Ac30tb model vs real ac30tb

edo

edo

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I've been using real ac30's for years, mostly with les pauls and strats. I'm trying to emulate a real ac30tb here, but I'm having a hard time. If i set the level at break up on my real amp, the 2 guitars (strat being much quiter and brighter than the lp) have a nice balance of gain / volume / compression. On the axe I can't seem to figure out how to obtain this same balance, in the sense that if I set a good tone for the strat, the lp sounds way dirty and muddy, while if I set a good lp core tone, the strat sounds terribly harsh and thin. Also, with the lp, the amp model seems to distort mostly around 300hz, and if I turn that down with the amp built in param eq, the strat gets even thinner. What I'd like to do is use my strat tone and have the lp just compress more without adding ridiculous amounts of gain and low end: what should I mess with? I suppose the character would have something to do with it.. Also, is there a way to set the frequency where crunch occurs?
Any suggestions highly appreciated
 
Off the top of my head I'm wondering if a multi-band compressor could get you more evenness between the two guitars by just focusing on the areas of biggest grief for you, i.e. 300hz.
 
Two things:

• Have you ever heard what your guitars sound like with the same settings on the real amp mic'd up and recorded?

•*Why not just setup two patches, one for strat and one for LP to get best of both worlds?
 
Two patches is sensible. But I find I just keep my LP's gain turned down in the traditional manner, and the one patch works similarly to a real amp. (I have a very old AC30).
 
The traditional way would be the volume knob I guess, right? But that makes a little darker..
Btw, yes, I do record and perform regularly with my real Vox miked up and that's where I found out that at break up the 3 guitars have similar gain with different compression.
Also, on my ac30, I normally use the top boost channel with bass at 1 I clock and treble at 11 and cut at 2 I clock. On the axe model it's almost the other way around (bass at 12, treble at 3 o clock, cut at 9 I clock). Are the knobs upside down or what?
 
I don't have an lp but use a strat with both a newly built ac30tb and with the AxeFx. The AxeFx can easily match thee real amp in every department. If you are not using fw12.04b then you are making life too difficult.
I have 45 presets using ac15, ac20 and ac30tb and using full throttle on my strat, I get everything from a clean to compression to breaking up by using drive and compression controls. The amp modelling is always "vintage" with my local 50hz power.
We have AB'd it against "real" recently manufactured vox's (Chinese) and against recordings made in the early 60's and I can assure you that it's possible and probably even better than the real amp.

The cab and mike used in your reset are important.

Lastly, turn it up! Vox are loud and your perceptions are different depending on how loud you hear the sound. MV on 10 for Vox.
 
Axe fx enhances differences of guitars or even on the same guitar different pick up selection way more than a real amp.
I like this feature but i think this is the problem in your case...i cant think of a solution
with out different patch settings for your guitars....
 
Gamedojo said:
Two things:
• Have you ever heard what your guitars sound like with the same settings on the real amp mic'd up and recorded?
Click to expand...

This seems to have been skipped over, I think the point is.. mic'd cabs, recorded and played back, sound different than an amp/ cab sitting the room with you. Always. You can't directly compare your real AC30tb to your Axe AC30tb, assuming you happen to be using your Axe AC30tb model with a cab IR and listening through a FRFR speaker.

If that's actually what you are doing.. you didn't really say how you are monitoring the Axe. Did you?

Try running the Axe AC30tb model with NO cab modelling into a clean SS power amp and then into the speaker terminals of your real AC30tb speaker. Then you can see how close the Axe model is to the real thing. Especially if you match the LF resonance in the amp block.
 
