advanced looping/delay settings. Help needed.

Bodde

Bodde

Fractal Fanatic
advanced looping/delay settings. New Question

Here is what I want to do: I want to use the looper or a long delay and to be able to control the looped and the guitar signal separately.
Much like David Torn was doing in the early days (demonstrated on his Painting with Guitar video).
So there is one dry signal going to the looper/delay and that looped signal goes to some effects (for example) say reverb. You can fade this reverb in or out and also go back to the dry signal. And then there is a guitar signal which can be processed separately from the looped signal. I am just not sure how to accomplice that. I guess have to use a mixer and send/return etc. but I am not sure how to proceed.
Hope someone can help me.
 
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You mean something like this (substitute looper for delay if you wish). I'm not sure if I am completely following you. Or do you want the reverb looped as well?
Capture.jpg
 
I have tried your setting but I can still hear the reverb on my guitar signal after I have looped. I want the looped signal and the guitar signal (after I have looped) completely separate each with a seperate effects and controllable output/faders.

Here is how David Torn did it (see the techno-Glob section). He had a very complicated setup back then but that was many years ago. Hope something like that is possible with the Axe II.
http://www.loopers-delight.com/musings/David_Torn/Torn_Loop_Article.html
 
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Wasn't really meant for the setting but the routing (that routing will take out the reverb). It is absolutely possible in the Axefx I or II. I think I know what you are going for.
 
Capture2.jpg

Okay,
so this routing will do your loop dry, then route the dry signal, reverb, and delay on separate paths. Set the delay and reverb to 100% mix, you control the amount of reverb or delay with the in gain parameter. you control the amount of dry with the volume block.

Is that kind of what you are going for. I haven't had a chance to fully read that article.
 
Interesting setup! thanks for thinking along with me. I have tried it but I can still hear the reverb on my guitar signal after I have done the loop and play along with the loop. I only want the reverb on the looped signal and be able to control the amount of the reverb and the loop volume. So I can 'manipulate' the loop and also be able to go back to the dry loop when desired. And still be able to play on top of the loop with different effects.
 
Bodde said:
Interesting setup! thanks for thinking along with me. I have tried it but I can still hear the reverb on my guitar signal after I have done the loop and play along with the loop. I only want the reverb on the looped signal and be able to control the amount of the reverb and the loop volume. So I can 'manipulate' the loop and also be able to go back to the dry loop when desired. And still be able to play on top of the loop with different effects.
Click to expand...

If you turn the ingain to 0 with that routing you will hear 0 reverb. Amount of reverb is controlled by ingain. dry loop volume is controlled by the volume block

If you want to run a non looped signal with different effects, branch off after the cab to row 4 .
 
You could also run the loop out to a mixer block, control the dry, wet levels from there instead of in gain (it would be easier to adjust all the relative levels that way).
 
Not exactly sure what you mean yet. But I will try it our tomorrow.
I want to find a good and easy setup for live looping. Maybe putting some parameters on expressions pedals or doing manual manipulations on the fly.
 
I guess you're describing something like this. The filters can act as an A/B path select for your realtime playing. (Many blocks can take the role of the filters for this type of switching.)

Set an IA switch to the CC# of an EXT CTRL. Assign the EXT CTRL as bypass modifier for both filters with the start & end values of one modifier swapped. Use mute bypass mode for both filters. The switch will cause only one filter at a time to engage & let signal pass.
 

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Bakerman said:
I guess you're describing something like this. The filters can act as an A/B path select for your realtime playing. (Many blocks can take the role of the filters for this type of switching.)

Set an IA switch to the CC# of an EXT CTRL. Assign the EXT CTRL as bypass modifier for both filters with the start & end values of one modifier swapped. Use mute bypass mode for both filters. The switch will cause only one filter at a time to engage & let signal pass.
Click to expand...

The article describes just mixing the effect in on the looper as needed. Any of the above methods would work. Filters/volume blocks as switches or levels controls, in gain on time based effects, mixer block after the effects. A lot of different ways to accomplish this.

I guess the question is how do want to control the loop dry and effects mix, and the seperate non looped signal?
 
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It sounds like he wants reverb only on the looper playback (and the sound while recording the loop I assume), other effects on the realtime guitar playing.
 
Bakerman said:
I guess you're describing something like this. The filters can act as an A/B path select for your realtime playing. (Many blocks can take the role of the filters for this type of switching.)

