Am I a Fusspot Curmudgeon for Wanting my new product NEW, and in a NEW Box?

It’s hard for a guitar store to have 2 of every guitar they sell and know they won’t sell or lose money on one of them.
As mentioned above a couple of times, this discussion doesn't relate to guitars, mostly just pedals / pro sound type items (maybe amps in some cases).
 
As mentioned above a couple of times, this discussion doesn't relate to guitars, mostly just pedals / pro sound type items (maybe amps in some cases).

How is a pedal different than a guitar though ?

It’s okay if someone else’s fingers have been over the fretboard playing a guitar, but if a pedal has had its knobs turned or it’s foot switch clicked on/off, it’s no longer “new” enough?

From what I’ve seen, a lot of pedals are tested when built. Analogman from what I recall has a QC guy who plugs them all in and plays a bit, makes such it sounds like it’s supposed to, then it goes back in the box….

So a “new” pedal has already had its switch stomped, a cable into its input jack etc, so does it matter if a second person plugged into it at a shop for 5 minutes then they put it back into a box ?
 
After quite a long time at this, here's my perspective... if it is fully functional to make music, it is statistically just as good as new.

Keep in mind that as soon as you purchase something new and get it home and open it all up and start messing with it. IT HAS IMMEDIATELY BECOME USED! Even to yourself in actual reality.
 
I am also with you, if I am paying for new I want new, in the original undamaged box! I'm not just talking about music equipment but now most anything I buy. Too many times I got screwed by open boxes and items that clearly looked returned at some point that I bought and had to return it or be on the phone for hours to get missing parts! Whew, I feel better now!
 
I think things have changed with respect to how retail sales in the music stores are done. Back in the day when you went into a small music store they had one of everything they stocked on the floor for demo. The rest of the stock was in the back and they usually had 2-3 of whatever. Guitars for the most part have always been on display for sale and demo.

Today at brick and mortar stores the stock on almost everything is the display and demo so there is less over head! Unless you shop mainly at Sweetwater pretty sure that's how it's done. I haven't bought any new pedals or amps in years but I have looked at them and usually there is 2 or 3 of the popular selling units and one of everything else. If they are out then it's "I can get it for you in a day or so".

The EV monitors and the Soundcraft ui 16 that bought from Sweetwater last year all were new in the box when they arrived with no signs of being reboxed or demoing. I think that's when online buying from larger stores that have there $hit together will send you an unopened unit and will let you know if it's a demo or not prior to buying it.
 
How is a pedal different than a guitar though ?
Because a guitar is a guitar and a pedal is a pedal.
They are very different items and require different inspection/verification/validation before buying.
I've never clicked on a Boss pedal and said - hmmmm, this pedal doesn't click as smoothly as my last pedal....and the finish isn't as nice.
Guitars - totally different story. Every guitar feels different and that defines our connection to the instrument as well as our playing.

Back to OP:
I would not pay full price for a demo pedal, simply because I can buy a mint one on Reverb/Ebay for less than full price.
If I'm playing full price - it's new in the box. Period.
I'm not saying I need that to be the case....I buy used pedals. But I wouldn't pay full price.

Call me what you will :)
 
How is a pedal different than a guitar though ?
As I mention above, I recognize retailers' challenge wrt guitars since they are often considered personal in a way, so guitarists want to try them to see if there is one that "speaks" to them. Personally, maybe due to being a lefty, and unable to easily demo guitars, I am not so so hung up on finding "the one". So my own concerns about buying a possibly heavily demo'd / abused product at full price apply to guitars also. In fact, my strat was ordered despite an in-store lefty model available to purchase immediately. I don't think that's totally unreasonable given the treatment I've seen some guitars given while being demo'd in store and having no idea what sort of treatment the guitar I'm holding has had (more so for leftys as there is often only a couple of them in the store that many have possibly demo'd (including the ones that like to do dive bombs on fixed bridge guitars by pushing forward on the neck lol!). But I get the whole "the one" thing - my SG is one of those - tried it in store - fell in love - the heart wants what it wants.

