Axe 2 MIDI thru flawed?

Y

year2525

Inspired
I'm experiencing problems with the MIDI thru of the Axe 2.

I tested MFC (CAT5) > Axe 2 > GCX as well as MFC (CAT5) > Axe 2 > M13.
In both setups the switching of the GCX/M13 is slightly delayed and (which is worse) underlies random errors (wrong preset/loop activation/deactivation).

Going MFC > GCX > Axe 2 works fine on the other hand. However, this has downsides, can't use CAT5 in this setup, for example.


Since this is not an MFC problem I decided to take the topic over here.

Anyone use the MIDI thru with these or other devices? What are your experiences? A word from Fractal?


EDIT: A video can be seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOQCtw_KKb0
 
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Faulty MIDI cables?
MIDI recieve channel on GCX and/or M13 is in OMNI or specific channel?
MFC in AXE-FX mode ON or OFF?

/Mike
 
miketheman said:
Faulty MIDI cables?
Click to expand...

Definately not. Cables are brand new and, as mentioned, they do work in the other setup order perfectly.

miketheman said:
MIDI recieve channel on GCX and/or M13 is in OMNI or specific channel?
Click to expand...

The GCX receives MIDI on channel 16. I've set the M13 to a specific channel.
The settings in the MFC INT CC menu resemble these channels.
Again, the GCX/M13 do receive the commands properly in about 70 percent of the time. Which is not enough to be reliable.

miketheman said:
MFC in AXE-FX mode ON or OFF?
/Mike
Click to expand...

This happens in both "Axe Fx: II" mode as well as "Axe Fx: none" mode.

I'd be glad if anyone would take the time to reproduce this.
 
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Try again but use MIDI In instead of the CAT5. Perhaps there's an issue with the CAT5 I/O on either the MFC or the Axe.
 
Download the free MIDI OX and connect your controller directly to see the exact message being sent. Then connect via AXE-FX midi thru & see if the messages are the same. I had the same problem with the ultra, so I didn't use the power out 7 pins. Not sure if the LF PRO may somehow use the power pins for more than just power?
 
FractalAudio said:
Try again but use MIDI In instead of the CAT5. Perhaps there's an issue with the CAT5 I/O on either the MFC or the Axe.
Click to expand...

Hi, thanks for the advice.

I've tried that now and the problem with the GCX is still the same.
Preset changing on the Axe is awfully slow (500ms) in Axe 2 mode with the MIDI cable.
In "none" mode it seems to need some extra programming to make presets change.
However, in Axe 2 mode the GCX loop switching is not delayed (if it switches correctly, that is).

It doesn't seem to be related to the CAT5 cable itself.

Does someone use a similar setup? Or use the MIDI thru at all?
 
Guitarbot said:
Download the free MIDI OX and connect your controller directly to see the exact message being sent. Then connect via AXE-FX midi thru & see if the messages are the same. I had the same problem with the ultra, so I didn't use the power out 7 pins. Not sure if the LF PRO may somehow use the power pins for more than just power?
Click to expand...

Hi Guitarbot, I think I came across a MIDI troubleshooting thread of yours on another forum when googling my issue earlier today. :)

I'm using the MFC.
I do have a 7 pin-cable lying around here from the time I had a LF Pro though (got stolen...), I didn't try that yet.
It should work and power the MFC from the Axe, right?

I'd try the MIDI OX idea, but my desktops GPU crapped out recently and I can't replace it until the end of the week.

I have a FF800 as a MIDI Interface but I don't have Firewire on my laptop.

To me, this seems like an issue easily to reproduce.


Guitarbot said:
I had the same problem with the ultra, so I didn't use the power out 7 pins.
Click to expand...

Can you explain this, please? What did you use instead, what was the cause?
 
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I was trying to go from LF PRO to the ULTRA (using the power through the 7 pin midi cable) then use Ultra's midi thru to go to a midi solutions splitter & it would split the Ultra's thru to send it to a Roland VG-8 & a Roland GR-55. It never worked & I kept getting all kinds of errors. So, I then changed it to go from the LF PRO out to the midi solutions splitter which then fed the ULTRA, GR-55 & VG-8 (each on it's own cable from the splitter) & it all worked fine. The downside was that I lost my power via 7 pin midi cable & had to run the power seperate.
 
I am running MIDI thru w/o issue.

I am going LF+ 12+ - Axe-fx II - Sound sculpture Switchblade 8B- Eventide Eclipse - Sound Sculpture ABCadabra.

I've done this w/ the MFC, LF pro, and through the Ultra as well.
 
