Axe-Fx III 16.00 Beta 4 "Cygnus" Firmware - Public Beta

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So many factors affect tone, from your pick to the type of strings, to your setup, to your IR, and I feel like that a lot of criticism of the beta is coming from not adapting to the greater accuracy of the amps. Not as a knock on those who are not liking the Cygnus tones out of the gate, but I really do think they sound as accurate as any amp I've tried in the real world. Tube amps in the real world are beasts that you have to work to understand if you want to live with them; of course that's why pedals are so huge, because even after you've found your holy grail amp, it's still sometimes not enough for many players. I think the reason many of us are not experiencing muddy tones is because maybe the IRs to which we gravitate already are just well suited to the settings we think to use on our favorite amps. And hugely, what about the Speaker Impedance Curve setting? How many people actually match that for the IR in hand, for maximum accuracy. If you try to match a YouTube video or some other source where you know the amp, cab, and mic involved, considering you can ignore post-processing, which you usually can't, you must know the proper impedance curve for the amp to act in a similar way to what you're trying to match. Even then, there are variations in mics, in cabinets, in speakers, and in real world amps. Any one of those can cause a tone not to match up the way you expect. I feel like a totally accurate 1970s Marshall model would really be 100 different models of the amp, a variation for each representation in the world, and totally unworkable through which to sift. I look at a model as an example of one amp in particular, and I take my general understanding of how an amp feels to judge it. How many times does someone have an amp with dying or improperly biased tubes, or something else that affects its behavior? There are so many factors. And yeah, in the end, tone is so in the fingers too. Even a genius like Jason Becker said that he would play the same line differently every time, just from the way you naturally approach the guitar. The obsession with matching another's hands entirely is complete insanity in my eyes, like some form of musical OCD, paradoxically making the effort anything but musical.

For me, I like to start from scratch with new firmware. To me it's just a new instrument (and how awesome is that, in and of itself?), and in order to get the most out of it you have to explore its capabilities as if you'd never encountered it before. I've said it before, but I didn't really feel anything was missing from 15.01, but now I feel that Cygnus is better, really making unbelievably balanced tones of any type you can imagine, with only the long list of models that've already been updated. That low end speaks in a way that just hits you in the gut.

Lastly, this is a beta, and we would all do well to keep that in mind. It's a gift and not an obligation for FAS to make this public, knowing there will be a lot of infuriating comments regardless of how revelatory it is. I believe the purpose of this is to illicit helpful reactions that Cliff and the other engineers may use to improve the product further, and to check for any potential blindspots in their thinking. Reading this thread it dawns on me why most companies do not offer public betas, and I now empathize with those decisions. Regardless, Cygnus is the greatest thing since sliced bread to me; the previous firmware was too, really. I just find it so easy to start with a random amp and dial in a completely fulfilling tone in a very very short amount of time, just staying on the Authentic page. And the fact that I can act like a DIY amp hotrodder in about a million ways is just gravy.

I have a character flaw in looking at the problems in something first, before I can enjoy it; despite this problem of mine, I'm just not really finding the problems here, because people with a deep love and understanding both of electrical engineering and guitar tone have developed a device that removes the obstacles of what creates bad tone here, complete with Cliff's recommendations on how to overcome what he feels are the original amps' design flaws. My whole damn life I've had problems getting tones that felt right, until I got the AxeFx; now I just have 1,000 flavors of awesome. That said, I'm seeing overwhelmingly that people have a similar feeling to me here, and it makes it all the more bewildering to me that one would attempt to troll something like this with the kind of arguments I'm reading. From my understanding creative engineering is as much about design and boldness as it is solid technical understanding, and no good engineer is going to let hubris overtake the possibility for improvement. Cliff's decision to offer these betas publicly is really a recognition that there may be things that were missed that could be improved, and that is something to keep in the front of your mind when these betas are offered, if they continue to be in the future, which I hate to say I would understand.

