Advice on Custom Guitar Order

T

tylerisdumb

Member
I ordered a Strat style guitar from a reputable builder and when I received the instrument it had buzzing at the nut. I contacted the company and sent it back for repairs, to which they agreed and upon its arrival they replaced the nut.

After they received the guitar I asked if it could be setup to my liking-.007 neck relief, 1/16 action off of the last fret to the bottom of the strings, and minor float to the Trem. The guitar has a 12” radius and a Gotoh Trem with bent saddles.

I then receive an email from a rep quoting their lead tech that stated, "This setup will make the action considerably lower than the guitar or any strat was designed for. This is lower than jackson custom shop action and those are neck throughs with a compound radius. So this guitar is going to buzz at that setup. If you play with any kind of gain it wont matter, but clean this setup will most likely buzz. Same as any strat or tele.”

I responded and stated I have a few Suhr guitars that have those specs and match the description mentioned yet can setup to my preferred measurements. They responded that the instrument is fine and the lead tech who made the statements, quoted above, was speaking from a luthier’s perspective and that the guitar has some fret clatter but is ok.

The exchange has driven me to question the instrument, mainly because the tech’s statements are ludicrous especially for a $3400 guitar and if I want them to send it to me. I worry if I have them send the guitar to me and if it does not meet my expectations or can’t be setup to my spec and I decide to send it back I will be hit with a 20% restocking fee.

So after my long-winded blather, I ask what would you do?
 
tylerisdumb said:
I ordered a Strat style guitar from a reputable builder and when I received the instrument it had buzzing at the nut. I contacted the company and sent it back for repairs, to which they agreed and upon its arrival they replaced the nut.

After they received the guitar I asked if it could be setup to my liking-.007 neck relief, 1/16 action off of the last fret to the bottom of the strings, and minor float to the Trem. The guitar has a 12” radius and a Gotoh Trem with bent saddles.

I then receive an email from a rep quoting their lead tech that stated, "This setup will make the action considerably lower than the guitar or any strat was designed for. This is lower than jackson custom shop action and those are neck throughs with a compound radius. So this guitar is going to buzz at that setup. If you play with any kind of gain it wont matter, but clean this setup will most likely buzz. Same as any strat or tele.”

I responded and stated I have a few Suhr guitars that have those specs and match the description mentioned yet can setup to my preferred measurements. They responded that the instrument is fine and the lead tech who made the statements, quoted above, was speaking from a luthier’s perspective and that the guitar has some fret clatter but is ok.

The exchange has driven me to question the instrument, mainly because the tech’s statements are ludicrous especially for a $3400 guitar and if I want them to send it to me. I worry if I have them send the guitar to me and if it does not meet my expectations or can’t be setup to my spec and I decide to send it back I will be hit with a 20% restocking fee.

So after my long-winded blather, I ask what would you do?
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Is it the builder or the store repair-setup guy saying this setup is a problem? If it's the store guy I would contact the builder to verify this setup will work with his guitars. I would think it should given it's a $3500 guitar! Andersons can also definitely be setup with this action with the same or even less neck bow.

From the Anderson forum, reply by Tom: with a metal ruler standing up on the last two frets we set the high E right on the 1/16" line. we set the low E so we can just see the 1/16" line under the strings. morph the rest to make an even blend.
From the Anderson website: Check the amount of clearance between the bottom of the string and the top of the 7th fret. (While still using right hand thumb to hold the string at the 15th fret, you can use the index finger to lightly tap at the 7th fret to more clearly see the gap). There should be approximately .003 to .006 inches-that is about the thickness of a couple sheets of copy paper.
 
notalemming said:
Is it the builder or the store repair-setup guy saying this setup is a problem? If it's the store guy I would contact the builder to verify this setup will work with his guitars. I would think it should given it's a $3500 guitar! Andersons can also definitely be setup with this action with the same or even less neck bow.

From the Anderson forum, reply by Tom: with a metal ruler standing up on the last two frets we set the high E right on the 1/16" line. we set the low E so we can just see the 1/16" line under the strings. morph the rest to make an even blend.
From the Anderson website: Check the amount of clearance between the bottom of the string and the top of the 7th fret. (While still using right hand thumb to hold the string at the 15th fret, you can use the index finger to lightly tap at the 7th fret to more clearly see the gap). There should be approximately .003 to .006 inches-that is about the thickness of a couple sheets of copy paper.
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Thanks for the response.

