9.02 Amp Model Poll

[alga]

Hello, could you please tell me where can i find that Radley thread??

 

[Scott Peterson]

I will disagree with you just slightly, but agree with the rest. You can indeed do a high pass/low pass on the cab in your Axe-FX. it's simple. And it works. Try it!!!

I've talked about that since forever it seems to me. Talk to real FOH engineers and not the guys in the clubs. The National level guys. Seek interviews of them if you can't find any to dial up on the phone.

In the January 2010 issue of "Premier Guitar" they interviewed 5 FOH guys. Doug Nightwine (does sound right now for Shinedown) gave me the tip I use in the Axe-FX for a PEQ block after the cab (check any of my presets post 9.00). They high pass Shinedown at 160Hz and low pass around 5kHz. If you look at my presets, I used that as a starting place (along with the advice from Radley) to find what worked for ME and I ended up at band 1 blocking at 120Hz with a .707Q and band 5 blocking at 7106kHz with a .707Q. My signal chain is similar to amp-cab-PEQ with everything else wrapped around that, based on my own preferences.

The key is to use the PEQ to essentially 'dial' in the sonic timbre of your amp/cab combination. You don't lose anything that they won't wipe away at FOH or on the mixing desk in a mixdown. That's the key.

What guitarists hear on stage, the so-called 'raw' guitar or 'in-the-room' tone, isn't what gets through the mix anywhere but in the direct vicinity of the little sonic 'cone' that guitarists are conditioned to like.

What I do is if I am jamming alone, just bypass the PEQ. Massive bass, soaring highs. Playing live or recording? PEQ on = everything simply 'dialed in' ready to cut any mix and not shred ears even when beamed straight at your ears.

To me, that's been the absolute key of FRFR for, well, years. It's how it's done. It works. Pros know it, pros do it.

Try it. You might like it.

regarding live sound i used to be a bit more conservative in using pass filters for e. gtr particularly the high pass--i used to set at 100-200max but now that i'm raising it to 300ish it really seems to improve ceratin rigs quite a bit.

now as for the axe-fx i'm not as fond of setting the high pass that high...more in the 120-150 range depending on the patch...but 5-6k LP works all day long on top and thanks again to Radley for that righteous thread about blocking filters for the axe.
but then there is the argument that if you dial your tone in properly out of the gate the pass filters can be eliminated entirely....but i dig simplicity, so getting in the ballpark and then tweaking with the PEQ works faster for me.

True that. I'd submit though that it is intrinsic to the actual rig used to have too much low and too much highs that do not fit in the timbre needed for the guitar tone to work in a live setting or a proper mix; the electric guitar/tube amp sonic stamp is simply too broad and hogs too much of the sonic picture.

But applying a prudent blocking on the bottom and top, you in essence simply 'focus' your tone correctly right out of the box. So the whole 'dial it right' thing is a red herring IMHO. If the end tone is good, and works live, recorded and alone... it's good. That is my definition of 'dialed right'. Adding PEQ's and such isn't a crutch to fix anything 'wrong' but to make something right even 'righter' if you will.

 

[Kriig]

I just changed my vote to 9.02 for both. I think I was guilty of not giving 02 enough time, and getting hung up on sticking with my go-to amp from the previous release. I'm not sure what I was thinking, because I've theoretically learned this lesson like 8 times already. So for those of you on the fence (all 11% of you) don't be afraid to start over.

9.02 sounds great, but still missing my fav sound. Haven´t got it. But 9.03 will fix it, so what i vote for will not change the fact that it will come back wit that update.
And i really don´t want to change sound 6 times a year. If i record an album now i would be happy to recreate that in a year. I guess if that record would sell a lot, it would be a ballbreaker if i could not dial up the same sound at a consert/gig 3 months later, without losing a lot of good stuff from the updates... That would make some guitarists buy an amp that will sound the same at any given time.

So the sound the player had, should be able to stay.. And it will with 9.03

 

[thadood]

Thanks; I'll have to figure out the Mac equivalent.
Karsten[quote:nebtss23]

On a Mac:
Go to your Applications/Utilities folder.
Click on 'Grab.app' (use this to capture the screen or any portion thereof).
From the 'Grab' menu bar at the top of your Mac, select 'Capture'.
From the drop down menu under Capture, I usually choose 'Selection' (this option allows you to capture a more 'specific' portion of the screen/window).
Place the mouse pointer at the 'TOP LEFT' corner of the area you wish to capture; left click & hold dragging to the BOTTOM 'RIGHT' corner then let go and let go og the mouse; the now encircled portion is captured and the 'save' window pops up. Name it what you want, click save... You're done!
Enjoy..[/quote:nebtss23]

You don't even need to do that:

command+shift+3: Copies entire screen, dumps it in a *.png file on your desktop.
command+shift+4: Copies an area you select, dumps it in a *.png file on your desktop.

