Acoustic room treatment?

simeon

Axe-Master
i'm moving my studio into another room in the house. it's pretty small, so i thought i'd make some acoustic panels to go behind the speakers, at the early reflection points to the sides and on the back wall.

i'll make some frames and put some rockwool in them, but i have a choice. i can either use 50mm stone wool covered with thin material, or use 30mm glass mineral wool, which is very dense, with a layer of acoustic foam on top.

the second option would probably be better, as the rockwool will absorb the lower frequencies and the foam will absorb the higher frequencies and reduce reflections. the second option works out more expensive, (if the the foam is 20mm thick), so i'm wondering if i'm overthinking this a bit.

i can get 16 foam tiles (300x300x50mm) from thomann for less money and it'll be way less hassle....(but i suspect they're a bit crap). anybody got any advice for me? i'm fed up of watching youtube vids about this, to be honest...
 
ps - the room is almost square. it will be carpeted and it has coving, but the walls will just be painted (no wallpaper). just about the worst scenario (almost)
 
For points of first reflection, I think you're right with the broader frequency solution. I don't think you'll absorb too much low energy there, so you may need bass traps in the corners later.
 
yes, i was considering bass traps as well. bit more fiddly to make - you can stack triangles of rockwool to go in the corners, but you have to make a frame to support them, i think. i might just buy a couple later on.
 
I have a mix room where I work that is small, all parallel walls, low ceiling. We all thought that no matter what it was going to sound like crap. Turned out awesome.
Combination of bass traps, acoustic panels using BAD panels loaded with 1” melamine foam and diffusing board behind the mix position.
Bass traps made with 2x4 frames filled with denim and covered with loaded vinyl covering the entire back wall behind the speakers.
Good luck.
 
A dead room is always better than one with bad reflections.

I have 6" Rockwool on three walls floor to ceiling, two traps on the hard wall and 1" foam on the ceiling with a few area rugs on the tile floor.

Update to add a few photos:

EFC4B6CB-B647-4E99-A32E-E62FE7C9CAB8_zpsuvysahou.jpg


6853E7B5-A888-4DD1-855C-AA0E680DC04F_zpsn0qbzqge.jpg


57F37395-E9DC-4F4D-8946-56F90FEB4C63_zpsmeynnait.jpg


512D4A06-DF27-4B78-9BBB-33D94D9561A8_zpswr3tg3h9.jpg


07A10A02-6755-4485-A153-EA208922F866_zps6sgxrrvg.jpg


3C63D7C3-18F7-4A0B-8CBD-DB6DD360A9A9_zpsbvkijaci.jpg


F04DDD8C-BCDF-4EAB-8B73-3A293814664C_zpshthcvk6w.jpg
 
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Always better to first set up the room and see what it needs, opposed to treating a room, then setting up your studio and hoping it sounds good.

One had rooms that needed surprisingly little treatment, and I’ve had rooms I selected thinking would be ideal that sounded so bad it wouldn’t be worth the effort to try to treat them.

Really hard to predict until you hear it
 
i'm moving my studio into another room in the house. it's pretty small, so i thought i'd make some acoustic panels to go behind the speakers, at the early reflection points to the sides and on the back wall.

i'll make some frames and put some rockwool in them, but i have a choice. i can either use 50mm stone wool covered with thin material, or use 30mm glass mineral wool, which is very dense, with a layer of acoustic foam on top.

the second option would probably be better, as the rockwool will absorb the lower frequencies and the foam will absorb the higher frequencies and reduce reflections. the second option works out more expensive, (if the the foam is 20mm thick), so i'm wondering if i'm overthinking this a bit.

i can get 16 foam tiles (300x300x50mm) from thomann for less money and it'll be way less hassle....(but i suspect they're a bit crap). anybody got any advice for me? i'm fed up of watching youtube vids about this, to be honest...
Looking at absorption coefficients, rockwool absorbs high frequencies quite well. I'm not sure why you'd want to layer it with foam.

