenting with this control but it is a key in the 'amp in the room' goal.

Furthermore we used similar ideas as we do with our tube amplifiers. Things like a short signal path, minimal (local) feedback and minor audio filtering showed that these construction we constructed an amplifier with some kind of real instrument feel. In fact, we think that a pure frfr amplifier should not be the goal on its own.

Thanks again for all the feedback 'till now, and keep on shooting to our concept.
 
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