Set an IA switch to the CC# of an EXT CTRL. Assign the EXT CTRL as bypass modifier for both filters with the start & end values of one modifier swapped. Use mute bypass mode for both filters. The switch will cause only one filter at a time to engage & let signal pass.
Click to expand...

Thanks! This works and is what I was looking for. Now I have separate control over the looped and the non-loop signal. Never thought of using the filters for this!
This way I can have some nice sonic David Torn like looping/delay experiments. I am very happy that this is possible with the Axe.
 
Bakerman said:
I guess you're describing something like this. The filters can act as an A/B path select for your realtime playing. (Many blocks can take the role of the filters for this type of switching.)

Set an IA switch to the CC# of an EXT CTRL. Assign the EXT CTRL as bypass modifier for both filters with the start & end values of one modifier swapped. Use mute bypass mode for both filters. The switch will cause only one filter at a time to engage & let signal pass.
Click to expand...

Hi, here a new puzzle for you. Hope you can help me with this one too.
I have been experimenting with Bakerman's filter setup (as described above) and that inspired me to try a Robert Fripp setup. He is using 4 separate delays which can be controlled independently. The input for the delays can be controlled and also the output.
Here is what I have done so far: I have set 4 filters in the beginning of the chain. I have set two IA switches the way Bakerman has described above. One IA for chain 1 and 2 and IA for chain 3 and 4. Each chain has a different delay (delay 1, delay 2, multidelay and megatap). Then at the end of the chain I have set a mixer that controls all 4 outputs separately.

The problem is that with the filter setting like this I input two chains at once. I can solve this problem by setting up 3 of 4 IA switches to control the filters. But this way I have to use too much IA switches on the MCF. And I need them for other stuff. Is there another solution to create this setup without needing more than two IA's to control the input?

Afbeelding4.png
 
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It doesn't appear you need filters in the above example. Though it will work just fine. But if you need more resources, dropping the filters will save cpu. You can just bypass the effect and choose mute in or mute fx in for the bypass mode. Then you attach the IA to the bypass parameters of the effect. You do what Bakerman described with the start/end values swapped.

On the controlling the inputs to the delay. So you want to have all combinations with 2 switches?
 
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Do you want input to only one delay at a time? You could do that with 2 switches. Delete 2 filters so one oppositely-switched pair remains. Connect one filter to delays 1 & 2, the other to delays 3 & 4. Assign a second switch as a bypass modifier for all 4 delays, slopes set for 1 & 3 on while 2 & 4 are off and vice versa. Set delays to Mute FX in (or possibly Mute In, depending on what you're doing with any dry signal) bypass mode.

Now the combined state of the 2 EXT CTRLs (off/off, off/on, on/off, on/on) will determine which delay gets input. Any more options would require more IA switches unless you had a controller that could step through more than 2 IA states.
 
Bakerman said:
Do you want input to only one delay at a time? You could do that with 2 switches. Delete 2 filters so one oppositely-switched pair remains. Connect one filter to delays 1 & 2, the other to delays 3 & 4. Assign a second switch as a bypass modifier for all 4 delays, slopes set for 1 & 3 on while 2 & 4 are off and vice versa. Set delays to Mute FX in (or possibly Mute In, depending on what you're doing with any dry signal) bypass mode.

Now the combined state of the 2 EXT CTRLs (off/off, off/on, on/off, on/on) will determine which delay gets input. Any more options would require more IA switches unless you had a controller that could step through more than 2 IA states.
Click to expand...

Right, that was about the only thing I could come up with as well.
 
Thanks you both! seems like not many people here are interested in looping and long delays for the Axe fx. So I am really happy you both are helping me.
Yes, I want to input only one delay at the time. I have tried your setup Bakerman and it works. I have set up two IA switches. One for the filters and one to mute the 4 delays. So now I have control over the input of the 4 delays and the 4 outputs through the mixer. Robert Fripp eat your heart out!!

This is how I have it right now. Have to work on the other fx. Now I have to go to sleep. The Axe is keeping me off my sleep for a few nights now.

Afbeelding5.png
 
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Bodde said:
Interesting setup! thanks for thinking along with me. I have tried it but I can still hear the reverb on my guitar signal after I have done the loop and play along with the loop.
Click to expand...

make sure that the delay looper is set to 100% wet, so that no dry signal passes through into the reverb
 
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