And as for acoustic panels behind the speakers, probably not necessary as a 50mm one won't do much at all. Speakers don't shoot high frequency out the back.

I find the guides on Arqen as simple and straightforward as it gets.
yes, i was considering bass traps as well. bit more fiddly to make - you can stack triangles of rockwool to go in the corners, but you have to make a frame to support them, i think. i might just buy a couple later on.
You don't necessarily have to make triangles, you can use rectangular frames if that's easier to build and straddle them in the corner.
 
Those foam tiles on their own are really not much use, IMHO. They look good stuck on the wall, but apart from maybe absorbing a bit of top end... One of the challenges with this stuff is to get absorption where you need it to even out the response and minimise reflection evenly, ie it's very easy to put a whole lot of (insert whatever here, foamy stuff, fluffy stuff etc) and end up just creating a kind of dead space over certain frequencies, usually the higher end of the spectrum, and doing minimal stuff to the rest. Kind of like just turning the treble tone control down on a hi fi..but yeah, rockwool panels are basically the way to go. Bass traps in the corners. A small room's always going to be limited for what's achievable, but you can make it work just fine, (dependant on expectation). You could measure the room with that Room Eq Wizard, see what's going on to begin with, but that can also lead to a whole other level of obsessive frequency chasing.. Running pink noise and just walking around and listening is very revealing, especially sticking your head in the corners, the bass really does build up there! Anyway, there's a ton of info at the John Sayers forum on this stuff, much of it actually knowledgeable, a great resource.
All acoustic treatment ends up with a compromise of some sort.
 
HI Simeon,

Look up Helmholtz Resonators - In effect, a box that will absorb pesky frequencies - Can be quite broadband and very effective.

Thanks
Pauly

i'm moving my studio into another room in the house. it's pretty small, so i thought i'd make some acoustic panels to go behind the speakers, at the early reflection points to the sides and on the back wall.

i'll make some frames and put some rockwool in them, but i have a choice. i can either use 50mm stone wool covered with thin material, or use 30mm glass mineral wool, which is very dense, with a layer of acoustic foam on top.

the second option would probably be better, as the rockwool will absorb the lower frequencies and the foam will absorb the higher frequencies and reduce reflections. the second option works out more expensive, (if the the foam is 20mm thick), so i'm wondering if i'm overthinking this a bit.

i can get 16 foam tiles (300x300x50mm) from thomann for less money and it'll be way less hassle....(but i suspect they're a bit crap). anybody got any advice for me? i'm fed up of watching youtube vids about this, to be honest...
 
thanks for the advice, chaps. i'll set everything up first and see how it is. i'm thinking of going with 2" rockwool in frames at the early reflection points and then adding some bass traps in the corners, if necessary (i'll have some rockwool left over from the panels anyway)

i've seen those helmholtz resonators and they're great, but they tend to be quite deep and space is really going to be at a premium!
 
GIK Acoustics will do a room assessment and make recommendations for free. I used their service when I moved my studio. They provided good advice and had no strings attached... Even though I did buy a couple of their panels anyways.
 
Make measurements with Room EQ Wizard. A measurement mic can be picked up for cheap.

Start with the empty room - then when you add your absorbers and traps.

No room will end up perfect - but you will have the data on what's going on - where the dips and spikes are. So you don't try to "correct" those when mixing music.

Room EQ Wizard: REW Room Measurement Tutorial
 
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A dead room is always better than one with bad reflections.

I have 6" Rockwool on three walls floor to ceiling, two traps on the hard wall and 1" foam on the ceiling with a few area rugs on the tile floor.