People have thrown around the term fanboy for those who feel the way I do about this product. I understand if you haven't gelled with something, but understand that there's a reason for this feeling; in my case, it's earned. I mod any guitar to the point it's as right as I can half way competently make it for myself, and it takes a lot of work and time. I do that with whatever I can in life. To find something so lovingly crafted right out of the box is a rare thing to me, and leaves me to that even rarer thing, the time just to focus on musical aspiration, not endless tone fucking.
Right on. Motivated to reply regarding music production. I have always said, that I didn’t need a pedal that made my plexi sound more like a plexi - I need a pedal that made my plexi sound more like Tom Dowd was my producer.
 
So I start from the beginning with the cali leggy, exit the legato 100 .
it s better , but I still have this " dirty" feel thing . This guitar got the evolution pickups . This amp is not on the beta yet if I read correctly .
then , when I listen to his head , it seems to be very dirty, so maybe it's normal .

(the video is not listed in youtube)
Sorry for my poor playing, as someone recommand me to use a metronome yesterday, I hope to play good before dying

 
Yeah, I know...

Which one?

I've never really tried to get a Vai tone but the other night I was playing with different stuff and thought I'd see how long it took too approximate For the Love of God (my favorite Vai).

Loaded up the Legato model and started searching thru the factory V30 IRs... Spent maybe 15 minutes and I was in the ballpark with a Suhr Modern.

The Legato was the one I tried first, back when I first got my III. I was still a fair bit wet behind the ears at that point.

But last night I got that preset put together with the Cali Leggy in about 6 minutes and most of that time was spent looking for an IR. Pretty much dialed it in exactly how I used to dial mine in. Without the boost it has that same stiff, “I dare you to try to play me” feel. :D
 
Wow! I've been messing with the Plexi 50w 6CA7 for the last couple of hours doing my Eddie impressions and it sounds incredible. The thump really tingles in my nether regions. Leon was right, you can just load the amp and go and just use the volume knob on the guitar.

Personally, my Plexi preference has now shifted to the Plexi 50W High.
 
So I start from the beginning with the cali leggy, exit the legato 100 .
it s better , but I still have this " dirty" feel thing . This guitar got the evolution pickups . This amp is not on the beta yet if I read correctly .
then , when I listen to his head , it seems to be very dirty, so maybe it's normal .

(the video is not listed in youtube)
Sorry for my poor playing, as someone recommand me to use a metronome yesterday, I hope to play good before dying


Nothing to deal with the actual ... delicate subject but love the video the Nevermind album playing entirely you ve done years ago if my memory is good ...
Get an app on the phone for the metronome ... it s free :) :) ...
 
Well, I have a new title now. :D

View attachment 79047

Not sure if you were serious, but we just see "Administrator"

Hell yes! I have a set of Juggernauts and Nailbombs that are both extremely clear and tight, as BKPs are known for. It's hard to go back to pretty much anything after BKPs.

I just found this interesting because according to some those are some of the looser options in the BKP range.

This is a great place to mention Albert Hirschman's "tunnel effect" (from "The Changing Tolerance for Income Inequality in the Course of Economic Development.")

Imagine two lanes of cars moving slowly through a tunnel. When the other lane (AX3) starts to move, you (still stuck waiting) feel more optimistic because you think your lane (FM3) will start to move soon. If you wait too long, though, you start to resent the fact that others are moving ahead and you are still stuck.

Fortunately, in this case we know that Cygnus will come to the FM3, so we can view all the movement with the AX3 beta as something positive that we will eventually benefit from!

Hirschman led an amazing and inspirational life, including serving in the French resistance in WWII:
https://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/24/...onomist-and-resistance-figure-dies-at-97.html

At least the FM3 has it's own Beta going on right now too. So the lane is moving, even if the road isn't going to the same place yet.

I’m sure there’s probably some deeper debate to be had about “metal heads” and their staunch resistance to change. But maybe this isn’t the place to open that can of worms ;)

We metal heads are change! We changed things in the 80s and we want them to never change again!

Should I be checking out the Cali amps? the last few pages seem so focused on this.

Probably not. It hasn't even been updated yet, no one is saying it sounds significantly better or different, and no one is even saying it sounds particularly good. But it is the signature model and the amp used by Vai, and some of us got on a tangent about how to use it to sound like Vai even though it doesn't really have anything to do with the Beta. If you want to test it and see about getting a Vai tone I don't see why not. But I don't think it's a "must experience" amp by any means.