It’s the builder who stated it can’t be setup to those measurements.

Thanks for the Anderson (I love my Anderson too) reference, it’s almost exactly the same as what Suhr suggests.
 
tylerisdumb said:
Thanks for the response.

It’s the builder who stated it can’t be setup to those measurements.

Thanks for the Anderson (I love my Anderson too) reference, it’s almost exactly the same as what Suhr suggests.
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OK, he should know. I guess it comes down to exactly what he means by fret clatter & how much it is, which would really depend on how aggressively you play. I have 4 Andersons & love them. My favorite strat style builder for sure. I can play them very aggressively & they stay pretty darned buzz & clatter free. It sounds like the only way to be sure is take delivery of the guitar & go from there.
 
You shouldn't expect a tailor made setup from any factory even spending $3500.

I'd also say giving specifics like that- is a little unreasonable and impossible to please

Have whoever sets up guitars the way you like it set it up for you, the way you like it.

The builder isn't being rude- they're just protecting their liability- they build guitars, if they feel they can't play well set up as you request- they don't want to put out a bad product- I don't blame them.
 
Jeries said:
You shouldn't expect a tailor made setup from any factory even spending $3500.

I'd also say giving specifics like that- is a little unreasonable and impossible to please

Have whoever sets up guitars the way you like it set it up for you, the way you like it.

The builder isn't being rude- they're just protecting their liability- they build guitars, if they feel they can't play well set up as you request- they don't want to put out a bad product- I don't blame them.
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The thing is, the specs he is asking for are within the factory specs of other known builders. Maybe this guy is just not at their level of build experience or quality. Hard to really say without playing the guitar but I would be concerned. If he was asking for ridiculously low action, I wouldn't ship out a guitar like that either but that's not the case. I've seen specific setup specs on Suhr build sheets before so it's not unheard of either.
 
Dodge Viper's go 200 mph but my Prius can only go 100. I'm going to go to the Toyota Dealership and demand it goes faster.

What similar/other known builders can do- isn't what whoever in question does/can do- if you wanted what they can do- he should have bought a guitar from them.
 
Having said all that, it’s not another guitar builders guitar. If the company making the guitar feel the specs given to them by someone else are incorrect for their guitar, it’s good that they advise you so. Imagine if I said to my motorcycle dealer, “ I want a 2019 fxd but it must have a spark plug gap of 12 thou” - they would rightly advise me that this particular model is not suited to that specification and may run rough. ... for me to then say “ but my qa50 has a 12 thou gap and is fine” doesn’t ring true - I’d be comparing two different things, and expecting them to be identical.
In the builders shoes, I would think the customer is being unreasonable.
Thanks
Pauly
 
Jeries said:
Dodge Viper's go 200 mph but my Prius can only go 100. I'm going to go to the Toyota Dealership and demand it goes faster.

What similar/other known builders can do- isn't what whoever in question does/can do- if you wanted what they can do- he should have bought a guitar from them.
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Since when is a Strat copy from one builder as extremely different than one from another as the nonsensical example you posted? Asking a Strat copy to be just like a Les Paul, maybe LOL! By the way, I own Strats from Anderson, Suhr, Tuttle & Melancon & they all easily achieve the requested setup spec & more. No reason any other builder worth his salt couldn't do the same.
 
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tylerisdumb said:
After they received the guitar I asked if it could be setup to my liking-.007 neck relief, 1/16 action off of the last fret to the bottom of the strings, and minor float to the Trem. The guitar has a 12” radius and a Gotoh Trem with bent saddles.

I then receive an email from a rep quoting their lead tech that stated, "This setup will make the action considerably lower than the guitar or any strat was designed for. This is lower than jackson custom shop action and those are neck throughs with a compound radius. So this guitar is going to buzz at that setup. If you play with any kind of gain it wont matter, but clean this setup will most likely buzz. Same as any strat or tele.”
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If the frets are level, .007" relief is more than needed, and 1/16" action should be doable on the treble side, but may get into fret buzzing if applied to the bass side, depending on how vigorously and horizontally you pick.

If the frets are not level, 1/16" action is almost certainly too low.
 
pauly said:
Having said all that, it’s not another guitar builders guitar. If the company making the guitar feel the specs given to them by someone else are incorrect for their guitar, it’s good that they advise you so. Imagine if I said to my motorcycle dealer, “ I want a 2019 fxd but it must have a spark plug gap of 12 thou” - they would rightly advise me that this particular model is not suited to that specification and may run rough. ... for me to then say “ but my qa50 has a 12 thou gap and is fine” doesn’t ring true - I’d be comparing two different things, and expecting them to be identical.
In the builders shoes, I would think the customer is being unreasonable.
Thanks
Pauly
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Thanks for your input.