It’s okay if someone else’s fingers have been over the fretboard.
if a pedal has had its knobs turned or it’s foot switch clicked on/off, it’s no longer “new” enough?
a QC guy who plugs them all in and plays a bit
a “new” pedal has already had its switch stomped
a cable into its input jack
a second person plugged into it at a shop for 5 minutes
So these are all extreme scenarios you've made up to make it seem like my concerns are ridiculous eh? If you've read above, you'll see I'm talking about new pedals sold with no box or ratty box / gear that's been heavily demo'd or suspected to have been. Would you be comfortable / confident buying a Revv or JHS pedal with no box at full price?, or the same instance of a tube amp you saw being demo'd in store months ago (and wondering how many hours it has on it now)? I'm gonna guess that you would not be comfortable despite your response above.
 
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Because a guitar is a guitar and a pedal is a pedal.
They are very different items and require different inspection/verification/validation before buying.
I've never clicked on a Boss pedal and said - hmmmm, this pedal doesn't click as smoothly as my last pedal....and the finish isn't as nice.
Guitars - totally different story. Every guitar feels different and that defines our connection to the instrument as well as our playing.

Back to OP:
I would not pay full price for a demo pedal, simply because I can buy a mint one on Reverb/Ebay for less than full price.
If I'm playing full price - it's new in the box. Period.
I'm not saying I need that to be the case....I buy used pedals. But I wouldn't pay full price.

Call me what you will :)


You’ve never come across many TGP’ers and their pedal buying habits ….

Blemish in the finish, this knob turns easier than that knob, the manual has a crease, this switch feels weird, there is a pop when i turn it on…. Etc etc, I want a 50% refund crowd lol
 
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re haggling / negotiating price as mentioned in a couple of posts above - ya, this is something I should maybe be doing more often. I've never been much of a haggler - shy/uncomfortable about doing it so rarely successful. In the case of no-box / ratty box / demo's, I also feel like I'd be entering into a negotiation from a starting point of disadvantage right from the get-go. I mean, in the case of no box for example, I'm negotiating to get the price back down to retail given that I'm being asked to buy a somewhat incomplete product (no box, demo'd) for full price. I fully recognize that it's a changing landscape and recent events have have been tough for retailers to hold much stock etc, and, though I feel for them, I also don't always want to be the one holding the bag, so the trend for me has been to buy more and more online while the retail model finds its way.
 
As I mention above, I recognize retailers' challenge wrt guitars since they are often considered personal in a way, so guitarists want to try them to see if there is one that "speaks" to them. Personally, maybe due to being a lefty, and unable to easily demo guitars, I am not so so hung up on finding "the one". So my own concerns about buying a possibly heavily demo'd / abused product at full price apply to guitars also. In fact, my strat was ordered despite an in-store lefty model available to purchase immediately. I don't think that's totally unreasonable given the treatment I've seen some guitars given while being demo'd in store and having no idea what sort of treatment the guitar I'm holding has had (more so for leftys as there is often only a couple of them in the store that every lefty in the city has possibly demo'd possibly including the ones that like to do dive bombs on fixed bridge guitars by pushing forward on the neck lol!). But I get the whole "the one" thing - my SG is one of those - tried it in store - fell in love - the heart wants what it wants.







So these are all extreme scenarios you've made up to make it seem like my concerns are ridiculous eh? If you've read above, you'll see I'm talking about new pedals sold with no box or ratty box / gear that's been heavily demo'd or suspected to have been. Would you be comfortable / confident buying a Revv or JHS pedal with no box at full price?, or the same instance of a tube amp you saw being demo'd in store months ago (and wondering how many hours it has on it now)? I'm gonna guess that you would not be comfortable despite your response above.

I’m not trying to make light of anything or addressing any one person over another.

Simply a general question for those involved in the thread and the general consensus that it seems more okay to have something like a guitar previously handled, but saying something like a pedal should be new in box, meaning never opened.

I’m simply interested in what makes one thing different than the other for some people ?

It’s not a judgement or saying they are right or wrong, but simply trying to get an understanding of their viewpoint as from my perspective I don’t quite see the distinction
 
I’m not trying to make light of anything or addressing any one person over another.

Simply a general question for those involved in the thread and the general consensus that it seems more okay to have something like a guitar previously handled, but saying something like a pedal should be new in box, meaning never opened.

