AXE-FX vs BIAS Comparison

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I'm going to do a more thorough comparison in an ML Sound Lab Episode comparin how the EQs work etc since it's a bit hard to describe by just writing it down but here's a relatively fair comparison of the two.

Both modelers have tone matching and you can use custom IRs etc. so I decided to use the same IR (Cab Pack 12) for both so we can concentrate on just comparing the amp modeling. I didn't touch any of the advanced settings as both of them have a lot of those.

Here's a comparison with noonish settings modeling the Marshall JCM800:

Axe-Fx


BIAS


Here's a comparison with noonish settings modeling the Mesa Rectifier:

Axe-Fx


BIAS


I do think BIAS is a handy tool to have in your DAW and for playing at home for fun. I don't think I would use it for serious recording because of the noise level and also the EQ doesn't quite "work" the way an amp EQ is supposed to work if you ask me.

As you might notice noise is a big issue in BIAS. Sure there's a noise gate which I didn't use for these clips. I might do that in the video comparison but still a noise gate is IMO not comparable to having no noise to begin with. :)

What do you think? :)

EDIT: Check for a noise-free clip below!
 
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Nice comparison, thanks for that!

I also have done some comparisons between Bias and the AxeFx II at home. I found Bias sounds good, but it doesn't have the level of dynamics and realism that the AxeFx has, even when using the same IRs.

A big contributing factor to the noise is the interface you use. The Hi Z input on most USB audio interfaces is crap, even on more expensive interfaces. For instance, I have an RME Fireface 400, which is supposed to be pretty good quality, but the Hi Z input is very noisy. I get much better signal quality when using my Radial J48 into a mic input. Even a cheap Behringer DI into a mic input gave me a much cleaner signal than the interface Hi Z input. If Fractal ever made an active DI with the high-quality guitar input from the Axe Fx (including the 'special sauce') that would be a very nice product.
 
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Well obviously the noise is an issue. Is there definitely nothing wrong?

The BIAS Dual Rectifier is missing a lot of the low end. The Axe FX one has the 'sub' punch thing going on. I know a lot of that gets cut out in mixing but it should be there to begin with if it is being an accurate model. I've actually tried a Roadster into a 5153 cab in real life and I think the cab is cool but it isn't as controlled as putting it through a Mesa V30 cab for the low end. With the real amp I really prefer a Rectifier through a Rectifier cab, it seems to give the most balanced low end. Sometimes other cabs can be quite boomy and too loose with modern mode on the Rectifier. Orange/Vintage sounds killer with the cab though.

The BIAS 800 seemed a bit thin sounding. Quite crazy how different it sounds
 
I used Amplitube 3 a lot before I got the Axe and noise was a huge issue. I kind of figured it was my gear, but it's super evident in those recordings too.

Nice demo. It's very evident which is better, but for someone who doesn't have the cash and can figure out how to tame the hoards of noise, BIAS seems like a good option.
 
Badass demo, CK.....I used BIAS for a while and JamUp for over a year before I got my AxeII; haven't touched it since.

Like Arjan said above, the level of dynamics and realism just isn't there......it's an approximation, and it's done well at the price point, but the people that say there's really no difference between the Axe and other modelers either haven't played both or just plain can't hear or feel the difference. To those people I say "you might not hear a difference, but I guarantee the people listening to your recordings can.".

I liked BIAS/JamUp as an interim solution, and I think to me it was a crucial step on my modeling journey....but for me there's no way at all it can even come close to the Axe, and this is coming from a guy that's owned one for a month and compared objectively to all the modelers in my possession.....before I sold them as they weren't needed anymore.;)
 
Ignoring the Axe Fx entirely: it's been obvious to me from clips and YouTubes that BIAS is nothing special. I don't think it's even POD HD quality modeling and frankly I don't understand why people are getting excited about it. I feel like they've just bolted meh preamp modeling to high quality modern IRs and that's that. Take their Recto - the sound is largely consistent with a tweaked 'generic' amp simulation on a generic (Marshall type?) tone stack and negative feedback shut off.

And what the hell is with the noise floor? What is that at, -10 dB? Forget a noise gate, it's clearly audible inside the actual performance. That really doesn't seem right to me and I would question whether there's an issue with your setup.

Again, this isn't even thinking about the Axe. I feel like you could compete with the BIAS on tone by hooking a POD XT 3.0 to a good IR. The Eleven Rack and POD HD preamp sims are significantly stronger, and even with their relatively lacking cabs I think they turn in a better final sound. Look up clips of those modelers and tell me if you actually think BIAS is competitive.
 