 

[funkle]

Hello, could you please tell me where can i find that Radley thread??

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12374

 

[mba]

I just changed my vote to 9.02 for both. I think I was guilty of not giving 02 enough time, and getting hung up on sticking with my go-to amp from the previous release. I'm not sure what I was thinking, because I've theoretically learned this lesson like 8 times already. So for those of you on the fence (all 11% of you) don't be afraid to start over.

9.02 sounds great, but still missing my fav sound. Haven´t got it. But 9.03 will fix it, so what i vote for will not change the fact that it will come back wit that update.
And i really don´t want to change sound 6 times a year. If i record an album now i would be happy to recreate that in a year. I guess if that record would sell a lot, it would be a ballbreaker if i could not dial up the same sound at a consert/gig 3 months later, without losing a lot of good stuff from the updates... That would make some guitarists buy an amp that will sound the same at any given time.

So the sound the player had, should be able to stay.. And it will with 9.03

Just backup the version of the firmware which you've used.
Many old firmwares are still available on Fractal directory.
If you sold 1 million album and need 3.XX firmware i'm sure that Cliff will be proud to send it to you..or a fellow member of this forum.

 

[Kriig]

I just changed my vote to 9.02 for both. I think I was guilty of not giving 02 enough time, and getting hung up on sticking with my go-to amp from the previous release. I'm not sure what I was thinking, because I've theoretically learned this lesson like 8 times already. So for those of you on the fence (all 11% of you) don't be afraid to start over.

9.02 sounds great, but still missing my fav sound. Haven´t got it. But 9.03 will fix it, so what i vote for will not change the fact that it will come back wit that update.
And i really don´t want to change sound 6 times a year. If i record an album now i would be happy to recreate that in a year. I guess if that record would sell a lot, it would be a ballbreaker if i could not dial up the same sound at a consert/gig 3 months later, without losing a lot of good stuff from the updates... That would make some guitarists buy an amp that will sound the same at any given time.

So the sound the player had, should be able to stay.. And it will with 9.03

Just backup the version of the firmware which you've used.
Many old firmwares are still available on Fractal directory.
If you sold 1 million album and need 3.XX firmware i'm sure that Cliff will be proud to send it to you..or a fellow member of this forum.

The point was to be able to keep(in a easy way) a sound regardless of FW, at least from 9.00. And MAIN point is to not have to tweak my ass off everytime a FW update comes along.

There is a magic knob coming in 9.03, and that one kills this discussion. I´m happy as a newly elected president

And if i sold 1 million copies, i would buy a new ultra with every update :mrgreen:

 

[kfliegner]

Thanks; I'll have to figure out the Mac equivalent.
Karsten[quote:28j016e3]

On a Mac:
Go to your Applications/Utilities folder.
Click on 'Grab.app' (use this to capture the screen or any portion thereof).
From the 'Grab' menu bar at the top of your Mac, select 'Capture'.
From the drop down menu under Capture, I usually choose 'Selection' (this option allows you to capture a more 'specific' portion of the screen/window).
Place the mouse pointer at the 'TOP LEFT' corner of the area you wish to capture; left click & hold dragging to the BOTTOM 'RIGHT' corner then let go and let go og the mouse; the now encircled portion is captured and the 'save' window pops up. Name it what you want, click save... You're done!
Enjoy..

You don't even need to do that:

command+shift+3: Copies entire screen, dumps it in a *.png file on your desktop.
command+shift+4: Copies an area you select, dumps it in a *.png file on your desktop.[/quote:28j016e3]

Thanks to you and to everyone else who answered my questions.

 

[mba]

Finally i dislike 9.02 for high gain amps, it sounds too mushy.

 

[mba]

The point was to be able to keep(in a easy way) a sound regardless of FW, at least from 9.00. And MAIN point is to not have to tweak my ass off everytime a FW update comes along.

There is a magic knob coming in 9.03, and that one kills this discussion. I´m happy as a newly elected president

And if i sold 1 million copies, i would buy a new ultra with every update :mrgreen:

So prepare to move your butt 6 times a year, because there won't be a new knob for each firmware allowing to go back.

 

[rsf1977]

Finally i dislike 9.02 for high gain amps, it sounds too mushy.

I have to agree With bmi from the high gain side of things after coming back from practice with my band. Although I think overall the distortion sounds more organic and real there is something not as forceful about it especially in the palm mute aspect. I'll keep working with it, but it's mushier to me as well

 

[Kriig]

The point was to be able to keep(in a easy way) a sound regardless of FW, at least from 9.00. And MAIN point is to not have to tweak my ass off everytime a FW update comes along.

There is a magic knob coming in 9.03, and that one kills this discussion. I´m happy as a newly elected president

And if i sold 1 million copies, i would buy a new ultra with every update :mrgreen:

So prepare to move your butt 6 times a year, because there won't be a new knob for each firmware allowing to go back.

