Axe-Fx Tone Imprinting. Guitar Profiler Tone-Match Cloner (Guitar Vault, Season III) ~ SIM1 XT-1

I have a Roland VG-99.
Do I achieve the same with it as that device? - SIM1

Much better results than the SIM1. Specially with the Nylon, Acoustic and Bass models. The only issue is that at the VG-99/VG-8/VG-88/SY-1000/GP-10 you only have a factory predefined set of guitars. You cannot add or purchase new modeled guitars
 
Much better results than the SIM1.

How so? I've been looking for some sample comparisons of the VG-99 pickup models vs. the specific pickups they're based on and I haven't been able to find any, so I'm not sure how accurate the VG-99's pickup models actually are.
 
The Sim1 is fantastic. In terms of useability, it is frustrating. No USB data connection for editing, slow boot-up. The whole experience makes me cringe, but it sounds BRILLIANT. It is better than a Variax (I have a JTV and 300) but the Sim1 is in a different league IMO. The models sound (and feel) great. I use a 10-band EQ pedal after mine, just to tailor things further going into certain amp models, but the Sim1 blew me away when I first used it.
 
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The Sim1 is fantastic. In terms of useability, it is frustrating. No USB data connection for editing, slow boot-up. The whole experience makes me cringe, but it sounds BRILLIANT. It is better than a Variax (I have a JTV and 300) but the Sim1 is in a different league IMO. The models sound (and feel) great. I use a 10-band EQ pedal after mine, just to tailor things further going into certain amp models, but the Sim1 blew me away when I first used it.

Personally, I want one. The A/B samples I've heard that compare the reference to the imprint are very convincing to my ears. The advantage of the Sim1 is that you're not limited to guitars/pickups provided by the developers.
 
How so? I've been looking for some sample comparisons of the VG-99 pickup models vs. the specific pickups they're based on and I haven't been able to find any, so I'm not sure how accurate the VG-99's pickup models actually are.


Strat,Tele,LP,P-90,Lips,335,L4,Modern Strat,
Acoustics - D 28, J 45, B25, D40
Sitar,Nylon String,Resonator,Banjo


Bass
 


Strat,Tele,LP,P-90,Lips,335,L4,Modern Strat,
Acoustics - D 28, J 45, B25, D40
Sitar,Nylon String,Resonator,Banjo


Bass


I've heard demos. I'd like to hear some side-by-side comparisons of the guitar and pickup models against the actual guitars and pickups that the models are based on.
 
Love the SimXt. Since I got my MusicMan, every other guitar is difficult to play, and now I can make my Luke sound like anything.
 

I had the VG99, (but not using it anymore) and now I have the SIM1, but the best thing would be to have everything under one hood of the AXE3. I just wanted to ask if you have Strat Pickup Profiles. That's all I want. I mainly use the SIM1 not to simulate a Strat, but to play my Strat and give it some more glassy extra kick. The SIM1 can produce very nice tones, but the handling is not very good. Perfect Pickup Simulation on the AXE3 would be a dream come true...
 
I had the VG99, (but not using it anymore) and now I have the SIM1, but the best thing would be to have everything under one hood of the AXE3. I just wanted to ask if you have Strat Pickup Profiles. That's all I want. I mainly use the SIM1 not to simulate a Strat, but to play my Strat and give it some more glassy extra kick. The SIM1 can produce very nice tones, but the handling is not very good. Perfect Pickup Simulation on the AXE3 would be a dream come true...

I have profiles of my Schecter Nick Johnston USA Strat with Seymour Duncan Antiquity Texas Hot. They have a nice glassy chime. They are shared at the OP
 
Thank you very much I didn't know that the Schecter is a Strat. I saw that you also provided this preset: TM NJneck - Z90neck 5AM
So I will give it a try. I am curious now. I have forgotten to include in my SIM1 Preset List a Bridge Middle Pickup Preset. I would take me all in all like 10 Minutes to add this because there is now direct USB Connection - well, this is something that should take 20 seconds. Just as a sidenote. If you like glassy Strat Tones then have a listen to this beautiful Zappa Strat Solo:

This is one of the tones I have fallen in love with. OK, there is more to it. For example holding the plectrum very close toward the neck and, well it would also be nice to be able to play like Zappa;).
 
It would be nice if someone else collaborated by adding his pickup/guitar profiles. It is pointless to play with my profiles of the guitars that I already own. The objective of this is to share, create a repository, and play with profiles of guitars that we do not own.

The process is simple:
  1. Create a DAW project with the metronome set at 60 bmp and tempo 2/4
  2. Record a guitar track for each pickup using the Axe-FX III USB Instr Input (dry signal)
  3. Play 36 notes of a chromatic scale starting at 6th open string (follow the pattern below)
  4. Record with the metronome. One measure (2 seconds) per note
  5. Export the individual DAW tracks to 48kHz WAV files
  6. Name the files as [GuitarName - PickupPosition - PickupType.wav]
xt-1-learning-procedure-png.70888
 
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Tone Matching Tips:
  • I get good results with smoothing between 80% and 85%
  • I have to increase TMA level around +8dB to match the level with the source
  • Doing A/B comparisons between the guitars (using the looper for the matched guitar) I find that I have to insert a PEQ after the TMA. e.g.: LO Shelving +4dB@400HZ, Hi Block -3dB@3kHz (depending on each individual case)

Interesting that a high cut is needed. This reminds me of how the various guitar models in the VG-99 would sound running through a real high gain amp in that there was an inherent hiss in the modelled signal.

