Full Res IR question

boltrecords

Fractal Fanatic
Are the full res IR’s meant to be used when going to FOH? I know it helps attain the amp in the room sound and is more pleasant to the ears when using headphones. But is this something that is beneficial for the presets we are using live?
 
I feel it depends on the FullRes IR and how you set it up. With two mixed in low, I feel I can sometimes get a bit more low end thump through the PA without getting muddy.
 
Are the full res IR’s meant to be used when going to FOH? I know it helps attain the amp in the room sound and is more pleasant to the ears when using headphones. But is this something that is beneficial for the presets we are using live?

No.
 
So then how are we supposed to implement full res live with in ears? Is the only way to use two Cab blocks and separate it to two different outputs? If so, That would suck up a ton of cpu
 
So then how are we supposed to implement full res live with in ears? Is the only way to use two Cab blocks and separate it to two different outputs? If so, That would suck up a ton of cpu

I work FOH a couple of times a week at different venues here, at least for now. As mentioned, do not send your sound guy full res.

To have full res on your IEM's or monitors and not FOH :

a) Make sure output 1 is not being copied to output 2 in Axe III settings.
b) Create a branch on your preset typically towards the end. On one branch place an IR player that contains your full res IR's. Place an output 1 block downstream of your IR player. Send output 1 to IEM's/monitors.
c) Creat an output 2 block on the other branch. Make sure the IR player does not feed the output 2 branch. Hand your output 2 cables to the FOH engineer.
d) (I supply an optional IEM mix to my musicians, so in a similar instance you will have to make a harder choice).
e) Refer to the end of my preset below if this is not clear. (this preset only runs on a Turbo, so do not try the rest of it at home!)


Couple of other points to consider: If the band is playing straight up rock, country or blues (i.e. no ambient, swells, etc) then I prefer the guitarist to turn off reverb as well. It is easier for me to add it at the desk and blend it with the natural reverb of the room. Most guitarists ignore this request as they know better. ;) Compression and delay are considerations as well. I just ask whether they are running either so that I can eliminate/limit it on their channels prior to sound check. If they want to turn them off, then I am happy to compress and delay for them as well.

At the end of the day, I (or any audio engineer) am responsible for for a good mix. If I receive mud or crap, then I apply the universal remedy available to me. I expect nothing less when the roles are reversed and I am doing the strumming.


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@HereToday

Wow, that is a complex, well laid out preset. I’ve never used two send/return pairs before. I can see the first branch is for the cleans, bypassing the drives, amps and cab, as well as the volume block. Crazy also seeing the 86.9% usage! 😳 Curios if you have the new Turbo? Edit: tldr my bad.
 
Create a branch on your preset typically towards the end. On one branch place an IR player that contains your full res IR's. Place an output 1 block downstream of your IR player. Send output 1 to IEM's/monitors.
c) Creat an output 2 block on the other branch. Make sure the IR player does not feed the output 2 branch. Hand your output 2 cables to the FOH engineer.
This is impractical in most small and mid sized venues. I’ve never been able to send two different guitar signals, one for monitor and one for FOH. Even if there was a separate monitor desk, it’s usually split from a single source.

IMHO, full res is practically only useable with headphones at home.
 
@HereToday

Wow, that is a complex, well laid out preset. I’ve never used two send/return pairs before. I can see the first branch is for the cleans, bypassing the drives, amps and cab, as well as the volume block. Crazy also seeing the 86.9% usage! 😳 Curios if you have the new Turbo? Edit: tldr my bad.
Thanks! It's my master template that has everything I use in it. When I create a preset for a song, I just eliminate any blocks not being used for that song. Things can move around, but I try to keep the pieces within their "zone". That way I can just glance at a preset and know what's going on. I have pretty much eliminated scenes as well. They are just too hard for me playing live, so I just "morph" with pedals and use a boost switch for different guitars.
 
This is impractical in most small and mid sized venues. I’ve never been able to send two different guitar signals, one for monitor and one for FOH. Even if there was a separate monitor desk, it’s usually split from a single source.

IMHO, full res is practically only useable with headphones at home.
You mis-understood. One set of cables for FOH. The other is for his own personal monitors. That said, if you hand me two sets of cables, I'll deal with it.
 
