Axe-Fx III Firmware Version 20.01 Public Beta 2 (Beta 5)

[trancegodz]

Yes, there's a mistake in the update function and the new values aren't getting applied for recently created presets. This is fixed for the official release (and why we do beta releases).

I noticed that I had to reset the amp for the speaker Imp. curve to update for the Basketweave cabinet, and that the curve is different than before. The new Basketweave curve sounds really good, but you have to reset the amp for it to show up.

 

[ccc118]

Yes, there's a mistake in the update function and the new values aren't getting applied for recently created presets. This is fixed for the official release (and why we do beta releases).

Awesome, thanks!

 

[Feflicker]

Very similar wow.

As it’s dangerous to put 2 heads in the same cab, how did he manage that ? Extra box ? Or the cab is wired in 2X 2x12 ?
What is the best way to plug two heads in the same cab ?

If they were feeding the amps DI of the same exact guitar output it would be even more similar

 

[Sashman]

I am not asking you to trust me on this , trust your ears



but I was talking more the actual circuit design more than the sound .

Anyway I don't want to Off topic to much in this thread as it is about new firmware

Just a short OT
Thank You!
I could never bond with the SLO but after that Video, I tried the SLO with the York Audio Bogner cab pack and what should I say, holy moly it’s my favorite combination right now!

 

[State of Epicicity]

There's a phenomenon I've encountered on different amps, but trying out the Del Fuego, I encountered it again, and I'm wondering if anyone could name what this is called. It's like you strike the interval, then these robots appear hovering above you, and this shimmery laser sound creeps in. I've heard this kind of thing before also when I push the input of an amp too far with too much bass in a pedal.

This is the Diamante Fire model, diming the Gain & Tone, into Factory Cab Bank 1 #811, 2x12 Brown Super 57 A. I'm on my bridge humbucker, volume & tone on 10, playing this obscure theme no one has ever heard before on the 3rd & 4th strings at the beginning. This tone just sounds like the whole thing is going to fall apart, but I just wanted to show an extreme example of this phenomenon. I'm really dragging out the intervals at the beginning so you can hear the laser sounds that appear. The rest of this rendition is quick and crappy, and doesn't matter so much after the first measures, but you can hear the lasers in other spots too. I'm guessing this is because my humbucker is too hot, too bassy, or something like that, for me to be able to dime the amp this way and punish the input. Of course backing off the volume knob on the guitar makes the lasers go away.

I was wondering if this was either crossover distortion or blocking distortion, both of which I looked up examples of on YouTube, but it didn't seem like either was the case, from my total layman's gleaning. I've always wondered if there's a name for this, other than overloading the input, and I wonder if tweaking advanced parameters can lessen the effect, or you just have to shape the input signal better, which is the whole point of an overdrive pedal. I feel really dumb asking this question, but my curiosity outweighs my embarrassment.

I looked at Leon's video of the Blankenship Leeds model from a couple of years ago, where he dimes the controls on that amp, and when I tried it with that amp, I experienced the same phenomenon. What was crazy was, I didn't hear his playing elicit the same laser sound; I even copped the same licks and riffs he was improvising, but with the full tilt all on 10 tones he didn't seem to be overloading the amp in that particular way, although our signal strength was similar. Of course that doesn't at all mean the frequency response of our pickups is similar. Thanks in advance for any thoughts on this!

 

[Rex]

There's a phenomenon I've encountered on different amps, but trying out the Del Fuego, I encountered it again, and I'm wondering if anyone could name what this is called. It's like you strike the interval, then these robots appear hovering above you, and this shimmery laser sound creeps in. I've heard this kind of thing before also when I push the input of an amp too far with too much bass in a pedal.

This is the Diamante Fire model, diming the Gain & Tone, into Factory Cab Bank 1 #811, 2x12 Brown Super 57 A. I'm on my bridge humbucker, volume & tone on 10, playing this obscure theme no one has ever heard before on the 3rd & 4th strings at the beginning. This tone just sounds like the whole thing is going to fall apart, but I just wanted to show an extreme example of this phenomenon. I'm really dragging out the intervals at the beginning so you can hear the laser sounds that appear. The rest of this rendition is quick and crappy, and doesn't matter so much after the first measures, but you can hear the lasers in other spots too. I'm guessing this is because my humbucker is too hot, too bassy, or something like that, for me to be able to dime the amp this way and punish the input. Of course backing off the volume knob on the guitar makes the lasers go away.