Your response is very interesting to me. I would assume you have a few guitars of varying style and if so, do you set them up similarity? Barring the exceptions of variations like altered, drop, or open tuning, purpose (slide or whatever).

I have a few different brands and styles of guitar and they all setup fairly similarly, with of course minor deviations, but on the whole they all achieve the setup I specified. Even the guitars that I have with different string spacing, radii, or string length allow me to set the guitar to the measurements I specified.

I also failed to mention that when I received this guitar it had action of 5/32 off the last fret to the bottom of the string.
 
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Jeries said:
You shouldn't expect a tailor made setup from any factory even spending $3500.

I'd also say giving specifics like that- is a little unreasonable and impossible to please

Have whoever sets up guitars the way you like it set it up for you, the way you like it.

The builder isn't being rude- they're just protecting their liability- they build guitars, if they feel they can't play well set up as you request- they don't want to put out a bad product- I don't blame them.
Click to expand...

Thanks for responding.

I’ll try to clarify my expectations, which are that I should have the ability to adjust to the specs I mentioned. When I received the guitar I adjusted the guitar to my preference and it was fairly buzzy-putting the nut issue aside.

I asked them to set it up to confirm or disprove my findings.

I guess I am guilty of expecting that this guitar in the +$3000 range would setup like the 10 other guitars that I own in that price bracket.
 
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if you had 10 guitars from that builder i'd understand but you can't compare his to others.

likewise- you can take said guitar, shim it, set it up/do whatever you want to get it there- and if it can't get to where you want it- with what he explained or a tech explained radius this that whatever- you should have brought up these questions before hand- 'hey here's how i like my guitars set up'

i'd also say having specifications like you're nasa is a little unrealistic... and if you have 10 other $3000 guitars set up to those specs- why buy the 11th from a company you're not comfortable with?

And... really only one company makes a strat.
And sure they kinda suck- but they do make custom shop and master built instruments that are the best anyone can get

Clapton ain't playing off the wall shit
 
Hi Tyler,
Yes I have a few guitars and basses of various brands and styles.
I first set them up as the manufacturers instruct. Then, if I can get away with it, I adjust things like action as I like it lower usually - except for slide haha! Don’t always get away with it, but with judicial tweaking of neck relief and saddle height I normally get a compromise I’m happy with.
5/32? Not sure I’d be happy with that. I feel your manufacturer is covering their arse as your specs are a bit outside theirs - but that’s just speculation.

Thanks
Pauly

tylerisdumb said:
Thanks for your input.

Your response is very interesting to me. I would assume you have a few guitars of varying style and if so, do you set them up similarity? Barring the exceptions of variations like altered, drop, or open tuning, purpose (slide or whatever).

I have a few different brands and styles of guitar and they all setup fairly similarly, with of course minor deviations, but on the whole they all achieve the setup I specified. Even the guitars that I have with different string spacing, radii, or string length allow me to set the guitar to the measurements I specified.

I also failed to mention that when I received this guitar it had action of 5/32 off the last fret to the bottom of the string.
Click to expand...
 
Jeries said:
if you had 10 guitars from that builder i'd understand but you can't compare his to others.

likewise- you can take said guitar, shim it, set it up/do whatever you want to get it there- and if it can't get to where you want it- with what he explained or a tech explained radius this that whatever- you should have brought up these questions before hand- 'hey here's how i like my guitars set up'

i'd also say having specifications like you're nasa is a little unrealistic... and if you have 10 other $3000 guitars set up to those specs- why buy the 11th from a company you're not comfortable with?

And... really only one company makes a strat.
And sure they kinda suck- but they do make custom shop and master built instruments that are the best anyone can get

Clapton ain't playing off the wall shit
Click to expand...

If I had 10 guitars from the same builder your point would hold, but I have said guitars from 6 different builders all of which have the adjustability to attain my preferred spec.

The thought of having to shim the neck on a guitar in this price bracket is strange and suggest the guitar was constructed with poor geometry. I think one should be able to set a guitar to desired spec within the parameters of common playability. This is why I point to other builders—these builders send their guitars out of the factory with these measurements, daily, which establishes commonality.