I guess it's because the mfc is sending 16 pcs on 16 channels at once. That's sometimes too much for the receiving units.
If the mfc or the II would send wrong pcs all units getting these messages would call up the same wrong number. But that's not what happened. Sometimes my pachmate had a wrong number and sometimes my jmp1, randomly without any system or sequence. So I guess the midi stream is too full and they can not interpret it fast enough.
Can I reduce the mfc to channel 1 only with a simple system setting? Don't want to edit every preset.
 
666was999 said:
I guess it's because the mfc is sending 16 pcs on 16 channels at once. That's sometimes too much for the receiving units.
If the mfc or the II would send wrong pcs all units getting these messages would call up the same wrong number. But that's not what happened. Sometimes my pachmate had a wrong number and sometimes my jmp1, randomly without any system or sequence. So I guess the midi stream is too full and they can not interpret it fast enough.
Can I reduce the mfc to channel 1 only with a simple system setting? Don't want to edit every preset.
Click to expand...

The GCX itself doesn't seem to be the issue here since it handles all MIDI info correctly when connected directly to the MFC via MIDI.

Since the MFC and Axe 2 are designed to work with each other (and properly handle all MIDI info from each other) and the MIDI thru is designed to pass on MIDI info on certain channels I can't see why the MIDI data would be too much to handle for the Axe 2 (as long as it is not corrupted in some way). As proven, it certainly is not for the GCX. When connected vice versa, the GCX seems to pass on all MIDI info to the Axe 2 (which is more complex) without issues.

At this point, my Axe 2 MIDI thru is not usable.
I have a hard time believing it's not a bug of some kind but a problem with my unit (sure would like to spare G66 sending me a replacement unit - with the risk of still having the same problem).
 
javajunkie said:
I am running MIDI thru w/o issue.

I am going LF+ 12+ - Axe-fx II - Sound sculpture Switchblade 8B- Eventide Eclipse - Sound Sculpture ABCadabra.

I've done this w/ the MFC, LF pro, and through the Ultra as well.
Click to expand...

Hi Sean,

AFAIK the Switchblade 8B responses to SysEx (maybe also Program Change?) but not to Control Changes (which is what the GCX and M13 use, in my case).
I didn't try to program Custom MIDI messages (which allows me to send SysEx to the GCX, if I understand correctly).
The transmission of Program Changes seemed to be ok when I tested it with the M13 (I may have to check that again).

So maybe I can narrow it down to CCs being somehow corrupted when coming out of the Axe 2 MIDI thru.
Does the Eclipse respond to CCs? If so, did you definately use CCs through the MIDI thru in your setup?

EDIT: Also, did you use CAT5 in these setups?
 
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year2525 said:
Hi Sean,

AFAIK the Switchblade 8B responses to SysEx (maybe also Program Change?) but not to Control Changes (which is what the GCX and M13 use, in my case).
I didn't try to program Custom MIDI messages (which allows me to send SysEx to the GCX, if I understand correctly).
The transmission of Program Changes seemed to be ok when I tested it with the M13 (I may have to check that again).

So maybe I can narrow it down to CCs being somehow corrupted when coming out of the Axe 2 MIDI thru.
Does the Eclipse respond to CCs? If so, did you definately use CCs through the MIDI thru in your setup?

EDIT: Also, did you use CAT5 in these setups?
Click to expand...

Didn't do any CC with Cat5 but did do PC. Switchblabde, ABCadabra, and the Eclipse all respond to control change. I have never had an issue (though I have only used the PC on them with the II) - . I use the eclipse with CCs all the time (to turn on/off effects and real time control)
 
Peter Hundley said:
The Switchblade can respond to PC and CC messages.
Click to expand...

Hi, thanks for the clarification.



So, 300 views and only 3 people using the MIDI thru of the Axe 2?

I'd still be very thankful if someone takes the time to reproduce this.

Also, is this being looked into? If I can do anything else to clarify this problem, please let me know!
I really need totally functional MIDI thru for live applications.

Thanks

EDIT: Does the MIDI thru utilize all 5 MIDI pins? Is there any information passed on pins 1 and 3?
 
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666was999 said:
Can I reduce the mfc to channel 1 only with a simple system setting? Don't want to edit every preset.
Click to expand...

I would love to know the answer to this as well. I have both an Ultra and a II and have been trying to get the Midi through to control a Vocalist Live Pro with the MFC properly for almost 2 years without reliable success. I had more success with a midi cable and the Ultra than I have had with the CAT5 and the II. I have always thought it was a processing problem wit the VLP, but since others are having issues, maybe it isn't or it is a combination of factors.

I am only trying to run the Axe on Ch1 and the VLP on Ch2 and just do CC's at this point, and it still isn't working with the AxeII, but I am able to get things going with the Ultra - very frustrating.

Any thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.
 
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