• We would like to remind our members that this is a privately owned, run and supported forum. You are here at the invitation and discretion of the owners. As such, rules and standards of conduct will be applied that help keep this forum functioning as the owners desire. These include, but are not limited to, removing content and even access to the forum.

    Please give yourself a refresher on the forum rules you agreed to follow when you signed up.

Axe-Fx III in Music Radar

ML SOUND LAB

Cab Pack Wizard
Vendor
widely praised for their bass drive sound.
Not saying that this isn't true but I disagree. Sure these are all opinions and there's no wrong or right here but I personally don't think most Ampegs even with their gain at full deliver a driven sound. Maybe something like edge of breakup but once again it's IMO not the best kind of preamp to be driven... since it wasn't built for that. Even the amp maker specifically warns you not to do that:

The main reason why I'm against more bass models is because I understand time limits. The time put into new bass amp sims that I'm pretty sure will not be used much by the majority of people could be used for so many important things like having Preset-Cab Bundles in the Axe-Fx III, which is IMO a high priority feature.

And if people want more bass gear, why not add something that's actually used a lot in the industry like the Sansamp pedal instead of amp models? Still I'll repeat my original point. There are many guitar amp sims that sound amazing with bass like Vox type amps among other things that would most likely break if used with bass guitar in real life. If only people used their ears and didn't care too much about what gear some well known bass players are playing.
 

B:ASSMASTER

Experienced
For certain genres of music, you can be perfectly fine with only the bass DI. However, for rock and metal, I like to use a gritty or distorted track blended with the DI. I've used anything from a pushed bass amp, guitar amp, pedal to even a plug-in. Cab IR's are a must the more distortion you go. I filter the tracks so that the DI is just pure low-end and the distorted track is only 500Hz and above. This is just my way of handling bass in a recording situation. I'd be happy with the addition of either the Sansamp pedal or something like an Ampeg B-15. :)
 

jimfist

Fractal Fanatic
Hmmm. I guess I've been cowed by all of those bass amp/cab manufacturers for all of these years. I thought I was seeking and purchasing real hardware amps and cabs that had a very specific quality of tone (and drive) and ones that were clearly recognizable as signature sounds from their respective manufacturers (Ampeg, Acoustic, SWR, GK, Hartke, et al).

With all due respect, the way some of the dismissiveness comes across is disappointing...really. It's not that the opinions and facts surrounding bass recording and console interface are incorrect, but I don't understand the blind spot - that this is the beginning and end of the story WRT bass sounds, as if various bass amps and cabinets have no identifiable character of their own.

If Jaco were alive today, would some of you please inform him that he's wasting his time using that Acoustic rig?

Regarding other modeler manufacturers, they're at least actively trying to capture some of the variation that exist between different amp models, cabinets, and pedals. And those end users who appreciate these variations seem to enjoy the products that provide them. This proves that there is not really a technical reason why bassists cannot be indulged, but just a lack of desire. That's OK, though, I'm sure there's another odd combination of settings for the Mesa Boogie Triaxis that needs modeling. ;-)
 

B:ASSMASTER

Experienced
Even the amp maker specifically warns you not to do that
However, hitting the rails on a GK gives off a unique and musical distortion. But it's different in the GK because it's happening in the power amp section. This kinda ties in with what @jimfist said about hardware amps having recognizable signature sounds.
 

ML SOUND LAB

Cab Pack Wizard
Vendor
Like I said in my last post. The only reason I'm against new bass amp sims is that it would be time away from more important things that are still missing. This is a guitar modeler first and foremost. Sure there's no piece of gear that I wouldn't mind having in this unit. Still it's one thing to request features but demanding features based on a much inferior modeler having them is a bit weird. Sometimes I feel like we're not thankful enough for all the hundreds of awesome features that our units have that no other modeler has... we just got two new Friedman HBEs. That's a 4000€ amp in Europe.

If you go through the classes/courses from the biggest names in the industry (Pensado's place is a good free one that I highly recommend. They discuss Andy Wallace, Chris Lord-Alge and everyone who made the bass tones I'm sure we're all talking about) you'll hear them deeply analyze different DIs and compressors that they specifically love to use for bass, you will rarely if ever hear them talk about bass amps in other use cases besides getting a blend signal that they usually end up not using in the final mix. You will hear some people talk about Darkglass and Sansamp, not bass amps. Both Cliff and Matt work with the biggest names in the industry on a weekly basis so they know what they're talking about as well. If we're not talking about studio tones or direct FOH signals then I'd look for other places to blame for a lacking bass tone as I don't think any FRFR system out there pushes like a real bass amp with a 4x10/8x10 cab.
 

Rick

Fractal Fanatic
"While we’re blown away by the articulation of some of the more saturated models like the jumpered Plexi, it’s actually the 5F8 Tweed that has us staying put the longest."

Having recently had the same experience, I easily agree with this part.

The fact that you can jump from djent to "single coil blues heaven" without ever unplugging your guitar cord alone makes the "pricey" comment fairly moot. It always surprises me that a box that covers this much ground, and costs less than ONE pro tube amp, can be called pricey.
 

hippietim

Fractal Fanatic
I do think the Helix has it way over on the Axe in terms of bass, though.

Not in my experience. Some of the best bass tones I've ever gotten in my life have been with the AX8. I actually have not even tried playing bass with the III because I've barely been playing bass lately.
 

hippietim

Fractal Fanatic
Whenever my band would go in the studio we would DI the bass. We NEVER mic'd a bass amp. NONE of the engineers or producers would even consider doing that. A good preamp like an Avalon is the gold standard. Then it's compression and EQ.

I have an Avalon U5 for this very purpose. I've gigged it many times. I'll usually run a compressor in front of it and that's it.
 

AdmiralB

Inspired
Not in my experience. Some of the best bass tones I've ever gotten in my life have been with the AX8. I actually have not even tried playing bass with the III because I've barely been playing bass lately.

Yes, the Axe(s) do great bass tones. But IME you have to work at it, because there are so few dedicated bass objects. Almost all guitar amps, aside from the more modern, higher-gain models will do fantastic bass tones, because you don't have to crank them in the virtual world to get volume. But you can't plug-and-play as easily.

The Helix has more bass objects, and it's easier to say "SVT, cab, boom".
 
I think bass players overall would be happy with even 10% of the consideration of guitar players. We don't need 40 amps; the Ampeg B15, SVT, and a Clean amp would cover most people's basses (I had to, sorry).

On the same note, 3 or 4 bass-centric drives and a few bass friendly compressors (which usually sound awesome for guitar too) would round things out and keep us from complaining for entire minutes to come.
 

FractalAudio

Administrator
Fractal Audio Systems
Moderator
I think bass players overall would be happy with even 10% of the consideration of guitar players. We don't need 40 amps; the Ampeg B15, SVT, and a Clean amp would cover most people's basses (I had to, sorry).

On the same note, 3 or 4 bass-centric drives and a few bass friendly compressors (which usually sound awesome for guitar too) would round things out and keep us from complaining for entire minutes to come.
There's already an SVT model and several cleanish bass amp models.
 

unix-guy

Legend!
On the same note, 3 or 4 bass-centric drives and a few bass friendly compressors (which usually sound awesome for guitar too) would round things out and keep us from complaining for entire minutes to come.

So what would you consider a "bass friendly compressor"?

Is there something the Studio and Optical compressors don't cover?
 
1176 was always my go to in my studio days. I have a Cali76 that I use with my current rig. The Axe III replaced everything but that. The LA2A is also another really popular one. The Axe III Studio compressor sounds like a generic VCA compressor to me. Not a bad thing, just kind of limited use if you're not going for that tone. I've tried to get the optical block to sound like a LA2A. I had limited success but I didn't try that hard. It was more an experiment when I saw it mentioned in the wiki than anything else. The modern option is the Distressor. Since bass usually has so few components to the tone, individual things like compression are far more important to the tone than on a guitar where a lot of the dynamic range reduction is happening in other effects like drives and amps. I'm sure guitarists would love some of these options too though.

I use the SVT amp for my dirty bass tone and use no amp model for my clean. I was speaking about what bass players are looking for in general. The Axe FX a lot of what we need. It was enough for me to purchase it. We don't have any vintage tones represented like Sunn or older Ampeg. The B7k is hugely satisfying from a bass drive standpoint. A few more like that and euphonic joy would be mine.
 

SeeD

Fractal Fanatic
It`s been a log time since i have posted something.

hmmm, I like to play my bass at rehearsal.. i like to record my bass .. i like to sit and just play my bass sometimes ...i like to play live with my bass..
With all of these i would like to have a few more Bass amps ..a few more bass preamps .. pedals..

We dont "Only" "record" with bass you know. We have a place in music to..

Man.. :)
My 2 cents
 
Top Bottom