amp speaker page help

flying_walrus

flying_walrus

Experienced
my AX8 is in the mail, and I want to start by recreating my existing rig before selling my amps.

can anyone help me with the correct values for the amp speaker page to simulate an EVM12L in a Thiele cab?

It looks like I should use cliff's "Rumble" IRs... is there anything else I should keep in mind?

Thanks!

PS - anyone want a pair of Mark 5:25s?
 
My suggestion would be to not adjust any of the advanced parameters unless you are looking for a very specific change in tone. You should listen to the tone you get and listen for anything lacking or overbearing and adjust accordingly.
 
FWIW
Jay Mitchell once suggested to me that since the published free-air low freq res of the 12L is 55hz that I should try setting the Low Res on the Spkr Page to 65hz to better match my *open back* cabs when running a power map + guitar cabs rig.
And it seems to work nicely.

But, the IRs I'm using lately for FRFR are shot from Thiele cabs.
Since my FRFR playing is usually just so I don't have to mic my cabs on various gigs, I haven't decided yet if I'm going to tinker with the Spkr Page some more to find a middle ground that works with the IR *and* with the real cab.

With a Thiele cab though it should probably be somewhat higher.
Since most of the stock settings for most amp types that are normally paired with closed-back cabs have the Low Freq Res around 100hz it might not be worth your while to change it at all.

And sometimes I tell myself, rather than tinkering with something I don't really understand, and I really don't understand these parameters at all (lol), it's probably smarter to just use the stock values.
Still, with my real cabs, the 65hz setting does feel a bit better to me.
 
lwknives said:
My suggestion would be to not adjust any of the advanced parameters unless you are looking for a very specific change in tone. You should listen to the tone you get and listen for anything lacking or overbearing and adjust accordingly.
Click to expand...
hmm. i have been known to overthink things. thanks,
 
Guillaume Lortie said:
is it possible for you do do IR of your own cab? that would be the best way to go i think
Click to expand...
i can't afford the kinds of microphones and preamps used in the commercial world, so there's no way my own IR will sound as good...

and it's my understanding that an IR captures the sound of a speaker, whereas these settings describe the electrical effect the speaker has on the amp.
 
joegold said:
FWIW
Jay Mitchell once suggested to me that since the published free-air low freq res of the 12L is 55hz that I should try setting the Low Res on the Spkr Page to 65hz to better match my *open back* cabs when running a power map + guitar cabs rig.
And it seems to work nicely.

But, the IRs I'm using lately for FRFR are shot from Thiele cabs.
Since my FRFR playing is usually just so I don't have to mic my cabs on various gigs, I haven't decided yet if I'm going to tinker with the Spkr Page some more to find a middle ground that works with the IR *and* with the real cab.

With a Thiele cab though it should probably be somewhat higher.
Since most of the stock settings for most amp types that are normally paired with closed-back cabs have the Low Freq Res around 100hz it might not be worth your while to change it at all.

And sometimes I tell myself, rather than tinkering with something I don't really understand, and I really don't understand these parameters at all (lol), it's probably smarter to just use the stock values.
Still, with my real cabs, the 65hz setting does feel a bit better to me.
Click to expand...

am curious what thiele IRs you're liking?
 
If you are used to this speaker let your ears guide you.
The better procedure is to find the right IR and then make the fine tune in the speaker page.

We have some EV factory cabs, most of them Thiele:
F8 - 1x12 E12L (RW) - 200w Electro-Voice EVM-12L, housed in a solid mahogany, open-backed cabinet.
F11 - 1x12 Bludo Mix - Dumble dual port closed-back cab with an 8-ohm Blackhawk WGS Alnico speaker, similar in tone to an EVM-12L (Cab Pack 17).
F105 - 4x12 Rumble EV12L RNR1 - EVM 12L speakers in a 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet (Cab Pack 17).
F106 - 4x12 Rumble EV12S M160 - EVM 12S speakers in a 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet (Cab Pack 17).
F144 - 4x12 Mar-Cb EV-S Mix (OH) - Marshall cabinet with EVM 12S speakers.
F166 - 4x12 Rumble L 121 A - EVM 12L speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet, Royer 121 (Cab Pack 17).
F167 - 4x12 Rumble L 4047 A - EVM 12L speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet, Audio-Technica AT-4047 (Cab Pack 17).
F168 - 4x12 Rumble L G44 A - EVM 12L speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet (Cab Pack 17).
F169 - 4x12 Rumble S 121 C - EVM 12S speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet, Royer 121 (Cab Pack 17).
F170 - 4x12 Rumble S 4047 B - EVM 12S speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet, Audio-Technica AT-404 (Cab Pack 17).
F171 - 4x12 Rumble S R1 D - EVM 12S speakers in a 4x12 12L/12S “Thiele” Dumble cabinet, SE Electronics RNR1 (Cab Pack 17).

The IRs are baked with a third factor not included in your real world cab, besides the speaker and the enclosure you have the mic, is not the same stand at 6-8 feets from your cab that put a mic placed close to the cap. You may like to blend 2 different IRs!!

Once you have your favorite IR go to the speaker page in the amp block and experiment with Low Res Frequency parameter, take 55-65hz as starting point and move the frequency up and down 'til the sound makes sense to you. When you have the freq set you may need to change Low Res Q a tad.
High res usually is fine, but don't be afraid to turn some wheels and press some buttons, you have the real deal sitting next to you, so nothing can go wrong.
 
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flying_walrus said:
am curious what thiele IRs you're liking?
Click to expand...

Well, remember that I'm not really an FRFR guy and that every time I do sit down to work on my FRFR feed I tend to change my mind about what seems to do the trick for me that day.

But most recently I've been using an OH IR with the following name:
"OwnHammer_112_THIELE_EV-L_57-03.wav"
which I've converted to Ultra Res .syx via Cab-Lab 3.
It's one of 11 IRs they shot of this cab with an SM57.
#0 is the brightest IR and #10 is the darkest.
So this one's pretty bright w/o being too harsh. IMO

It's from the OH collection called (on my hard drive anyway this is what it's called now):
"112-GTR_THIELE_EV-L_V3-Mix".

The .wav file was either in the:
"Wav-200ms/4800-Hz-Mono/112-GTR-THEILE/EV-L/V3-Mics-Raw"
or
"Wav-500ms/4800-Hz-Mono/112-GTR-THEILE/EV-L/V3-Mics-Raw"
folder.
Probably wouldn't make a difference which length IR I started with since CL3 truncates the length anyway.
In CL3 I probably also converted it to Mpt (minimum phase transfer) but the OH collection also has folders with .wav files that are already Mpt, so I could have used them instead.
Not sure.
I just usually like to start with raw IRs in CL3, but Mpt is the way to go usually, in my experience with IRs to be used in the Axe, especially if you want to mess around with mixing IRs either in CL3 or in the Cab Block.

But this V3 IR collection does not appear to be available anymore from OH.
Maybe Kevin can chime in (if he sees this) and let us know if there's still a way to purchase this IR collection?
 
have had the ax8 since tuesday, and am very happy with a blend i made from the EVL IRs in cab pack 17. will be selling my FX8 and heads soon.
 
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