Yeah, I've already got that open but some amp names (eg Mesa Mark IV) are represented by several amps on the AFX3 and I'm wondering if all of them were updated.

I would assume when Cliff says the Mark IV is updated then all the different channels/modes are updated. If he's pulling out the real amp to measure and compare it just makes more sense to do it all at the same time.
 
Updating some of my kitchen sink presets and I thought I'd share this one. It's built for a PRS Silver Sky -- so a Strat with some Mayer-tuned pickups.

The ease with which I'm able to get big, bell-like sounds out of the DR model in this release is really astounding. Normally I'd be IR mixing and deep parameter diving to bring things into the sonic range I'm seeking. This time around I just reset the amp block and focused on BMT and gain for a bit. Picked two IRs almost a random. Based the selection of mics I think I like.

And there it was.

So easy.

Enjoy.

(Watch that Junk scene -- it can really get away and rattle your walls)

That Mutron is cool, as always

@iaresee
 
No, you aren't hallucinating. One of the hallmarks of a good tube amp is that there are multiple sources of distortion and each frequency band distorts differently.

You have to model everything and do it right to capture this accurately. FWIW "black box" approaches can't capture this because they homogenize everything into a single waveshaper. That's why the black box approaches always have that "sameness" and a kind of Tube Screamer-ish distortion quality (since a Tube Screamer is a single distortion stage basically).
Got it, glad to know I haven't lost any marbles!
Joke aside, amazing job Cliff, the articulation, richness, and response is awesome. And this applies to all the models I tried, I just mentioned the marshalls as an example.

Functionally you have created a digital twin for each amp, impressive indeed.
 
Did the Cinnamon Girl preset get posted? I’m learning that song this week. I’ll install the beta just for that one tone.
 
Sorry!
Looks like I'm very blonde!
Whizzer ?? - I do not understand?
"go in the Micrpohone input or go in the Instrument input" ? Where is?
Sorry, once again!
Thanks for the help!
Search google for "whizzer neil young" and you should find some info. Basically, the Whizzer is a box with stepper motors that is attached to the top of his tweed Deluxe amp and turns the knobs to certain positions when he stomps a footswitch button, so that he can go instantly from one favorite setting to the next. It may also switch his guitar signal between the amp's inputs and/or split it to both, but the info I have read does not specifically mention that.

The tweed Deluxe's two inputs are labeled "Instrument" and "Microphone". Each sounds different.

HTH!
 
You can individually dial up all of the great tones in a 5E3 just by plugging in, possibly jumpering inputs, and dialing all 3 knobs - no Whizzer needed.

This nails one of the possible combinations - jumpered.

There are two more ways to use the amp: go in the Micrpohone input or go in the Instrument input. Using all 3 knobs in either case nets a plethora of great tones.

One of my favorite clean sounds is had by going into the Instrument channel, cranking the Microphone volume up most if the way (9/12, or so, or 3 o'clock), then upping the Instrument channel volume and tone to where you want them. Better than BF Fender clean, in my opinion....
Sorry!

"There are two more ways to use the amp: go in the Micrpohone input or go in the Instrument input. Using all 3 knobs in either case nets a plethora of great tones."
Where is? "Micrpohone input - Instrument input"
Sorry, once again!
Thanks for the help!
 
Sorry!

"There are two more ways to use the amp: go in the Micrpohone input or go in the Instrument input. Using all 3 knobs in either case nets a plethora of great tones."
Where is? "Micrpohone input - Instrument input"
Sorry, once again!
Thanks for the help!
Original_5E3_Deluxe_Controls.jpg
Many folks plug in dutifully to the instrument input and use the instrument volume and the shared tone knob, and never touch the microphone input or knob, and have no idea of what they are missing.

From this page:
Screenshot_20210224-075213_Samsung Internet.png
The page explains the circuit for beginner amp builders, but includes usage tips and talks about why it is a popular kit amp.
 
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