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For me, BIAS would make a pretty cool practice tool, but not much beyond that. It would be great to be able to have decent enough sounding tones in a laptop to take on the road with me at work to practice along to iTunes, transcribe, YouTube or other common practice sources without having to have another piece of equipment to transport other than a very small usb interface. It sounds ok for that. I STILL use Line 6 gearbox for this purpose, and have been for many years. (I'm not hauling my Axe all over creation just to practice in some hotel room on a work trip.

But, I've not heard a single thing from BIAS that leads me to think it could match or compete with a real amp or an Axe-FX for either recording or live use. It's just not in the same league. But for a practice setup, or making demo's on the road... at the price point... it's good. I'm not sure it's any better than the newer Line 6 stuff though from what I've heard (which has only been a little bit... 3 or 4 demo's)
 
Pretty good job there :)

The noise in the BIAS examples is ridiculous. Unusable and always apparent even during riffage, so not good...

Thing is, I've certainly not heard it to that degree on my BIAS / JamUp iPad Apps...
 
Noise aside... I gotta say that is pretty impressive for a $180 VST.
But then again, this is high-gain...

The weak spot of modellers is usually dynamics and low-to-mid gain settings. Maybe you could run a comparison of "on the edge of breakup" tones?
 
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Pretty good job there :)

The noise in the BIAS examples is ridiculous. Unusable and always apparent even during riffage, so not good...

Thing is, I've certainly not heard it to that degree on my BIAS / JamUp iPad Apps...

I hear the same noise if I don't use a noise gate (on BIAS/JamUp on my iPad).

Derail: is there any way to load an IR to the iPad version of BIAS?
 
I'll try and get rid of the noise somehow. Maybe if I use the Axe-Fx as a sound card I can get rid of some of it. :)
 
You could record the dry tone from the AXE FX and then it would pretty much be an exact comparison since it is the same level and conversion.

Something is wrong with all the noise there. Hi gain channels on real amps do have a good amount of noise, even when you gate the input there is still some. The only way on a real amp is to run the gate in the loop which eliminates noise. So maybe this is there interpretation of how much noise would be present at certain gain levels.
 
You could record the dry tone from the AXE FX and then it would pretty much be an exact comparison since it is the same level and conversion.

Something is wrong with all the noise there. Hi gain channels on real amps do have a good amount of noise, even when you gate the input there is still some. The only way on a real amp is to run the gate in the loop which eliminates noise. So maybe this is there interpretation of how much noise would be present at certain gain levels.

The signal you hear in the first clip is coming from the looper of the Axe-Fx. I also thought that there must be something wrong.. then I watched a few BIAS clips on YouTube and noticed that most people have a lot of noise in their clips that has been noise gated but you still hear it. I'll try and get it lower somehow but the way I had it right now would be the use case for most people. My sound card at home is more expensive than the BIAS itself and if something even more expensive is required then the price tag for proper tones with BIAS is a lot higher. :)

EDIT: I just tried it with Axe-Fx as the interface and the noise problem is gone! It's way better without the noise. I'll have a better comparison soon. Still... the noise issue something people without high end gear may face.
 
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Okay now it's a lot better:



1st Axe-Fx Recto
2nd BIAS Recto
3rd BIAS Match EQ'd to sound close to Axe-Fx Recto so you can hear the dynamic differences better

So I think I gave BIAS a fair chance especially with running it through the Axe-Fx interface for zero noise and Cab Pack 7 in this latest clip. When ever I tweak BIAS EQ I'm not going for turn bass for more bass or treble for more treble. I turn the knobs to find out if it "sounds less broken". That may sound mean but essentially that's how it feels for me. If match EQ fixes it then I'm sure that's good enough for many people. However in that case I must say that Overloud TH2 sounds maybe even better for that. I know the interface is not very handy but the amp modeling is surprisingly good on that one.
 
BIAS seems to have some added bass noise (sounds like a rubbing sound) that the tone match either brought in or couldn't get rid of. Or maybe it is just the difference in playing between takes that I am hearing.

Maybe. I am listening at work. It may not translate to proper monitors
 
EDIT: I just tried it with Axe-Fx as the interface and the noise problem is gone! It's way better without the noise. I'll have a better comparison soon. Still... the noise issue something people without high end gear may face.
Yes. As I wrote in my earlier post, the Hi Z input on most interfaces is not very good. Using the AxeFx as the interface solves that, but you also get reasonably good results using the guitar into a separate DI into a mic input on your audio interface.
 
Without having a copy of bias and time to feel comfortable with making a call on it. But there are noticeable differences, but that could be considered a testing "bias" in that your extremely proficient and use to working with the Axe-fx.

Though I am less inclined to want to take a laptop with me for complex signal processing on the road. The latency by itself is something of a worry to me that would definitely drive me nuts and ruin my playing experience. Its a prime example of why a dedicated piece of hardware like the Axe-fx is ideal for such uses. Rather than a multipurpose piece of hardware adapted to something else where a large number of compromises are made in latency and I/O area.
 
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