I could have and in retrospect should have asked about my preferred setup, but could I equally suggest that this manufacturer address the setup restrictions somewhere on their website or tech information section?

Thanks again.
 
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pauly said:
Hi Tyler,
Yes I have a few guitars and basses of various brands and styles.
I first set them up as the manufacturers instruct. Then, if I can get away with it, I adjust things like action as I like it lower usually - except for slide haha! Don’t always get away with it, but with judicial tweaking of neck relief and saddle height I normally get a compromise I’m happy with.
5/32? Not sure I’d be happy with that. I feel your manufacturer is covering their arse as your specs are a bit outside theirs - but that’s just speculation.

Thanks
Pauly
Click to expand...

Thanks Pauly

I essentially approach the initial setup the same way, but I go to my spec and then make minor changes to account for the idiosyncrasies of the instrument.

You are right that they are trying to cover their poopers.
 
You're a guitar player not NASA

Play the guitar- if you like it- use it- if you don't sell it.

Have your guy set it up how you like it- if you like it- keep it- if it buzzes, sell it.

Your expectations are unrealistic

Every guitar has to play to the 16th of an inch exactly or what? like it's impossible to play? it's a guitar not Excalibur

Maybe you like his neck size, and radius and think something different is better

"my spec" "my spec" "my spec"
then build a guitar- don't pay someone to build one, then AFTER tell him 'your spec'

the company is right and everything the tech said is smart and protecting their liability and trying to deal with a customer- who- sounds like a pain in the ass- be fair.
 
Jeries said:
You're a guitar player not NASA

Play the guitar- if you like it- use it- if you don't sell it.

Have your guy set it up how you like it- if you like it- keep it- if it buzzes, sell it.

Your expectations are unrealistic

Every guitar has to play to the 16th of an inch exactly or what? like it's impossible to play? it's a guitar not Excalibur

Maybe you like his neck size, and radius and think something different is better

"my spec" "my spec" "my spec"
then build a guitar- don't pay someone to build one, then AFTER tell him 'your spec'

the company is right and everything the tech said is smart and protecting their liability and trying to deal with a customer- who- sounds like a pain in the ass- be fair.
Click to expand...

I didn’t know I was trying to be the National Aeronautics and Space Administration😂 A bit too agro, however your input has been noted.

Not to mention if I were to raise the action on all of your guitars by 1/16 of an inch you would most definitely notice.

This is the last I’ll respond to you so here it is in the plainest English I can, it is not necessarily about “my spec” (sorry that triggers you) it’s about having the ability to adjust the guitar to reasonable specifications. They are stating this guitar will not accommodate some players and that is a significant issue. If I were to invert the numbers and wanted to increase the action higher and was told this guitar can not achieve those results that would be equally an issue.

Thanks and take care.
 
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Jeries said:
You're a guitar player not NASA

Play the guitar- if you like it- use it- if you don't sell it.

Have your guy set it up how you like it- if you like it- keep it- if it buzzes, sell it.

Your expectations are unrealistic

Every guitar has to play to the 16th of an inch exactly or what? like it's impossible to play? it's a guitar not Excalibur

Maybe you like his neck size, and radius and think something different is better

"my spec" "my spec" "my spec"
then build a guitar- don't pay someone to build one, then AFTER tell him 'your spec'

the company is right and everything the tech said is smart and protecting their liability and trying to deal with a customer- who- sounds like a pain in the ass- be fair.
Click to expand...
Why take the hit on selling a used custom order guitar if you know ahead of time it's not going to be what you want/need? The OP's expectations are well with in the realm of being realistic & I'm surprised it's even an issue. It's not a 7.25" radius or anything. It's 12". The fact that there is a problem with the nut right form the get go is really telling to me that this builder has quality control issues. The more I think about it, the more inclined I would be to pass & get something I knew was going to work for me. Anyway, of course, it's the OP's call. Good luck Tyler!
 
Sorry to hear of the issues with your custom guitar. Hope it can all get resolved smoothly and to your satisfaction. I too am about to pull the trigger on a custom order from a smaller company in the same price range as yours. Out of curiosity (and a little bit of caution lol), who is the builder of your guitar? If you’re ok with letting me know that info, you can PM it to me. I’m not looking to call any company out or cast a negative light on them if it isn’t warranted. Just want to know if I have to be extra careful when considering my order. Thanks!
 
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