I’m simply interested in what makes one thing different than the other for some people ?

It’s not a judgement or saying they are right or wrong, but simply trying to get an understanding of their viewpoint as from my perspective I don’t quite see the distinction
fair enough - but you responded to me above with examples that are completely out of context to the scenarios I've described and to what I intended this thread to be about when I posted it.

Edit: But, ok, if we want to have a conversation about where the fine line is between new and used, then I guess we can do that too: For me, "no box" is used, made available for in-store demoing is used since I have no way of knowing how much handling / abuse it got from users who had no vested interest in being careful with it. I would not have comcerns wrt the scenarios u mention above.
 
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I understand the desire for “untouched”, but what I’ve noticed lately is I don’t even care about whatever is out there, The tools we have at hand can create it. I don’t need more.

There is so much power and capability in the modelers that we haven’t even begun to figure out what they can do. And they get more powerful with each revision. And if we run into a dead end we only have to show a good use-case and it will show up.
+1 - Fractal cures most of my gas - but I do tend to "fall of the wagon" now and then.
 
I would not pay full price for a demo pedal, simply because I can buy a mint one on Reverb/Ebay for less than full price.
There's a difference between those 2 however: With a "demo" unit, it is sold as new, you are the first owner, so you get the warranty. With less-than-full-price, mint gear, there's no warranty since you're not the original owner, unless it's transferable, which unless it's sold in a country that has laws requiring it to be, I doubt there's many, if any, companies that offer that any more. Even Mesa Boogie stopped doing that in 2019 I believe.

So if you tried to get a discount on a pedal because it was a demo model, and I ran the store, I'd simply remind you of the warranty issue, and tell you I'll have a brand-new, unopened one for you in a couple of days. My guess is the profit margins at the mom-and-pop stores aren't big enough to sell a new pedal, demo or not, at a discount, and most guitar players just don't care anyway.

How is a pedal different than a guitar though?
Lots of ways. As an example, when I bought my Taylor 714ce at GC, the one on display had signs of being played. I didn't care about the fact it had been a demo, but I wasn't about to pay full price for that particular guitar, with old-ish strings, and swirls on the pickguard.

They had 3 others in the back, 2 Spruce top, and 1 Cedar. And when it comes to acoustics, I need to hear it. They were fine working with me (I was serious in wanting a Taylor acoustic, as I had already bought and returned 2 others, a 314ce and a 614ce, each time spending more money, so I'm sure that factored into it), and brought out the others and opened them up. And I was very careful.

I bought one of Spruce top versions, and willingly paid MSRP on this one, because I recognized the service they were giving me. So I think a lot of one's expectations, and how far a store is willing to go to accommodate your concerns, comes down to the relationship you establish during your purchase. Plus, it wasn't a $129 pedal, but a $3500 guitar, so there's that too. Lots of factors to consider.
 
Where did he say that?
I quoted those scenarios above - If you'd prefer I say "stated?" instead of "made up?", then ok, I'll revise - point I was trying to make - I think pretty clearly, was that those scenarios (ie QC usage) are not at all the kind of thing I'm referring to in the context of this thread, but i agreed (see above) to discuss the nuances of new vs used characteristics if we want.
 
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I quoted those scenarios above - If you'd prefer I say "stated?" instead of "made up?", then ok, I'll revise - point I was trying to make - I think pretty clearly, was that those scenarios (ie QC usage) are not at all the kind of thing I'm referring to in the context of this thread, but i agreed (see above) to discussed the nuances of new vs used characteristics if we want.
He didn't make it seem like your concerns were ridiculous. He just asked questions. You need to lighten up!
 
Holy shit, I’ve been using the word “extreme” entirely wrong my whole life.
dunno - being concerned cuz a QC tech tested yur new pedal before it went in the box sounds a little extreme / rediculous to me even as curmudgeoner awaiting final diagnosis - but to each their own.
 
I have a couple friends that are in the "won't buy unless it's in a factory sealed box from the back" group. To each their own, but I often tell them that they're more likely to run into this problem at their smaller local shops than if they just order from somewhere like Sweetwater. If that sort of thing is a big deal to you as a customer just being a little more selective about where you shop can save you a lot of frustration.
 
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