Advice is needed for classic lead tone

R

riku_iki

Member
Hi,

I spent long hours unsuccessfully trying to recreate this tone:

I tried various Marshalls (plexis, brit800), but they sound fizzy and far not as clear as tone on the video on my setup.

Maybe someone can recommend amp+cab duo which could give me similar result so I can try them?

Thank you in advance.
 
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As far as the album tone, it was supposedly recorded with a 100 watt Super Lead into Marshall 4x12 with Celestions (probably Greenbacks). The rest is likely Angus' touch and Mutt Lange's studio wizardry.
 
Ok, thank you, I will try this combination.

Another problem may be my guitar: fender pro strat with shawbucker. People in internet say it is not potted and not high output, and maybe that's because I have extra noise and fizziness.
 
Great tone! I'm guessing that finding the right IR will be the key to this puzzle since the plexi amps in the Axe-Fx should have the amp part of the picture covered.
 
riku_iki said:
Ok, thank you, I will try this combination.

Another problem may be my guitar: fender pro strat with shawbucker. People in internet say it is not potted and not high output, and maybe that's because I have extra noise and fizziness.
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Don't know much about Shawbucker but your description sounds almost like a PAF and that's the right pickup!

Try 100w plexi, jumpered. Put trim to 0.5 (put it back to 1 if you don't get enough gain for your tastes but with too much you would have less usable volume pot range (part about volume and ton pot coming soon)

Crank the Treble channel, this will clip the bright cap...and that fizziness is gone, right? Turn bass all the way down (for bass use the Normal Drive, second channel if you need to). Crank the mids and probably also the high, adjust presence to taste. Now the trick with Plexi...turn down your volume pot so you get the desired gain. And if needed you can tame the Highs with your ton pot(i would use sparingly, if you need to turn it down too much than i would check the Presence and/or Treble.

For these type of tones with Marshalls try to use greenback IRs but "Pre Rola" ones. Like @ML SOUND LAB 's ML Legends on fractal shop. Or there might even be some Pre Rola greenbacks already loaded in Factory IRs. if shot in a right way Pre Rola Greenbacks help also with the excessive bass and treble coming out of the plexi.

These amps were designed to be cranked and other way of dialing them is IMHO kinda fighting with the amp. Though you can get great tones with unexpected ways/experiments with the black box, it helped me a lot to use the amps in a way they are ment to be.
 
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Semih Yanyali said:
For these type of tones with Marshalls try to use greenback IRs but "Pre Rola" ones. Like @ML SOUND LAB 's ML Legends on fractal shop. Or there might even be some Pre Rola greenbacks already loaded in Factory IRs. if shot in a right way Pre Rola Greenbacks help also with the excessive bass and treble coming out of the plexi.
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Thank you, looking at the docs, looks like there are plenty of such IRs, I will try today:

Based on a 1970's Marshall 1960B "checkerboard" 4x12 cabinet with pre-Rola Celestion G12H-30 (55 Hz cone) speakers. Source: OwnHammer 412 MAR-CB
https://wiki.fractalaudio.com/wiki/index.php?title=Cabinet_models_list
 
Semih Yanyali said:
Cool, for lead tones i would suggest G12M instead of G12H and the 75hz version. Will help you with the low end.
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They have this too, plenty of things to try :) , thank you!

Based on a Marshall 1960TV 4x12 cabinet, 2003 Celestion 75-Hz cone 25-watt G12M speaker. Source: OwnHammer 412 MAR-TV
 
riku_iki said:
They have this too, plenty of things to try :) , thank you!

Based on a Marshall 1960TV 4x12 cabinet, 2003 Celestion 75-Hz cone 25-watt G12M speaker. Source: OwnHammer 412 MAR-TV
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Actually this one is pre-Rola:

Based on a 1970's Marshall 1960B "checkerboard" 4x12 cabinet with pre-Rola Celestion G12M-20 (75 Hz cone) speakers. Source: OwnHammer 412 MAR-CB
 
the story about original Angus's tone is that he used some pre-bluetooth wireless setup for his guitar, which compressed the sound.
Leon Todd tried to recreate that tone here:

And also there is preset on Axe Exchange with two chained compressors, but both sound awful when I am trying them myself, so this is the main reason why I blame my guitar.
 
I just created a Tone Matched preset for Back In Black today. It's for the rhythm guitars, but with some light tweaking, it should work for the leads. Check this thread.
 
Jason Scott said:
I just created a Tone Matched preset for Back In Black today. It's for the rhythm guitars, but with some light tweaking, it should work for the leads. Check this thread.
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Ok, I tried your preset, and my result still awful:



So, options are:
  • my guitar is very different or defective, and I need to try to tone match it, or get another guitar with proper humbucker
  • I have some settings misconfiguration in my Axe Fx III (I triple checked that power amp and cab modeling is On)
  • my Axe Fx unit is defective
 
riku_iki said:
Ok, I tried your preset, and my result still awful:



So, options are:
  • my guitar is very different or defective, and I need to try to tone match it, or get another guitar with proper humbucker
  • I have some settings misconfiguration in my Axe Fx III (I triple checked that power amp and cab modeling is On)
  • my Axe Fx unit is defective
Click to expand...


The preset was created with a Les Paul / HB's, so it's undoubtedly going to sound different using SC's. If you can upload a DI sample of you playing Back In Black, I'd be glad to try tone matching it.
 
The closer the type of guitar and pickup the better, but agree it's a good skill to know.
 
This song and tone is a prime example of the importance of the right hand. Every time those picks hit the strings, it’s deliberate and has an attitude. Your guitar is fine, you just need to tighten up the riff and spank those strings. Your left hand is the steering wheel, your right hand is the gas pedal. You can’t play AC/DC at 25mph, you’ve gotta get on the highway and open it up.
 
I don't really think your tone was that far off. Just practice it more... things take time. Angus is an odd duck, that lick is incredibly simple but he has a certain sass in his hands that is easy to miss. AC/DC is all about the genius in their simplicity.

I love hot pickups, I love hot tone... but it's something you don't tame, it's like a whip of fire that you learn to control. It can be incredibly discouraging when you play sloppily and miss what you want to do, but most of the dynamics I like to have is impossible to get without it. I guess it's a double edged sword. All the best, keep at it.
 
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