A Moment of Revelation

BigD1977

BigD1977

Power User
So last night I was rehearsing with a band until roughly 2am for an upcoming gig tomorrow night. It was the first time I have had my two powered CLRs running in stereo and was using my Epi Les Paul Custom.

Cycling through the presets yielded incredibly satisfying results. While not perfect tones, I could emulate everything from CCR to Zepplin, to RHCP, The Killers, all the tones that I needed for the covers gig I'm about to play. Of note here is that the guitar is a 2003 model with stock pickups and has had the wiring and caps replaced by Clive at UnsungHeroGuitars. So everything went well, and I decided to try a few other guitars through the rig to see what the tones were like.

Now, I didn't expect the tones to be identical, obviously, but I didn't expect the way my 2009 Parker Fly Deluxe sounded cheap and tinny through the rig. A couple of other guitars which are one off builds sounded ok, but didn't have the oomph of the Les Paul. One in particular is a very solid one-off PRS style with a Kent Armstrong K14 (I think) in the bridge and a SD Jazz in the neck. Through the rig it sounded dull and lifeless compared to the Epi, and the howl from the Armstrong pickup (using mid gain lead settings) was a little unpalatable. Another noteable loser in this classic tonal battle were a 1997 Jackson Soloist Pro with BK and DiMarzio pickups (not ideal at all for classic tones, granted).

I didn't have the time to do up presets that would suit the other guitars, but I have a sneaking feeling that it would take a little more work with the other guitars to build good tones than it would with the Epi.

Moral of the story is (for me) that cheap guitars are worth their weight in gold for those classic tones and can outpunch the heaviest of hitters.
 
You got a point. Even cheap guitars sound great with the Axe Fx and CLRs but You should build presets for each guitar , and than you'll find out the difference that a good guitar makes in your sustain , tone and amp feel....
 
Been there and done that with the Parker. For me it's a question of economies of scale. There are certain things that I value in all guitars. With the Jackson for instance, it's a shredding monster. The Parker is more of an all rounder. However, the question as to whether the price fits the use of the guitar is a personal one.

I have found that with no time to build, the Epi is my go to. This is surprising given that it cost me a fifth of what the Parker set me back.

Another factor could be that the presets may be built with classic guitars in mind.
 
I've found swapping pickups has a night and day effect. I went from 5-6 bare knuckle attempts to a Railhammer Anvil and it was a huge improvement for the sound I am going for. And more to the point the pickup height can change that pup from a fat thick sound to an ultratight defined one. There's a huge opportunity in tone that I think most people don't take advantage of. A lot of people scream "the modelling needs to improve." I think 50% of that could be solved with a few turns of a screw on a pickup's height or its pole pieces.
 
I have the same pickups in all my guitars and adjust the height to the guitar. For example, even though I have 3 identical LTD M1000's they all have their own character, and resonate completely different. On one I have the bridge as low as it can go, while on another it's mid way, and on the 3rd in between.

I actually did a short recording several times adjusting the pickup each time and then compared them all and picking the best one.

Not to rain on your parade either but so many guys keep saying why buy a gibson or esp when you can get an epiphone or Ltd for a 5th of the price and it plays and sounds just as good.... well I put 5 guys saying this at open jam last night to shame with my Gibson Les Paul and ESP E-II M-II, and I played through their rigs to eliminate the Axe FX out of it. Not trying to change the topic, just sharing my experience.
 
I find that I just like different models with different guitars. My two main guitars when playing with my band is a Les Paul Standard and a Suhr strat. With my Les Paul I can play all night using the 1987x Plexi model and be a happy camper and with my Suhr strat I can play with the Bogner XTC Blue all night. What I’ve ended up doing is using preset 1-5 for my Suhr and 6-10 for my Les Paul for generic presets and preset 11-15 for specific songs where I want something different than the generic presets.

Could it be that you simply dialled in the presets with your Epi Les Paul and when you played with your Parker Fly you didn’t like it as much? In that case maybe the opposite could have been true as well?
 
BigD1977 said:
Moral of the story is (for me) that cheap guitars are worth their weight in gold for those classic tones and can outpunch the heaviest of hitters.
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I have a Hello Kitty Strat that I bought to use as a pickup/parts testbed. I grabbed it because it was one of the cheapest guitars in the store, but it is super loud acoustically and has great sustain. The fretwork is kind of shite, but the guitar plays okay and intonates great.

I gave it a rattle can paint job and it's a great live guitar because of how absurd seeing a 6' 225Lb dude playing a blinged out Hello Kitty guitar can look. Especially when it's tuned to C standard and cranking out Dungeons and Dragons based metal.

I think the real moral here is some guitars have mojo, regardless of price.
 
