Anybody that worked on Camel's Andrew Latimer sound?

B

Bernard Danino

New Member
Hello,

I have looked everywhere. I could find information on his rig and effects but how to translate that into a preset when I don't even know how some of the effects sound like?
How do you go about working out such a sound from scratch?
The Axe-change forum is mostly just metal and hard-rock, not exactly what I am looking for...
 
jus had a quick look on the web. les paul / superstrat with two humbuckers > marshall jmp2000 or a pair of ac30 clones, but looking at pics, i see loads of other guitars and amps used)

then for fx it's some drive pedals - tubescreamer, rat and fulltone - and some delay

not hugely complicated, we have the drive pedals, the ac30's and delays and i think the jcm2000 is based on a super lead, which we have in the axe as the 1959slp

if you can find out what speakers he's using, then you'll be pretty much there.
 
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if you can post an example of the kind of tone you're looking for (i'm sure andy has used lots of different gear over the years and has had lots of different tones), we might be able to help you
 
Bernard Danino said:
Hello,

I have looked everywhere. I could find information on his rig and effects but how to translate that into a preset when I don't even know how some of the effects sound like?
How do you go about working out such a sound from scratch?
The Axe-change forum is mostly just metal and hard-rock, not exactly what I am looking for...
Click to expand...

As Simeon said, if you can get an idea on the guitar/amp/effects/speakers then they're more than likely all in the Axe.

What era or album are you referencing? My favourite album is Moonmadness which leans towards the fatter Les Paul tone; like David Gilmour on steroids. Earlier records like Mirage and Snow Goose sound a bit less overdriven and twangy in parts.
 
Bernard Danino said:
How do you go about working out such a sound from scratch?
Click to expand...

this is a good question, also.

research - do as much as you can and find out what gear was used to make the tone you like. look in the wiki and see if we have that gear in the axe...if not, find something close

create a patch and focus in on the amp to begin with, then the drives, then the fx. use your ears! check out some live stuff on youtube. is he messing with the volume and tone on the guitar? does he prefer bridge or neck pickup when soloing?

it can take a while, but persevere and you'll learn a ton of stuff in the process
 
Do a Youtube search for "Snow Goose." There is a great video of Camel playing some of it (around the time of the album release). Andy, if i recall, was playing a strat into an AC-30 and a Marshall - i'll go watch it again. That inspired me to create a "Snow Goose" patch, but that a "long long time ago, in a firmware far far away." It probably has been sufficiently borked by the 50 firmware updates by now since i wrote the patch.
 
Ok - re-watched the video. He starts off with a LP going through an AC-30 Head and Marshall cabinet, as well as a Silverface Bassman Head (i think) into a Fender Cab. Then, for Rhayader Goes to Town, he is playing a Strat. No idea what amp he is using at any particular time or what pedals he is using since the camera never pans back from close-ups.

I used an AC-30 to get Andy's smooth melodic playing. Love to know what pedal he was using for the overdrive. It sounded more Fender than Vox to me.
 
i had a look/listen at a bunch of stuff yesterday as well. i don't think he really has a "sound" per se...but he definitely has a "style"...which combines his approach to melody and his touch, which identifies him. his sound is about sustain, rather than distortion. it's smooth and singing. as he demonstrates himself....this can be achieved with a huge range of gear. if we were covering a camel song, i wouldn't really bother to create a new patch...i would just use my marshall lead and the neck pickup of whatever guitar i happened to be using at the time, but i would try to match his phrasing and his vibrato
 
One of my top favs, just a magnificent guitar player, so expressive!

It'll need translating but you'll find this interesting
http://www.latimerish.com/

I've been messing about with a few Latimerish patches lately. Pretty straightforward classic rock sort of setups
 
Heck, even Andy Ward was in Marillion for a short time. Lots of Marillion/Camel connections. I only got into Camel because AOL's Prog station plays a lot of Camel songs.
 
For example Ice, i think Andy used a Twin with a rat pedal on a strat, on the dvd Coming of Age there is a nice version from Ice... I have to say i get close with the tone on the axe but somhow the midrange is not the same so i am not sure about his amp and pedal setup.

 
Merlin said:
For example Ice, i think Andy used a Twin with a rat pedal on a strat, on the dvd Coming of Age there is a nice version from Ice... I have to say i get close with the tone on the axe but somhow the midrange is not the same so i am not sure about his amp and pedal setup.

Click to expand...


It's on the website I linked earlier, in a few shots in the DVD you can see his pedalboard which was a couple of modded Tube Screamers, a RAT, and a rack mounted delay
The guitar he used on that tour was an Eric Clapton model and he used the mid boost quite a fair bit.
 
ok, so i looked it up...the clapton mid boost is centred around 500Hz with a boost up to 25db. so it should be pretty easy to drop a peq block in at the beginning of the chain and simulate that. maybe it will get the midrange more in the ballpark.
 
Here is the preset of my first quick attempt for the song Sahara.

Scene 1 for clean, Scene 2 for Lead

Improvements and suggestions are very welcome :)

I am using an Amerian Deluxe with Dimarzio Area '58 at the neck.



BTW: anyone knows where can I find the midi file or backing track for this song?

__________
edit:
I forgot to mention that on Scene-1 I am using the cab ML Brit 80s E906-MD421 03 from Cab Pack 21. I've chosen this one at random and without comparing with others (it was the one accidentally available at this user cab). I never know what to use with a JC-120 amp
 

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Adinfinitum said:
I used an AC-30 to get Andy's smooth melodic playing.
Click to expand...

Do you mean a real AC30 or the Axe-FX ? I am also trying to recreated that melodic tone (at the beginning of the video)


However, I cannot find the G-Spot of the AC30. It sounds either too harsh, scratchy and gritty when it starts to clip or too sterile when it is clean.

I've tried with several 2x12 cabs, to reduce the highs, insert boosters, optical compressor, a drive at minimum, TapeDist...

I've also found this at the wiki-fractal:
http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=Amplifier_models_list
Cliff's comment:
  1. "Note that the particular AC-30 used for the model has this scratchy high end. This is reflected in the high Dyn Pres value. It's a hand-wired version and that can lead to this type of sound as the parasitics cause boosting of the very high frequencies when the amp is driven hard. The obvious solution is to turn Dyn Pres down." source
Click to expand...
But reducing DynPres doesn't make it sound smooth.

Any suggestion? better move to another amp? but then, I am wondering how can Latimer's AC30 sound like that
 
Piing said:
Do you mean a real AC30 or the Axe-FX ? I am also trying to recreated that melodic tone (at the beginning of the video)


However, I cannot find the G-Spot of the AC30. It sounds either too harsh, scratchy and gritty when it starts to clip or too sterile when it is clean.

I've tried with several 2x12 cabs, to reduce the highs, insert boosters, optical compressor, a drive at minimum, TapeDist...

I've also found this at the wiki-fractal:
http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=Amplifier_models_list

But reducing DynPres doesn't make it sound smooth.

Any suggestion? better move to another amp? but then, I am wondering how can Latimer's AC30 sound like that
Click to expand...


Try the Morgan, I usually go to that for me AC30 tones
 
6 yeas later, and after many Axe-FX III firmwares, I still haven't been able to get that Latimer tone with the AC30. It is either too clean or too harsh :D

This is the Gibtone Scout to Factory-1 #555 Cab (1x12+8 Gibtone 30 L 121 A AB) and a Griddle Cake drive

Still not 100% there, but pleasant to play
 
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