Hehe.. Don´t need a new knob. Set it at 5 (9.02) or set it at 2.5(9.00), everything else would be updating IMU of what that parameter will do. Or just not update that often. It sounds like i want it to now...

 

[Soultrash]

Finally i dislike 9.02 for high gain amps, it sounds too mushy.

I have to say I kind of agree after coming back from practice with my band. Although I think overall the distortion sounds more organic and real there is something not as forceful about it especially in the palm mute aspect. I'll keep working with it, but it's mushier to me as well

jap, all my metal presets sound like rock/hard rock presets now :lol:

 

[thadood]

Finally i dislike 9.02 for high gain amps, it sounds too mushy.

I have to agree With bmi from the high gain side of things after coming back from practice with my band. Although I think overall the distortion sounds more organic and real there is something not as forceful about it especially in the palm mute aspect. I'll keep working with it, but it's mushier to me as well

Have you tried screwing with the damping and sag? I find myself playing with these controls less with 9.02 - maybe I just like the response of the models for high gain now.

 

[rsf1977]

Finally i dislike 9.02 for high gain amps, it sounds too mushy.

I have to agree With bmi from the high gain side of things after coming back from practice with my band. Although I think overall the distortion sounds more organic and real there is something not as forceful about it especially in the palm mute aspect. I'll keep working with it, but it's mushier to me as well

Have you tried screwing with the damping and sag? I find myself playing with these controls less with 9.02 - maybe I just like the response of the models for high gain now.

I've really tried not to mess with anything but the traditional amp controls like treble, bass, mids, presence, master, gain but although it's mushier out of the gate I'm not quite done yet trying to understand it so I'm going to give it another go at practice this weekend and see what happens.

 

[mba]

I've tried to work with all the parameters to avoid the mushy sound but it seems that there is always a "sauce" that remains. So i prefer the older version where i just had to lower the B+ to get more organic&growl sound but without mushy.

 

[marvinx]

Thats what i was talking about in high gain. Especially with the palm mute comment. I think alot of the guys who voted 9.2 for high gain don't really spend much time playing HIGH gain. To them high gain is probably AC/DC. No offense but if you dont play really high gain much, you're just not going to hear the nuances.

I think 9.03 could well be the last time i'm compelled to upgrade for a while. I was happy with the high gain sounds in 9.0, my only real gripe was i thought the cleans and fender models sucked. Now that that is fixed and the high gain sounds will be back im a happy camper.
~mx~

 

[rsf1977]

Thats what i was talking about in high gain. Especially with the palm mute comment. I think alot of the guys who voted 9.2 for high gain don't really spend much time playing HIGH gain. To them high gain is probably AC/DC. No offense but if you dont play really high gain much, you're just not going to hear the nuances.
~mx~

i think their might be some truth to that. Because "high gain" means a lot of things to different people. Some people mean heavy rock stuff, where as I mean metalcore and post-metal. I think the guys who are into the extreme high gain stuff like me are kind of finding it a little mushier more then it should be. But I have to say i'll take the mushiness with the general overall improvement over 9.00, it just sounds "realer" just wondering why things got mushy? what might be causing that.

 

[markus]

Thats what i was talking about in high gain. Especially with the palm mute comment. I think alot of the guys who voted 9.2 for high gain don't really spend much time playing HIGH gain. To them high gain is probably AC/DC. No offense but if you dont play really high gain much, you're just not going to hear the nuances.
~mx~

i think their might be some truth to that. Because "high gain" means a lot of things to different people. Some people mean heavy rock stuff, where as I mean metalcore and post-metal. I think the guys who are into the extreme high gain stuff like me are kind of finding it a little mushier more then it should be. But I have to say i'll take the mushiness with the general overall improvement over 9.00, it just sounds "realer" just wondering why things got mushy? what might be causing that.

What amp are you using, and what is the Master set at?

Mark

 

[Kriig]

Thats what i was talking about in high gain. Especially with the palm mute comment. I think alot of the guys who voted 9.2 for high gain don't really spend much time playing HIGH gain. To them high gain is probably AC/DC. No offense but if you dont play really high gain much, you're just not going to hear the nuances.
~mx~

i think their might be some truth to that. Because "high gain" means a lot of things to different people. Some people mean heavy rock stuff, where as I mean metalcore and post-metal. I think the guys who are into the extreme high gain stuff like me are kind of finding it a little mushier more then it should be. But I have to say i'll take the mushiness with the general overall improvement over 9.00, it just sounds "realer" just wondering why things got mushy? what might be causing that.

What amp are you using, and what is the Master set at?

Mark

Übershall and CAE. MV at 7-10, depending of what i want. Gain at +- and add a drive for some settings.