I was wondering if this was either crossover distortion or blocking distortion, both of which I looked up examples of on YouTube, but it didn't seem like either was the case, from my total layman's gleaning. I've always wondered if there's a name for this, other than overloading the input, and I wonder if tweaking advanced parameters can lessen the effect, or you just have to shape the input signal better, which is the whole point of an overdrive pedal. I feel really dumb asking this question, but my curiosity outweighs my embarrassment.

I looked at Leon's video of the Blankenship Leeds model from a couple of years ago, where he dimes the controls on that amp, and when I tried it with that amp, I experienced the same phenomenon. What was crazy was, I didn't hear his playing elicit the same laser sound; I even copped the same licks and riffs he was improvising, but with the full tilt all on 10 tones he didn't seem to be overloading the amp in that particular way, although our signal strength was similar. Of course that doesn't at all mean the frequency response of our pickups is similar. Thanks in advance for any thoughts on this!

What you're hearing is intermodulation distortion. It happens whenever you combine two or more notes, and then distort the resulting signal.

Intermodulation distortion (IM) bears only a random harmonic relationship to the notes played. If you play a perfect fifth, the IM isn't dissonant. That's why power chords work so well — they're all fifths, and nothing else. Other intervals are more dissonant. In that clip, you play plenty of intervals that fall outside the diatonic scale, so you get some wicked-dissonant IM. That's why most people play that song with an undistorted tone.

 

[State of Epicicity]

What you're hearing is intermodulation distortion. It happens whenever you combine two or more notes, and then distort the resulting signal.

Intermodulation distortion (IM) bears only a random harmonic relationship to the notes played. If you play a perfect fifth, the IM isn't dissonant. That's why power chords work so well — they're all fifths, and nothing else. Other intervals are more dissonant. In that clip, you play plenty of intervals that fall outside the diatonic scale, so you get some wicked-dissonant IM.

Thanks for that. I should clarify that I’ve had this kind of distortion on single notes too, and the first interval I hit here is a fourth, which is in tune but still exhibits this weird behavior; the minor and major chords just have intermodulation distortion mixed in, exaggerating the clusterf**k. I am familiar with intermodulation distortion, since that occurs in any amp that’s gained up when you hit a non-compensated third or other interval that is dissonant with the strongest parts of the overtone series. By “non-compensated,” I mean you didn’t bend or retune it to be in tune for thirds, at which point you’re sacrificing your fourths and fifths. Intermodulation distortion also would not explain why, when I copied the riffs and licks in Leon’s Blankenship Leeds video, using his IR and amp settings, I got this laser distortion but he didn’t seem to.

 

[spikey]

Thanks, Boss!

 

[Rex]

Thanks for that. I should clarify that I’ve had this kind of distortion on single notes too, and the first interval I hit here is a fourth, which is in tune but still exhibits this weird behavior; the minor and major chords just have intermodulation distortion mixed in, exaggerating the clusterf**k. I am familiar with intermodulation distortion, since that occurs in any amp that’s gained up when you hit a non-compensated third or other interval that is dissonant with the strongest parts of the overtone series. By “non-compensated,” I mean you didn’t bend or retune it to be in tune for thirds, at which point you’re sacrificing your fourths and fifths. Intermodulation distortion also would not explain why, when I copied the riffs and licks in Leon’s Blankenship Leeds video, using his IR and amp settings, I got this laser distortion but he didn’t seem to.

Maybe I'm not hearing the "laser distortion." I'm not sure what that means. Most of the lasers I've worked with were pretty quiet, unless they were pulsed.

 

[State of Epicicity]

Maybe I'm not hearing the "laser distortion." I'm not sure what that means. Most of the lasers I've worked with were pretty quiet, unless they were pulsed.

Well, if I had a better term for it I'd certainly use it, Man, and I also wouldn't ask for the answer; I'd just be researching the phenomenon itself to understand it better. You read that part about how I felt intimidated asking, right?

To describe it more, I've experienced it on single notes, around the 5 - 12th fret of the 5th string, e.g., palrm muted, when I add too much bass to a pedal.

 

[State of Epicicity]

Maybe I'm not hearing the "laser distortion." I'm not sure what that means. Most of the lasers I've worked with were pretty quiet, unless they were pulsed.

I'll create another example using single notes.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

I've experienced it on single notes, around the 5 - 12th fret of the 5th string, e.g., palrm muted, when I add too much bass to a pedal.

This really sounds like you are describing ghost notes or intermodulation distortion, both of which are present in most amplifiers. Switch the model to use a DC source and it should go away, but you sacrifice accuracy.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/ghost-notes.126903/

Years ago I had an AX8, and thought it was amazing until I noticed this weird doubled note midway up the neck, and thought my tube amps didn’t do that. I eventually sold the AX8 and went back to playing my tube amps.

These are not the “run the amp clean and shove pedals down its throat” amps, they’re the “you do not need distortion or boost pedals in front of this amp”, where I leave them on the lead channel all night and do it from my guitar. And, yeah, I noticed they did it too. And then I felt really stupid for selling the AX8 to a friend for cheap, who has used it every night for the last couple years.

Trust FAS. They’re really that good.

---

PS see https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=Amp_block#POWER_TYPE for more.

 

[Rex]

Well, if I had a better term for it I'd certainly use it, Man, and I also wouldn't ask for the answer; I'd just be researching the phenomenon itself to understand it better. You read that part about how I felt intimidated asking, right?

No worries. I'm just trying to understand.

To describe it more, I've experienced it on single notes, around the 5 - 12th fret of the 5th string, e.g., palrm muted, when I add too much bass to a pedal.

When you add too much bass into a circuit with distortion, the distortion produces harmonics in the lower midrange. Some folks call that the "mudrange," because that's where muddy sound lives. Try turning on Cut in the Amp block.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

Try turning on Cut in the Amp block.

Yes. Like dad said, “Cut that sh*t out; don’t make me come back there!”

 

[State of Epicicity]

I see you guys have written some more about this, but I'll post this first: Here's a single-note example, with the Diamante Fire, Gain 8.6, Tone 8.88 into an IR I captured from TH-U of a Brunetti 2x12 with a 12 and 414 in front:



And thank you Rex and Greg for even trying to get at what I'm saying. It's the least important thing in the world, but I've hit this thing several times, so it would definitely help my future tone shaping to be able to work with it in a better way if it's possible not to alter the input signal, though I suspect that's the only way.

 

[State of Epicicity]

Greg: Thanks for the suggestion. Ghost notes are something this forum taught me. I didn't know what they were at first, and I posted an example with a Deluxe Tweed. Now I just raise the B+ Time Constant to get rid of it. But that was a cool thought; I just tried it with the El Fuego (that was cross-lingually redundant, I know), but the laser remained!

Rex: Thanks for that suggestion! I just tried the Cut, and it didn't get rid of it, so I kept it on, went to the Input EQ in the Amp Block and added more and more aggressive Low Cut manually there, but that still did not get rid of it.

To describe it better, perhaps I should call it a buzz. It's like, you hear what I'm playing there, but then, this buzz just hovers over the sound, and really comes into play when you sustain notes on the 5th & 6th strings. It's just weird.

 

[Timma]

Greg: Thanks for the suggestion. Ghost notes are something this forum taught me. I didn't know what they were at first, and I posted an example with a Deluxe Tweed. Now I just raise the B+ Time Constant to get rid of it. But that was a cool thought; I just tried it with the El Fuego (that was cross-lingually redundant, I know), but the laser remained!

Rex: Thanks for that suggestion! I just tried the Cut, and it didn't get rid of it, so I kept it on, went to the Input EQ in the Amp Block and added more and more aggressive Low Cut manually there, but that still did not get rid of it.

