4 Cable Method Tone Suck

JRod4928

JRod4928

Power User
General question - I'm using a FAS unit in 4CM with my 5150 LBX2 amp. In my situation, my amp needs to be off-stage, so I'm using 25' cables for the 3 cables connecting to the amp, and let's assume the 4th cable is a 15' from Guitar --> FAS unit.

From your experience, would this cause tone-suck, and is there anything I can do to combat it?

I haven't tested this yet, because the cables haven't been delivered yet. The gig is on Saturday. Looking for suggestions beforehand so I can hit the ground running when the cables arrive.
 
Is there any way to have the AXE3 off stage with the amp and then run a 25' guitar cable to the AXE3? You could use shorter cables to connect the AXE3 to the amp. Not sure if the other way would be a problem, but this solution would be less signal degradation due to cable length. You could even go wireless to the AXE3.
 
I'm actually using an AX8, but figured the same situation applies to an AXE3, so I posted it here. Also gets more traffic...

So no way to leave the Ax8 offstage.

Hadn't thought about adding back in lost high end with EQ, but makes sense. Would be tough to get it exact.

I could boost signal in the 2 instances that the signal is in the AX8 to try to replicate the signal strength if I were using shorter cables, but not sure if that would negatively affect tone / dynamics. Seems trying to fix via EQ would be easier.
 
How about a buffer pedal somewhere in the chain? Either a dedicated buffer like the TC electronic or JHS ones, or a Boss tuner. Dunno if it would help, but if you have one laying around you could A-B the tone with and without the pedal in the signal path.
 
You can use the humbuster outputs to minimize any noise picked up by cable runs. And anything coming out of the AX8 or 5150 is essentially buffered, so you're not "losing" signal that a buffer would give you back.

If you're using a head, why not keep the head nearby and run a long speaker cable if the goal is a "silent" stage? Honestly, I don't know if that would minimize and noise/degradation compared to 25' 4cm runs, but that seems like the best practice when choosing which audio cables are longest.

Personally I think setups like this can only be troubleshot (?) once you try it and then find any problematic runs or decide how much signal change becomes unacceptable. In my pre-fractal days, I heard how a true-bypass switcher dulled the trebles ever so slightly, but realized that literally no one else would ever know or really care. So there was no real need to remedy it. You might find the same to be true with the 4cm.
 
Tone suck caused by longer cables is a problem only with high z output like from your guitar pickups (passive pickups!) to input of ax8. The only problem you could have with 4CM is ground loop, where humbuster cables might help and if it's not sufficient you could consider using some sort of separating transformer to break ground loops for example ebtech hum eliminator. But with simple 4CM setup humbuster should do the job. I have 3 amps in 4CM setup with Axe III and humbuster cables are not enough because there's just too much going on between amps and even small hum gets amplified by high gain preamp.

Having your 5150 on stage and running speaker cable to cab off stage is another option but there is a risk that someone could trip and disconnect your speaker cable which will damage your amp.

Which brings the easiest solution - leave 5150 at home. I get it that tube amps are fun and even if modellers can mimic perfectly their tone and dynamics there is experience of magic of playing with real thing and looking at those glowing tubes. And AX8 is currently not the best modeller on earth. It's pretty good but technology moved on. But it's still really good, and definitely good enough for the job. With ax8 alone you eliminate problem of long cable runs, noise, micing the cab and you take away some weight from your rig.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom