1. Recent events require us to remind our members that this is a privately owned, run and supported forum. You are here at the invitation and discretion of the owners. As such, rules and standards of conduct will be applied that help keep this forum functioning as the owners desire. These include, but are not limited to, removing content and even access to the forum.

    Please give yourself a refresher on the forum rules you agreed to follow when you signed up.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. July 27 2018 - support.fractalaudio.com is temporarily down for updates. Please use this forum for support or see the "News" section here for additional details. Thank you.
    Dismiss Notice

are there not much love for bass regarding amps and effects?

Discussion in 'Bass & Other Instruments' started by Bushy, May 10, 2018.

  1. Bushy

    Bushy
    Expand Collapse
    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    1
    I'd love to see Headrush put out an effect pedal for bassists as well as an FRFR amp (if their sole up and coming one isn't adequate for bass guitars).

    Does Fractal not have gear for bassists too?
     
  2. unix-guy

    unix-guy
    Expand Collapse
    Axe-Master

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2013
    Messages:
    6,767
    Likes Received:
    3,733
    Location:
    Vacaville, California
    It's called Axe Fx... Or AX-8. There is not a distinction between using them for guitar or bass.

    Or violin, or hurdy gurdy, or pedal steel, etc... All have been reported by forum members.

    There are bass amps and cabs, even a bass specific Drive pedal (DarkGlass B7k). Some of the bassists here seem to feel less love than they think is appropriate, but there's good tone in there. My bassist loves his... He also uses it for Chapman Stick and Mandolin.
     
    Ole and Bushy like this.
  3. selta

    selta
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    1,051
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    Location:
    Pacific Northwet
    There is a very limited subset of gear in Fractal products. The third party purchased cabs are wonderful - from Dr Bonkers, OwnHammer, and 3Sigma. But if you want some of the more iconic bass amps and pedals, they are not presently in there and there has been extremely soft support from Fractal over time in adding new bass-centric models. It took years to get the B7K in there.
     
    dr bonkers and Bushy like this.
  4. Bushy

    Bushy
    Expand Collapse
    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    1
    Is there actually a difference between "just a pedal" vs. whatever it is they are marketing now?
     
  5. selta

    selta
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    1,051
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    Location:
    Pacific Northwet
    I'm not sure I follow your question.
    The appeal of the Fractal products is that it is "all in" - you have your amp, cab, effects chain all in one spot, one device. You can switch between different presets on the fly to drastically change your sound as well. Your setup is relatively easy - plug instrument in, plug output to (often) a powered cab, and another to front of house, and you're done. Every night you'll sound the same.

    When I say that there has been "extremely soft support" from Fractal, what I'm saying is that us bass players will sometimes make a bit of a rukus about not having more modeled bass gear. On some occasion, one of the Fractal employees will step in with words of encouragement that bass players are supported and there's more to come. The "soft" part of that is, very little ever actually comes. We don't even know what model SVT or 400 was modeled, or where any of the settings were when modeled.

    All of that said, it's still a pretty good solution for bass players. I still use mine, but, I'm not about to dish out a lot more money for an Axe-Fx III until things drastically change with regards to bass gear modeling. And I've been vocal about that on talkbass, the annual large bass player get together I run, and with anyone who asks me about Fractal gear for bass. My AX8 and Axe-Fx II are pretty alright, but they could be so much more.
     
    dr bonkers likes this.
  6. Joe Colombo

    Joe Colombo
    Expand Collapse
    New here

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Maybe its my limited knowledge, but as a AX8 -> RCF Bassist, I find my set up usually works well. I have had instances where diff rooms muck up my sound, but I am guessing this is also the case for ye olde amps and cabs. Happy to be told otherwise as I am still a learner.
     
  7. pauly

    pauly
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    May 22, 2013
    Messages:
    1,641
    Likes Received:
    1,069
    Location:
    Victoria australia
    Hi,
    I've found that something happened when Quantum firmware was introduced that the Bass amps and IRs became close to usable - I struggled with the Axe FX for bass before that firmware. I'm looking forward to trying 10.01 on bass! Maybe tonight :)
    Thanks
    Pauly
     
  8. Bushy

    Bushy
    Expand Collapse
    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    1
    Aren't most effect pedals set like that even before Fractal came into existence? I owned a BOSS multitrack that had the so called COSM effect where the effects themselves have the amp and cab emulation. I'm not sure how this is a new thing with the Fractal products?

     
  9. selta

    selta
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    1,051
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    Location:
    Pacific Northwet
    Which part are you talking about specifically? The "complete rig in one box"? Yeah, it's not a brand new concept by any means, but Fractal's is the best solution so far in terms of quality and reliability. Years past the processing power available just wasn't plentiful enough to achieve what can be done today. Hopefully, some day, us bass players get tossed a bone... for now, it's a lot of fancy presets with using things in unusual manners to get close-ish to the tone we want.
     
  10. Ed Rogers

    Ed Rogers
    Expand Collapse
    Regular

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    36
    Location:
    Denver
    I was just setting up a preset on the III for bass. I noticed I couldn’t find an 8x10, but there were quite a few new ones there that weren’t on my AX8. I also saw that the old 8x10 wasn’t ultra res, so I guess all the lower quality ir’s werent Transferred over to the 3. Digging the cabinet mixing!
     
  11. dr bonkers

    dr bonkers
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2013
    Messages:
    1,852
    Likes Received:
    1,483
    Location:
    NJ, USA
    If you need 8X10's, you can find some here along with bundled AX-8 presets and accompanying WAV files in the Combo Packs:
    https://www.drbonkerssoundlab.com/product-category/bass-guitar-cabinet-files/

    Click on the greyed tabs and pull down menus for more info on each cab on the site.
     
    bradlake likes this.
  12. Bushy

    Bushy
    Expand Collapse
    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    1
    Are multi effects pedal also a modelling effects pedal? Are they one in the same?

     
  13. unix-guy

    unix-guy
    Expand Collapse
    Axe-Master

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2013
    Messages:
    6,767
    Likes Received:
    3,733
    Location:
    Vacaville, California
    Not usually... Those that are usual proclaim it, so you'd know :)
     
  14. ChristThePhone

    ChristThePhone
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,558
    Likes Received:
    898
    Location:
    Germany
    Modelling is used in the context of amp and maybe drive simulation to simulate every single electronic component of a circuit and its interaction with the other components following the rules of physical laws, spec curves, and observed behaviour. For cabs we use IRs or in case of cheap pedals some sort of EQ. Most effects are more or less simple delay and filter algorithms except for reverb which is sometimes implemented using IRs or algorithms or both.
     
    Bushy likes this.
  15. mixministermike

    mixministermike
    Expand Collapse
    Inspired

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Likes Received:
    118
    Location:
    Burien, Washington, United States
    I've been pretty vocal about asking for more bass amps over the past few years.

    For studio and "pro" work, the Axe-FX platform delivers pretty much everything needed. With studio bass you're often just laying down dry tracks via DI. As others have said, there are plenty of great tones to be had in this scenario, not just as simple DI + FX but in using the existing amps as "starting points" with extensive EQ manipulation to get tones that sit well in a mix.

    For non-pro live, average gigging, etc. I think the Axe-FX platform comes up short on bass. In these scenarios, I'm personally looking for replicating existing and defined bass tones that accurately model real preamps/amps/cabs/speakers. We've got the cabs/speaker part well along now (thanks Dr.!), but we are still missing the wide array of bass preamps that give us those recognizable tones easily (GK/Fender/Eden/Aguilar/Hartke/Ashdown/Trace for example - I mean seriously look at that list of missing bass amp "staples"). And every time a new guitar amp is added (that's .1% different than the other 3 versions of that same amp already there), some of us bassists get a bit salty.

    My hope is that one day we get a big "Bass Love" firmware update that someone at Fractal has been working on behind the scenes. On that day, I'll be able to make my Axe-III my primary (sole?) modeling device, but until then I'm using other modelers for bass work because I can get the results I need faster.
     
    dr bonkers likes this.
  16. selta

    selta
    Expand Collapse
    Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    1,051
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    Location:
    Pacific Northwet
    I agree with pretty much all of this. I often take lengthy breaks from these forums in part because I get a LOT of "What bassists have is good enough, I (often a guitarist) get good enough bass tone so you should too". That attitude is toxic, unwelcoming, and unproductive. If someone tells you something hurts, the last thing you should do is say "well, it doesn't hurt me!".
    Granted, yes, with extensive tweaking and knob turning I can likely get most of the way towards a tone I want (rarely the whole way). But, it's generally lacking and takes an incredible amount of effort to get even that far. I've pretty much given up any hope that a bass specific, or even new bass amps/pres will come ever. There's another Axe-Fx III firmware out there that has, as you so perfectly put, a 0.1% difference amp out there for guitarists.
     
    Bushy, dr bonkers, DLM and 1 other person like this.

Share This Page