To describe it better, perhaps I should call it a buzz. It's like, you hear what I'm playing there, but then, this buzz just hovers over the sound, and really comes into play when you sustain notes on the 5th & 6th strings. It's just weird.

I'm pretty sure what you're hearing is crossover distortion, as I understand it. A lot of amps have that sound, sometimes intentionally designed around it, but some designers would call it a "defect". But it's really just another flavor of distortion. It's really not my cup of tea so I can't say for sure but I think some amp designers find it desirable as a different trebly texture that brightens the sound in a different way, and has a different kind of punch. If you were to try another model like a Vox or Friedman you'll hear something similar. If it's not your thing I suggest trying a different model, only because I don't know enough about amps to know what parameters you can tweak to "fix" it

 

[yek]

That buzz on top of the fundamental is part of the sound. It's also referred to as "fizz". It's authentic, real amps have it too.

https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/...le.2C_intermodulation.2C_crossover_distortion

 

[Smilzo]

There's a phenomenon I've encountered on different amps, but trying out the Del Fuego, I encountered it again, and I'm wondering if anyone could name what this is called. It's like you strike the interval, then these robots appear hovering above you, and this shimmery laser sound creeps in. I've heard this kind of thing before also when I push the input of an amp too far with too much bass in a pedal.

This is the Diamante Fire model, diming the Gain & Tone, into Factory Cab Bank 1 #811, 2x12 Brown Super 57 A. I'm on my bridge humbucker, volume & tone on 10, playing this obscure theme no one has ever heard before on the 3rd & 4th strings at the beginning. This tone just sounds like the whole thing is going to fall apart, but I just wanted to show an extreme example of this phenomenon. I'm really dragging out the intervals at the beginning so you can hear the laser sounds that appear. The rest of this rendition is quick and crappy, and doesn't matter so much after the first measures, but you can hear the lasers in other spots too. I'm guessing this is because my humbucker is too hot, too bassy, or something like that, for me to be able to dime the amp this way and punish the input. Of course backing off the volume knob on the guitar makes the lasers go away.

I was wondering if this was either crossover distortion or blocking distortion, both of which I looked up examples of on YouTube, but it didn't seem like either was the case, from my total layman's gleaning. I've always wondered if there's a name for this, other than overloading the input, and I wonder if tweaking advanced parameters can lessen the effect, or you just have to shape the input signal better, which is the whole point of an overdrive pedal. I feel really dumb asking this question, but my curiosity outweighs my embarrassment.

I looked at Leon's video of the Blankenship Leeds model from a couple of years ago, where he dimes the controls on that amp, and when I tried it with that amp, I experienced the same phenomenon. What was crazy was, I didn't hear his playing elicit the same laser sound; I even copped the same licks and riffs he was improvising, but with the full tilt all on 10 tones he didn't seem to be overloading the amp in that particular way, although our signal strength was similar. Of course that doesn't at all mean the frequency response of our pickups is similar. Thanks in advance for any thoughts on this!

To me is "saturation". You are clipping the (preamp) tubes. Tubes has 2 kind of clipping, one smooth the other harsh (similar to solid state). Modern circuit make "smoother clip" kicks in well before harsh by clever design (bias point, staging & filtering). I believe the driver stage is blasted a lot, and has some blocking distortion. I hear a bit of intermodulation too, but it's pleasant.
Many fuzz exhibit the same saturation, but don't have driver blocking distortion resulting in faster, harsher and nastier clip.

 

[Rex]

I see you guys have written some more about this, but I'll post this first: Here's a single-note example, with the Diamante Fire, Gain 8.6, Tone 8.88 into an IR I captured from TH-U of a Brunetti 2x12 with a 12 and 414 in front:



And thank you Rex and Greg for even trying to get at what I'm saying. It's the least important thing in the world, but I've hit this thing several times, so it would definitely help my future tone shaping to be able to work with it in a better way if it's possible not to alter the input signal, though I suspect that's the only way.

I don't hear anything unusual here, but @yek nailed it a couple of posts above.