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Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Version 19.02

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I hear a massive difference between the high performance and min-latency on the DC-30 and Fender Tweed Deluxe. Wow the High Performance has so much more definition.

Question about latency:

If I don't run an overdrive or an amp in a Preset, will that latency from those two blocks already be removed? I use the X-Load and Cab quite a lot and I'm wondering if I should on min-latency for that. I could make it so no scene in that block has drive or amp.
 

Chuck P

Inspired
That's the one of the reasons an orchestra has a conductor; to "kill" the latency between musicians.
To kill part of the latency from the audience (or even the conductor) POV - over here in my seats to the left, I still hear the 3rd violin in front of me well before the kettledrums in the far corner, even if they are perfectly synched to each other, and the conductor hears the first violin/viola/cello before the others, and so on. I assume it's a genuine problem for recording engineers...?
 

la szum

Fractal Fanatic
When you used to play through a real amp all life long and you try playing / recording through a computer, even a small latency is perceivable

But isn't there such a thing as analog latency, too. My first time on a big stage I encountered that
phenomenon and it took me a long time to get used to it. So long that I never really got used
to it. In small clubs and rehearsal spaces that issue is not in play, but the bigger the venue and
setting the more that analog latency becomes an issue.

IEMs seem to resolve a lot of this now for the musicians on stage.
 

FractalAudio

Administrator
Fractal Audio Systems
Moderator
If I don't run an overdrive or an amp in a Preset, will that latency from those two blocks already be removed? I use the X-Load and Cab quite a lot and I'm wondering if I should on min-latency for that. I could make it so no scene in that block has drive or amp.
If there's no Drive or Amp block the Oversampling Mode is irrelevant.
 

LiamH

Inspired
To kill part of the latency from the audience (or even the conductor) POV - over here in my seats to the left, I still hear the 3rd violin in front of me well before the kettledrums in the far corner, even if they are perfectly synched to each other, and the conductor hears the first violin/viola/cello before the others, and so on. I assume it's a genuine problem for recording engineers...?
One of my friends is a recording engineer that has done a lot of orchestral work. He multitracked an orchestra properly to kill all the latency issues a few years ago. He loved the end result, but was told by everyone involved in recording classical music that it sounded terrible. This was evidently because the orchestral-music-buying audience are looking for something that approximates the experience of being in a good seat, in a good venue, listening to a good orchestra with all the associated signal path delays and "room" sound. It was a problem for my friend, but he was disappointed that he fixed something no-one else believed was broken. In fact they hated the fix!

But isn't there such a thing as analog latency, too. My first time on a big stage I encountered that
phenomenon and it took me a long time to get used to it.

Not so much really, but "acoustic latency", definitely - sound waves travel relatively slowly. Analogue signals travel down the wires at light-speed, so even when we only had wedges and side-fold, you'd hear what anyone else played a good time before the actual sound wave arrived on a large stage. It was always good to try to remember to listen to the monitor rather than the drummer's actual acoustic count-in stick clicks, especially on a big stage outdoors on a windy day. I never liked my guitar speakers to end up too far away from the drum kit, so I always had the option of leaning into both when I wanted something to sound tight. That's not to say it ever did.

Liam
 
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Piing

Fractal Fanatic
But isn't there such a thing as analog latency, too. My first time on a big stage I encountered that
phenomenon and it took me a long time to get used to it. So long that I never really got used
to it. In small clubs and rehearsal spaces that issue is not in play, but the bigger the venue and
setting the more that analog latency becomes an issue.

IEMs seem to resolve a lot of this now for the musicians on stage.

And that is the reason why line arrays of speakers at large venues are curved.

As @LiamH has pointed out, sound waves travel at a relatively slow speed. Therefore, if you are in front of a vertical line of speakers, the sound from the upper speakers will arrive to your ears after the sound of the lower speakers. That delay or latency will cause some nasty out-of-phase artifacts.

These analog latency issues at large venues cause more trouble than the minimal latency of your digital equipment.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/line-arrays-explained

1646006088995.png
 
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Arni61

Inspired
I think enough firmware updates have passed that it’s “normal” for the Factory presets to need updating and for some to not sound great.

What happens if you build your own “Euro” preset with the same settings and IRs?
Yes, of course that would be a possibility. however, they are factory presets that one could expect optimized and adjusted as a buyer of a fractal device. meanwhile there are also some presets that no longer fit in terms of sound. would it be too much effort for fractal to regularly adjust the presets?
 

artzeal

Experienced
Even the voices in my head have latency.

Lets not forget to factor the human into evaluations of the system. According to empirical science, it takes 150ms for a thought to take place and be transmitted. That's one reason to practice shredding: to develop a riff vocabulary tied into finger muscle memory that is faster than thinking and to reduce the amount of neural triggering it takes to get the job done. Nerve conduction velocities (depending on type) are on the order of 50 m/s, and human auditory systems (the ear) are not capable of hearing 2 transients as separate that are less than 20ms apart. So, while it is possible to actually perceive sound of any duration that has enough energy to be heard, there is even latency to the signal traveling from the ear to the brain and through it (even though its a short hop). Crucial to the perception of latency is the acuity of discernment of spacial relationships from the time alignment of different sources and the phase effects from two input sources (2 ears). It's amazing that the Axe FX can achieve low latency thats less than the the human processing of perception or thinking.
 
I just know that, outside of the limitations of pitch shifting, I’ve never encountered any perception of latency in the year and a half I’ve had the Axe-FX III. I’ve made gapless presets with two amps and four drives all active at the same time, switching with multiplexers and ridiculously involved scene controllers, and still no perceptible latency. I fucking love this box of magic. It’s so immediate and alive in its response, to me it’s just an extension of my instrument.
 
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