a Christmas gift the community: Perfected Tuning offsets

Same here. I am changing the color of one of my basses, I ve never done that. Before doing it I have read many things, and in the end I am doing it my way considering what I have read on, my wallet, and my hurry. even without gloves sometimes 🤣. So don’t get me nervous or I will touch you with these hands 🤣 . No that’s ok, that’s water dye.

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I discovered some time ago; open string tuning is not calibrated the same as harmonic 12th fret tuning on the Fractal Axe3. You will see a drastic difference in the Fx3 linear or strobe tuner when comparing open vs 12th fret harmonic. Also, when comparing my preferred, software tuner, "AiryWare" to FX3 tuning, neither open string or 12th fret harmonics matched my preferred AiryWare. For reference I use a modified James Taylor offset tuning on the AiryWare. The offsets are -12 -10 -8 -15 -6 -3 EADGBE.
THIS SET WORKS PERFECT IN EVERY KEY WITH MY BAND. On the Fx3 This James Taylor mod offset (MUST USE OPEN STRING ONLY) is calibrated as -13.95 --10.3 -9.65 -13.85 -5.4 -2.85 EADGBE. NEVER USE HARMONIC TUNING ON THE FX3. Harmonic tuning is A=880, where FX3 is A=440 more suitable for "open string".

Skeptical? Try the above offsets on your Fx3 and experience a perfected tuning experience. Please, comment back here to let us know your experience. This discovery changed my world. Merry Christmas
Just to make sure. All the values are negative, right?
 
So. I set these Tuning offsets last week and before I got to retune I had to rush off and forgot about it. this week I have been noticing my guitar sounded out of tune and I could not figure out why. I remembered the offsets and put it back to the Petersen set I had and, for me my guitar sounded better in tune over the the fret board. Im not even sure the Petersen offsets are better than straight tuning now.
I am the first one to say that this may not apply to everyone and, like I said before, every Guitar is different IMO. As a guitar builder I know that fret positioning does vary, even on machine built fretboards (take your Micrometer and measure)
This tuning unfortunately did not work for me.
Anyone got better results than me?
 
Not a fan of "sweetened tunings." For me they make things sound out of tune, especially on voicings with open strings anywhere but 1st position e.g. X 10 12 0 12 X. When I set up a guitar with low action and proper intonation it plays in tune across the fretboard with any voicing.
 
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Don't mean to be a pain, but I'm confused. You're not saying the in the Axe tuner, the open string notes aren't exactly half the frequency of the same notes an octave up, are you? Given the insane attention to detail in other respects, that seems so unlikely.
Follow my instructions and change your offsets -13.95 --10.3 -9.65 -13.85 -5.4 -2.85 EADGBE on the FX3, and tune with open string. Then comment. Many are over thinking, and perhaps missing out on a great discovery.
 
So. I set these Tuning offsets last week and before I got to retune I had to rush off and forgot about it. this week I have been noticing my guitar sounded out of tune and I could not figure out why. I remembered the offsets and put it back to the Petersen set I had and, for me my guitar sounded better in tune over the the fret board. Im not even sure the Petersen offsets are better than straight tuning now.
I am the first one to say that this may not apply to everyone and, like I said before, every Guitar is different IMO. As a guitar builder I know that fret positioning does vary, even on machine built fretboards (take your Micrometer and measure)
This tuning unfortunately did not work for me.
Anyone got better results than me?
Thanks for trying. Did you tune with open strings. This offset is for open string when tried on the FX3
 
Thanks for trying. Did you tune with open strings. This offset is for open string when tried on the FX3
Hey Truesource, yes I did. Open strings. The interesting thing I note in your original posts is the difference between AXFX and airyware tuning accuracy. Have you had any update on this and why this is the case?
back to the sweeteners. Have you tried these offsets with different guitars with the same results? I just wonder if it is guitar specific. If you think about fret spacing let’s say at 20mm, then each cent is 0.2mm so the potential for being out is pretty huge between guitars. Then take into account the action, string height and the stretch when pushing / stretching the string To get to the fret. high action, low action all have to have an effect on sweeteners. Just my 2 cents.
 
Not a fan of "sweetened tunings." For me they make things sound out of tune, especially on voicings with open strings anywhere but 1st position. When I set up a guitar with low action and proper intonation it plays in tune across the fretboard.

Yeah - sweetened tunings by definition make some voicings/keys more out of tune. For players who play only in a few keys and/or play the same voicings and who don’t play with other players, they could make sense.

But since I play in all keys and play with other players, my approach is to get as close to equal temperament as I can on our imperfect instruments (I play saxes too, and they are inherently way more out of tune than guitar …), and then on any given note/chord I use string pressure/bending/etc. to tweak it to where it sounds right in relation to the other sounds that the ensemble is making.