BigD1977 said:
Now, I didn't expect the tones to be identical, obviously, but I didn't expect the way my 2009 Parker Fly Deluxe sounded cheap and tinny through the rig.
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I think you could also do the reverse depending on the presets. I have presets that sound great for a specific guitar but horrible for others. Les Pauls in particular seem to require a different approach compared to Strat/Tele/Parker (S or H pickups) guitars. With that said (this might unleash the fury) the Parkers (aside from the Nitefly SSH/SSS and newer more configurable DF models) are not the best tonal guitars. I'll be the first to swear by the playability and ergonomics but there's only one setting on the older flys that wins... sometimes... and that's the bridge pickup with the volume backed off a little. It can be good for a cleaner distorted sound in a mix. It's tough convincing artists of this and often requires recording 4 or 5 different guitars as alternates so that the difference is very apparent.
 
You're preaching to the choir here Dave...
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Glad to hear that your Custom is fulfilling your needs - and I suspect many would be surprised to know that it's the stock pickups that are doing the business! I've read many tales of people buying an Epi and before even before it turns up, they have a preconception that the first thing they'll have to do is swap the pickups for 'better' ones and people usually chime in with the usual BKP, Seymour shouts... all without actually hearing the stock ones
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I'm not suggesting of course that other pickups aren't different in output and character, but it's a very subjective thing with no right or wrong... it's all about what works for you and by the sounds of it Dave, you're doing just fine!
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Continue to enjoy!

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my highway one tele is all stock and is one of the best sounding and playing guitars i've ever touched. there's no rule, each guitar is different.
 
I don't blow smoke up people's asses. My only critique of this Epi and most guitars in general is the gloss neck. Who in the holy fuck of zeus's butthole thought that glossing a neck was a good idea? They should be repeatedly punched in the nuts until they have a va-jayjay.
 
Fabio KTG said:
I don't blow smoke up people's asses. My only critique of this Epi and most guitars in general is the gloss neck. Who in the holy fuck of zeus's butthole thought that glossing a neck was a good idea? They should be repeatedly punched in the nuts until they have a va-jayjay.
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I hear that. The tung oiled neck on my latest Charvel has me wanting to replace all my guitars with ones that have oiled necks. It's not like holding laboratory instruments, it's more like spending some alone time with your special friend.
 
dpavel said:
Thats why you have to tweek your presets for each guitar...:)
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Yup! My point here was that I didn't tweak, at ALL and the stock presets sounded better with the Les Paul than any other guitar.

Edit: Am I going to do any exhaustive testing? Nope. I'm too busy playing, teaching and gigging at the moment and tbh, I probably won't in the future either. This was merely a personal observation.
 
In the last year I've bought a used Epi custom shop '62 SG, a brand new Wildkat, and a brand new Advanced Jumbo acoustic. They are all STELLAR guitars. The AJ, in particular, is an absolutely absurd STEAL at under $250.00!

I think Epi is one of the best out there, and shaming Gibson's ratty QC and gouged prices. Severed compared his Gibson to others and 'put them to shame' - well, either he's got a new one, and he's lucky, or he has an old one, 'cause most of the new ones I've played are crap, and to quote another post, they have NO 'mojo'.

I have friends who swear by the Parkers, and I wanted to like them, but I despise them. Most PRS's leave me cold too, but give me some ratty old Japanese clone, or a Hagstrom II, an Airline, or some other pawn shop special, and I'll probably find a use for it - not as a main axe, but for seasoning on special songs or cuts.

And interestingly, the guitar that seems to sound the very best through my Axe II rig, on all patches - mine or presets, is my St. Blues 61 South semi-hollow, with a Jason Lollar Tele-style pup in bridge and a Lollar P-90 in neck. That thing KILLS on my rig for some unknown reason.

The bottom line is, whatever works for you.

As to how guitars sound through the Axe, there is a big range here for sure, and I have never taken the time to optimize each patch for each intended axe - for two reasons: 1) I switch guitars constantly - grabbing whatever suits my mood at the moment, so it'd mean saving each patch for each of my guitars. That's a LOT of patches. The other reason is that I keep hoping that FAS will take my advice and add a 'guitar page' to the Axe, so you can set up EQ, Noise Gate, Compression, and Input Level for EACH instrument you use (in my case, that would include my voice and a viola as well), and name it on a page. So, I'd end up with a page with 'Main Strat', 'Blue Strat', 'Mic', 'Viola', 'SG', 'Radiator', 'Blacky', 'St. Blues' etc. on it. Then I'd plug in, select that instrument from the page (I'd have it attached to the I/O section), and have a completely optimized setup for that guitar, for EACH guitar, EVERY TIME, EVERY PATCH! This is such a no brainer to me that I am still amazed FAS hasn't done it - it'd solve a lot of problems for all of us!
 
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