Are you crafting/have you crafted an 'original' high gain tone?

T

Tubed to Life

Inspired
By high gain I mean at least the PVH6160 near max preamp gain. Could everyone who thinks they're doing/they've done this post a 'naked' clip of yours, and if willing the patch so I can see what you're doing?
 
Honestly, no tone with the 6160 preamp gain maxed is going to record well enough to record a clip with. I use that model for just about everything, and the trick to getting that big Sneap-style wall of guitars sound isn't to dime the gain - it's less gain, multiple tracks, and clean playing.

After a certain point with the 6160 (and any amp, really) the gain knob just adds noise.
 
My tone sounds like me, but I doubt I'm doing something unique with the amp settings. I'll get a clip up next week.
 
SUPER high gain tones only work at very low volumes. As soon as you turn it up, or try to put it into a mix it disappears and flubs out.
Try using the boost in the amp block as well as boosting with an overdrive block. Lots of us use the TS808 max level, min gain, tone w/e.

To answer your question, yes I have several high gain tones Im working on and using to record with. I dont share tones Im using until
I finish the recording and/or are happy with the tone. Its the reason why I post so few patches. And the patches I do post are typically
examples of how to get close to a tone. Posting raw clips is basically the same as posting the patch now days with the TM function.

Due to everyone having such different setups, why dont you post a clip and a patch of a tone you are working on. List the gear you
are using, as well as describing what you do and dont like about your tone/patch. A possible example could be a good idea as well.
This might be a faster way to get you where you want to be.
 
Sneap? I'm not looking for a wall of guitars tone. I just like a certain sustain, solidity, and non-vintage-ness that I've found only comes from enough gain. For example, the Friedman BE even with the TS808 sounds a little gluggy. Whereas the PVH6160 without a pedal has enough gain to have that 'push'.

In any case, following Funeral's suggestion, here are some clips of patches that I like the tone (and feel) of. I'm playing and listening back to them at volume that eventually feels a little loud, by the way. They work with all my guitars, though especially well with my Carvins - one all alder, the other maple neck-thru with alder sides. For these, I'm using the maple/alder guitar, Lace Deathbucker in the bridge.

PVH6160:






FAS6160 (especially this one I like)


 

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Tubed to Life I downloaded your patches and will try them and post back tomorrow/later today. Its 3:30 am here, and my ears are shot from a loud show I went to tonight.
 
Cool, thanks, man. I tried some the things you mentioned, and have some somewhat different sounding tones, though I don't know as they're that different. Eager to see what you say.
 
Im working on my interpretation of your presets plus a Friedman BE/HBE (x/y) preset. Im sorry to make you wait more, just been crazy around here. I got to play for about 20 minutes today.
I will get more playing done in the afternoon. :)
 
those clips sound great. do you have a problem with the tone still? i'd be very happy to use something like that
 
I didnt make a clip, though I will. I used the same cab (ultra 4x12v30) and same mic on all three presets and just changed the proximity and maybe the motor drive on the HBE.
These are built from scratch using my little tricks for the cab which by looking at your presets you have figured out on your own. :) Let me know if they sound any good for you.
The 3 presets are on Axe-Exchange.
HERE
HERE
& HERE

Im getting a sinus infection and it messes with the high frequencies Im hearing.
So they possibly could be little trebley. Let me know.
 
audemia said:
those clips sound great. do you have a problem with the tone still? i'd be very happy to use something like that
Click to expand...

Well, I'm not sure I've lately had a problem. Through my studio monitors, my tones sound great. Through my PC speakers they sound terrible. I thought there might be some cross-over, but perhaps not outside of a full mix?

Further, before your comment, I've had no feedback on tones I've posted, so given everything I thought maybe I was deluded or something in thinking they sounded good. Incidentally, I goofed and uploaded the same clip twice, so you only heard my PVH6160 tone.

As I can no longer edit my post above, I deleted the duplicate, and here is a new one:


 
Funeral said:
I didnt make a clip, though I will. I used the same cab (ultra 4x12v30) and same mic on all three presets and just changed the proximity and maybe the motor drive on the HBE. These are built from scratch using my little tricks for the cab which by looking at your presets you have figured out on your own. :) Let me know if they sound any good for you.
Click to expand...

Thanks, man. The cab stuff I know from you telling me in earlier threads. My ear has changed a bit in the process.

Your versions (especially the BE * ) show the character of the amp, seem a slight easier to hear when playing against a track, and may allow more space in the overall mix.

The BE as an amp tone I like a lot, but am kind of mixed on for my personal style. They all have a certain clucking in attack, and cattie eowww in the sustained sound (especially in the upper range), both of which I've never preferred.