That’s a different issue from trying to improve on the physical imperfections of a guitar which I think is what OP is trying to address, but it’s not totally clear to me. But anything that purports to be ‘perfect’ I immediately dismiss because there is no such thing as ‘perfect’ tuning, both because no tuning standard is perfect (although equal temperament is arguably perfect, depending on what your objective is …) and because tuning the open strings on a guitar is only one of the numerous factors that determines the pitch of the hundreds of notes that are playable on a guitar.
 
If you’ve ever tuned a piano, you’ll know that an octave ain’t necessarily exactly double the frequency. Needs to be stretched.
Thanks
Pauly

Yes, but my understanding is that this is not primarily because we want to hear the fundamentals stretched, but because of the way the physics of the metal strings on the piano vibrate and how the harmonics are out of tune compared to the fundamental, such that tweaking the fundamentals so the harmonics are more in tune generally sounds better. Apparently this is similar to why luthiers use slightly different fret placement on classical guitars vs steel string guitars. Though my understanding is that they are stretching by relatively very little - less than the ‘just noticeable difference’ per octave, and even less in the middle range of the piano (typically only a few cents per octave).
 
Hi Rumbletone,

Nah - piano tuning is stretched because of the way the ear interprets frequency.

Thanks
Pauly


Yes, but my understanding is that this is not primarily because we want to hear the fundamentals stretched, but because of the way the physics of the metal strings on the piano vibrate and how the harmonics are out of tune compared to the fundamental, such that tweaking the fundamentals so the harmonics are more in tune generally sounds better. Apparently this is similar to why luthiers use slightly different fret placement on classical guitars vs steel string guitars. Though my understanding is that they are stretching by relatively very little - less than the ‘just noticeable difference’ per octave, and even less in the middle range of the piano (typically only a few cents per octave).
 
Yes, but my understanding is that this is not primarily because we want to hear the fundamentals stretched, but because of the way the physics of the metal strings on the piano vibrate and how the harmonics are out of tune compared to the fundamental, such that tweaking the fundamentals so the harmonics are more in tune generally sounds better. Apparently this is similar to why luthiers use slightly different fret placement on classical guitars vs steel string guitars. Though my understanding is that they are stretching by relatively very little - less than the ‘just noticeable difference’ per octave, and even less in the middle range of the piano (typically only a few cents per octave).
That's about right plus where "the physics of the metal strings" are defined as inharmonicity caused by string stiffness at both termination points (bridges). The stretch enables the harmonic components to better align with the perceived fundamental.
 
Again, I disagree but that’s me ;-)

Thanks
Pauly

That's about right plus where "the physics of the metal strings" are defined as inharmonicity caused by string stiffness at both termination points (bridges). The stretch enables the harmonic components to better align with the perceived fundamental.
 
I discovered some time ago; open string tuning is not calibrated the same as harmonic 12th fret tuning on the Fractal Axe3. You will see a drastic difference in the Fx3 linear or strobe tuner when comparing open vs 12th fret harmonic. Also, when comparing my preferred, software tuner, "AiryWare" to FX3 tuning, neither open string or 12th fret harmonics matched my preferred AiryWare. For reference I use a modified James Taylor offset tuning on the AiryWare. The offsets are -12 -10 -8 -15 -6 -3 EADGBE.
THIS SET WORKS PERFECT IN EVERY KEY WITH MY BAND. On the Fx3 This James Taylor mod offset (MUST USE OPEN STRING ONLY) is calibrated as -13.95 --10.3 -9.65 -13.85 -5.4 -2.85 EADGBE. NEVER USE HARMONIC TUNING ON THE FX3. Harmonic tuning is A=880, where FX3 is A=440 more suitable for "open string".

Skeptical? Try the above offsets on your Fx3 and experience a perfected tuning experience. Please, comment back here to let us know your experience. This discovery changed my world. Merry Christmas
I'm digging the offsets. Thanks!
 
Are we saying you cant set intonation on the axe fx tuner properly without messing around with offsets ?



I have noticed before certain chords in the 9 th and tenth positions sound slightly out and need correcting only to find open is miles out.

Drove me up the wall. Intonation checked and adjusted.



Tried it on 3 or 4 different guitars and it was the same.

I think i just ended up splitting the difference between open and 12th.

Ive never tried tuning at the 12th but il give it a go just to see.

Im assuming because we probably spend more time in the lower register we tune up there.

This could intefere with my ocd i thing 🤣🤣
 
Are we saying you cant set intonation on the axe fx tuner properly without messing around with offsets ?



I have noticed before certain chords in the 9 th and tenth positions sound slightly out and need correcting only to find open is miles out.

Drove me up the wall. Intonation checked and adjusted.



Tried it on 3 or 4 different guitars and it was the same.

I think i just ended up splitting the difference between open and 12th.

Ive never tried tuning at the 12th but il give it a go just to see.

Im assuming because we probably spend more time in the lower register we tune up there.

This could intefere with my ocd i thing 🤣🤣
Check out this thread on intonation strategies too.
 
I think my favorite are still the Peterson offsets.......they just sound "right". At least here they do.
 
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