I did reply, saying that I regularly record and gig with my amp mic'd, so I have a starting reference point I'm after.
I also agree with the post saying that the axe is much more sensitive to pickups than real amp (in fact I had to make height adjustments on the strat pickups) but like I said, I'm happy with per guitar presets, I'm just trying to figure out if I can find a compromise (like real amp) to use both guitars on same preset that I can set and forget.
On a side note, I also tried placing a null filter with a 6db boost in front of the lp preset for the strat, and - this is weird - the strat still sounds lower in volume but dirtier in drive... I guess in a real amp if the louder guitar sounds crunchy only when I dig in, the quiter guitar would have to sound cleaner till the level is matched
 
The AC30 circuit has changed throughout the years. The model in the Axe-Fx is very faithful to the amp from which it was modeled. That may be quite different than your amp. To match your amp you may need to increase or decrease Input Trim and/or Master Volume (or MV Trim).

My recommendation is to stop agonizing over matching your amp and play around with the various models until you find one that suits you best. You're likely to find it's superior to your amp.
 
NgMy sugestion: you sound amazing. Your edge tones are sometimes even better than the real thing so keep your rig. I have the Axtonetimg for the last two years and I'm starting to get tired of tweaking dozens of patches and waiting for the "definitive" upgrade.
 
FractalAudio said:
The AC30 circuit has changed throughout the years. The model in the Axe-Fx is very faithful to the amp from which it was modeled. That may be quite different than your amp. To match your amp you may need to increase or decrease Input Trim and/or Master Volume (or MV Trim).

My recommendation is to stop agonizing over matching your amp and play around with the various models until you find one that suits you best. You're likely to find it's superior to your amp.
Click to expand...

I know the axe is wicked and can do lots of things my vox's cant (especially get break up sweetness at indoor venue level), but after gigging and recording for about 16 years with 2 ac30's and an ac15, since the axe is such a kick ass unit, i'm just trying to get "my tone" - the one i'm used to - out of it!! Can you please explain the character function? The manual sayd it's some sort of tone shaper, but the way i see it, if i turn it down at a low - mid freq it's like it compresses the clean part of the tone and yields more xformer crunch.. if i turn it up, it adds some distortion.. Is that the control to mess with to change the distortion spectrum?
btw, just installing fw13, maybe this will shed some magic!! :D
 
fisioaura said:
NgMy sugestion: you sound amazing. Your edge tones are sometimes even better than the real thing so keep your rig. I have the Axtonetimg for the last two years and I'm starting to get tired of tweaking dozens of patches and waiting for the "definitive" upgrade.
Click to expand...

Thanks! But i'm not after my U2 tones - I'm still using my amp for that, for now - I'm trying to emulate my tone, the one from my original band, so this is not about our typical edge related obsession! ;)
 
Semih Yanyali said:
Axe fx enhances differences of guitars or even on the same guitar different pick up selection way more than a real amp.
I like this feature but i think this is the problem in your case...i cant think of a solution
with out different patch settings for your guitars....
Click to expand...

Have to agree with/second this. I would suggest not trying to compare the Axe to your AC30/15's and just try to approach it more from scratch and use your ears more than your eyes. If you're in a recording environment and have the option to capture some IR's of your actual amps, that might really help you get there. On the amp settings in the Axe, it can be frustrating at times but that's part of the game with this piece of gear. More flexible but more complicated… I love playing old Vox amps in a room- they can be magical amps. Good luck..
 
edo said:
The traditional way would be the volume knob I guess, right? But that makes a little darker..
Btw, yes, I do record and perform regularly with my real Vox miked up and that's where I found out that at break up the 3 guitars have similar gain with different compression.
Also, on my ac30, I normally use the top boost channel with bass at 1 I clock and treble at 11 and cut at 2 I clock. On the axe model it's almost the other way around (bass at 12, treble at 3 o clock, cut at 9 I clock). Are the knobs upside down or what?
Click to expand...

Actually on an old AC30 the tone knobs are the 'wrong' way round.....

ANd yes, I do mean turning the input vol up and down. It increases the mids and overdrives the preamp, depending your amp settings. I find that the Axe does this extremely well, so i very much use the vol knob. I was once told in all seriousness by a (very good) luthier always to keep my guitars' input vol on ten - somehting about maximising the quality of the pickups' output.... He'd just done a superb re-fret of my very old Strat, so I didn't like to spoil the moment....
 
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