I'm really curious about what the XT-1 actually does to achieve it's tone matching because even though it's asking for such a long series of notes, there is no polyphonic per string processing going on while you play live. Unless perhaps what it does is take readings from all those pitches it receives during the profiling procedure, and then when the pedal is live, it applies a pitch detector (maybe polyphonic) to vary the shape of the applied eq curve as you move up and down the neck. Just a guess that might also explain why there isn't any latency, because the pitch tracking is just modifying the eq.

To actually model the harmonic content of each note on each string though, you would not only need a multichannel pickup, but also a neck with wired frets that would trigger each eq curve for each note...madness!

So i think with the Axe's Tone Match when used for guitar matching, you end up with a very accurate static snapshot of another instrument that isn't dynamic.

This is also where a polyphonic pickup combined with a discreet formant shifter on each string would also be pretty wild, as some of the tonal differences between scale lengths (and even string gauge) have a few things in common with the change in tone of a formant shift. You can try this is in Melodyne for example and radically change the formant of a recorded guitar or bass DI.
 
Interesting that a high cut is needed. This reminds me of how the various guitar models in the VG-99 would sound running through a real high gain amp in that there was an inherent hiss in the modelled signal.

I'm really curious about what the XT-1 actually does to achieve it's tone matching because even though it's asking for such a long series of notes, there is no polyphonic per string processing going on while you play live. Unless perhaps what it does is take readings from all those pitches it receives during the profiling procedure, and then when the pedal is live, it applies a pitch detector (maybe polyphonic) to vary the shape of the applied eq curve as you move up and down the neck. Just a guess that might also explain why there isn't any latency, because the pitch tracking is just modifying the eq.

To actually model the harmonic content of each note on each string though, you would not only need a multichannel pickup, but also a neck with wired frets that would trigger each eq curve for each note...madness!

So i think with the Axe's Tone Match when used for guitar matching, you end up with a very accurate static snapshot of another instrument that isn't dynamic.

This is also where a polyphonic pickup combined with a discreet formant shifter on each string would also be pretty wild, as some of the tonal differences between scale lengths (and even string gauge) have a few things in common with the change in tone of a formant shift. You can try this is in Melodyne for example and radically change the formant of a recorded guitar or bass DI.

The XT-1 doesn't have any pitch-detection or polyphonic processing. It is just a Tone Matching processor, exactly the same technology as the Tone Match block at our Axe-FX. The reason for asking a series of notes for the tone-imprint is simply to have a consistent sample for matching the two guitars. That gives much better results than matching with random playing.

I do not see the need to purchase the XT-1 while having the Axe-FX III, unless you want to have access to the (paid) collection of guitar tone-imprints that they offer. Our problem is that nobody seems to be interested in sharing the tone-imprints of their guitars :(

I have a friend who works in a guitar shop in Barcelona. I was planning to go last year with a portable recorder, to take samples of a variety of guitars. But covid frustrated my travel plan
 
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Hey there @Piing

I am interested in this tone matching. I havnt got time for this at the moment but i will do a match with my guitar when the opportunity of time arrives.

Guitar: EB majesty 7 string pieso and HH - DiMarzio Illuminators

I have added a diagram of possible sounds with the pups.

Question:
As you are allready known with the tonematching, is every option possible to record and re-use?



Cheers

Majestyselector.jpg
 
BUMP!

Nobody sharing profiles of their guitars?
I created some profiles of my Yamaha SG3000 with Spinex pickups.
I then tried to match my SG2000 which resulted in something I would consider close enough. Below is an image of the TMA match which I think shows what I also hear: the SG3000 has a lot more (piercing) highs compared to the SG2000.

The .wav files with the profile are to large (22MB) to attach. What would be a good way to share them? I'm curious if other people like them (although these are a bit extreme maybe). I will also try to create profiles of some other guitars (if there is still some interest).

Capture.PNG
 
I created some profiles of my Yamaha SG3000 with Spinex pickups.
I then tried to match my SG2000 which resulted in something I would consider close enough. Below is an image of the TMA match which I think shows what I also hear: the SG3000 has a lot more (piercing) highs compared to the SG2000.

The .wav files with the profile are to large (22MB) to attach. What would be a good way to share them? I'm curious if other people like them (although these are a bit extreme maybe). I will also try to create profiles of some other guitars (if there is still some interest).

View attachment 84270
That looks great! You can upload the file to services like https://mega.io/ or https://www.dropbox.com/

I am looking forward to test it :)
 
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