My versions (especially the FAS6160), even in multi-tracking, have the kind of sound I want (partly with the intention of not needing overdubbing), and (poignantly) seem more suited to my playing style. Ultimately, I'm not looking to sound like a guitar and amp, but something a bit different using such gear. Weird, yeah? Still, I'm sitting with this and investigating.

In the mean time, what are your perceptions of the following clips? Everyone is welcome to listen and voice your thoughts on them.









(I mixed in some Axe reverb in the following.)









*The patch title is HBE/BE. I've felt they were a bit different. Is the HBE just a brighter version?
 
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Well seeing as how you are not going for a traditional guitar sound, we/you might be heading in the wrong direction.
The clips sound fine but also sound like the mid lows are a little heavy. But then again, I dont really know what you
are going for. Do you have an example? Has another band gotten close or done it before? What is the context/style
you are going to use it in? Im going to read some of your past post because I feel like we might have done this once
before? I dunno :lol
 
I've asked for advice/help, and you've given it. This thread I think is an evolution of that and further request. My two main purposes are to find something I like, and to see whether it's situationally feasible. I like both recordings of that piece above, but the one with my patch I like better. It sounds more...it's like a beam of solid light, albeit with some hair on it.

High gain-wise, probably Carcass' Heartwork is closest in a general sense of tone, but only when they're playing together. When the one guitar plays, it sounds like zzzzzzz.

The other example, not at all high gain, is Allan Holdsworth's tone on....I don't know what album....but it plays on the front page to his site: The Real Allan Holdsworth.com

I don't know how he could ever not be satisfied with that tone. But I don't know as I would be (not that I remotely have the ability to wield it), because I like more sustain. I also dig in, sort of in-between an acoustic guitar and a piano, so the gain offers a kind of compression and consistency that I can push against and sort of gong like a bell. Which means as little 'crunch' as possible - more a dun dun dun dun than a chun chun chun - but I have to be careful because it can easily turn into too muted a tone, let alone one I can't play chords with.

In any case, my current tone may not be situationally feasible, and at least for recording I may have to use something like what you've got *. So, do you think the differences bewteen each (mixed) clip is more a tone thing, or one of sonic feasibility?


* Or: I came up with some tones according to your gain suggestions. Sort of in-between yours and my original tone. I'll post that tomorrow.
 
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Tubed to Life said:
I've asked for advice/help, and you've given it. This thread I think is an evolution of that and further request. My two main purposes are to find something I like, and to see whether it's situationally feasible. I like both recordings of that piece above, but the one with my patch I like better. It sounds more...it's like a beam of solid light, albeit with some hair on it.

High gain-wise, probably Carcass' Heartwork is closest in a general sense of tone, but only when they're playing together. When the one guitar plays, it sounds like zzzzzzz.

The other example, not at all high gain, is Allan Holdsworth's tone on....I don't know what album....but it plays on the front page to his site: The Real Allan Holdsworth.com

I don't know how he could ever not be satisfied with that tone. But I don't know as I would be (not that I remotely have the ability to wield it), because I like more sustain. I also dig in, sort of in-between an acoustic guitar and a piano, so the gain offers a kind of compression and consistency that I can push against and sort of gong like a bell. Which means as little 'crunch' as possible - more a dun dun dun dun than a chun chun chun - but I have to be careful because it can easily turn into too muted a tone, let alone one I can't play chords with.

In any case, my current tone may not be situationally feasible, and at least for recording I may have to use something like what you've got *. So, do you think the differences bewteen each (mixed) clip is more a tone thing, or one of sonic feasibility?


* Or: I came up with some tones according to your gain suggestions. Sort of in-between yours and my original tone. I'll post that tomorrow.
Click to expand...

Well those descriptions help a lot. I will see what I can come up with. Lazerbeam with a beard is what Im thinking. :)
I used the three amps you named because I didnt really know what you wanted. Same thing with the cab.
I will think outside the box now. Also, what pickups are you using?
Talk tomorrow.
 
I wouldn't mind less or no hair, actually. I just don't see a way around it.

The guitar for the tracks above has a Lace Deathbucker. I don't know the specs or what it might be comparable to.

I'm still mulling over your comment about the mid lows, but I'm not sure what to do about it.
 
I'd forgotten that I'd set 250hz at 1.5db in the FAS6160 amp GEQ. So I messed around with some things, and in the process took a break from the FAS6160, to the PVH6160 - making some small alterations in the treble within the GEQ page of the amp block, as well as some things I saw you do in other parts of the block. While the gain is still at max, the result is something I think is much smoother than anything above....HOT NEWS FLASH...I played around some more....and came up with something even better! (Also, through another thread, I figured out my input level was a little low, increasing it feeding much more guitar tone into the Axe.) What do you think?


 

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