Update to add a few photos:

EFC4B6CB-B647-4E99-A32E-E62FE7C9CAB8_zpsuvysahou.jpg


6853E7B5-A888-4DD1-855C-AA0E680DC04F_zpsn0qbzqge.jpg


57F37395-E9DC-4F4D-8946-56F90FEB4C63_zpsmeynnait.jpg




07A10A02-6755-4485-A153-EA208922F866_zps6sgxrrvg.jpg




F04DDD8C-BCDF-4EAB-8B73-3A293814664C_zpshthcvk6w.jpg

That's a badass room!!!! the corkwood on top of the rock wool seems clever. Like you, I also have a portable ac unit, but I see you've also got a window unit too. It looks like you're a real fan of a specific guitar company... is that Hamer?

I was blown away and overwhelmed with the expensive treatment options. The DYI route of creating a frame and using rock wool and fabric sounded like the best bang for my buck but then I found this website: https://www.thefoamfactory.com

I could easily afford to fill the walls with absorption and diffusors but I threw in the bass traps, added two all treatments and have no complaints. I have a little nook in the room that does create some unwanted frequencies from the speaker close to it but it's not bad enough that it bothers me.

The rock wool insulation I used behind the sheet rock really insulates the room and keeps the sounds from escaping. Since I've sheet rocked over the insulation it does not do anything to treat the room. It was an $800 upgrade that was well worth it. The attached pics are from the day after I received the bass traps and two wall treatments. I hung them with some push pins. Room's a mess but you get the idea. I need a wall of guitars to act as a diffusor.
 
A dead room is always better than one with bad reflections.

I have 6" Rockwool on three walls floor to ceiling, two traps on the hard wall and 1" foam on the ceiling with a few area rugs on the tile floor.

Update to add a few photos:

EFC4B6CB-B647-4E99-A32E-E62FE7C9CAB8_zpsuvysahou.jpg


6853E7B5-A888-4DD1-855C-AA0E680DC04F_zpsn0qbzqge.jpg


57F37395-E9DC-4F4D-8946-56F90FEB4C63_zpsmeynnait.jpg


512D4A06-DF27-4B78-9BBB-33D94D9561A8_zpswr3tg3h9.jpg


07A10A02-6755-4485-A153-EA208922F866_zps6sgxrrvg.jpg


3C63D7C3-18F7-4A0B-8CBD-DB6DD360A9A9_zpsbvkijaci.jpg


F04DDD8C-BCDF-4EAB-8B73-3A293814664C_zpshthcvk6w.jpg
If I had a room that size to convert to a music room my mother in law would want to move in instead ....... I'll stick with my current pokey little room.;)
 
View attachment 55412 View attachment 55413

That's a badass room!!!! the corkwood on top of the rock wool seems clever. Like you, I also have a portable ac unit, but I see you've also got a window unit too. It looks like you're a real fan of a specific guitar company... is that Hamer?

I was blown away and overwhelmed with the expensive treatment options. The DYI route of creating a frame and using rock wool and fabric sounded like the best bang for my buck but then I found this website: https://www.thefoamfactory.com

I could easily afford to fill the walls with absorption and diffusors but I threw in the bass traps, added two all treatments and have no complaints. I have a little nook in the room that does create some unwanted frequencies from the speaker close to it but it's not bad enough that it bothers me.

The rock wool insulation I used behind the sheet rock really insulates the room and keeps the sounds from escaping. Since I've sheet rocked over the insulation it does not do anything to treat the room. It was an $800 upgrade that was well worth it. The attached pics are from the day after I received the bass traps and two wall treatments. I hung them with some push pins. Room's a mess but you get the idea. I need a wall of guitars to act as a diffusor.

It's not cordwood, it is fabric. The first layer of fabric is a woven hardscape material stretched taught. The colored fabric is just for aesthetics.
 
I have a mix room where I work that is small, all parallel walls, low ceiling. We all thought that no matter what it was going to sound like crap. Turned out awesome.
Combination of bass traps, acoustic panels using BAD panels loaded with 1” melamine foam and diffusing board behind the mix position.
Bass traps made with 2x4 frames filled with denim and covered with loaded vinyl covering the entire back wall behind the speakers.
Good luck.

Can you share some pics?
 
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