Thanks! It's my master template that has everything I use in it. When I create a preset for a song, I just eliminate any blocks not being used for that song. Things can move around, but I try to keep the pieces within their "zone". That way I can just glance at a preset and know what's going on. I have pretty much eliminated scenes as well. They are just too hard for me playing live, so I just "morph" with pedals and use a boost switch for different guitars.
This is quite inspiring! I would never have thought of two sends, can you share the rationale? I’m a one-preset wonder as well, and I have been finding scenes not working for me lately. I am going to use some of the ideas in this preset to go naked- er, sceneless.
 
You mis-understood. One set of cables for FOH. The other is for his own personal monitors. That said, if you hand me two sets of cables, I'll deal with it.
One thing to keep in mind though. A lot of venues even if given a stereo send, only run mono or will make you go in mono. Obviously that varies and any system I’ve been responsible for can run stereo, but I’ve also played in spaces where it was either mono or nothing.

I do agree that when mixed high the FullRes os hard to deal with live. But mixed low near -12 or -14db, they can add a touch of thump if needed without feeling much of the room effect they can provide.
 
This is quite inspiring! I would never have thought of two sends, can you share the rationale? I’m a one-preset wonder as well, and I have been finding scenes not working for me lately. I am going to use some of the ideas in this preset to go naked- er, sceneless.

Chorus splits your signal into many and I find that providing a clean signal into a chorus block provides additional clarity and crispness. Or, put another way, sometimes an overdriven signal can get pretty muddy going thru chorus. I'm not sure if plex behaves the same way, but I tried it and like the effect so I went with it. Mainly that whole Chorus/delay/plex zone has a bunch of reserved blocks so that I can move effects and chains around to suit.

The "zone-based" presets are just something I came up with to satisfy my OCD. As far as two send/returns, I certainly can't take credit for it as I have seen others' on the forum and axe-change do it long before me. I think Fremen does it a lot on his U2 presets, for example.

And, yes, I agree on scenes. I like them in the studio, but the fastest way for me to get lost live is to start searching thru scenes! Lol.
 
I run two cab blocks.
Cab 1 is my main IR.
Cab 2 is full res L/R.
Out1 is headphones/IEM. I plug my headphone feed Into Input4 and mix with my guitar.
Out2 is FOH.
I use mixer blocks to decide how much full res goes to each (I’ve settled at 3.4% currently). I also have additional scenes with different channels on the mixer to have different amounts of room mic.

The room I play in is a modest size, so I think that little 3.4% room helps. Sometimes modelers can sound a little too dry in the PA in a small room with no stage noise. I would turn it off in a big, reverby room.
 
I work FOH a couple of times a week at different venues here, at least for now. As mentioned, do not send your sound guy full res.

To have full res on your IEM's or monitors and not FOH :

a) Make sure output 1 is not being copied to output 2 in Axe III settings.
b) Create a branch on your preset typically towards the end. On one branch place an IR player that contains your full res IR's. Place an output 1 block downstream of your IR player. Send output 1 to IEM's/monitors.
c) Creat an output 2 block on the other branch. Make sure the IR player does not feed the output 2 branch. Hand your output 2 cables to the FOH engineer.
d) (I supply an optional IEM mix to my musicians, so in a similar instance you will have to make a harder choice).
e) Refer to the end of my preset below if this is not clear. (this preset only runs on a Turbo, so do not try the rest of it at home!)


Couple of other points to consider: If the band is playing straight up rock, country or blues (i.e. no ambient, swells, etc) then I prefer the guitarist to turn off reverb as well. It is easier for me to add it at the desk and blend it with the natural reverb of the room. Most guitarists ignore this request as they know better. ;) Compression and delay are considerations as well. I just ask whether they are running either so that I can eliminate/limit it on their channels prior to sound check. If they want to turn them off, then I am happy to compress and delay for them as well.

At the end of the day, I (or any audio engineer) am responsible for for a good mix. If I receive mud or crap, then I apply the universal remedy available to me. I expect nothing less when the roles are reversed and I am doing the strumming.


View attachment 93372
Does putting the IR player at the end with the full res IR’s function the same as adding the full res IR’s in the cab block? It’s being placed after all the effects and after the entire chain. How can that be the same?
 
Does putting the IR player at the end with the full res IR’s function the same as adding the full res IR’s in the cab block? It’s being placed after all the effects and after the entire chain. How can that be the same?
Full Res pretty much just provides additional room effects. You can think of it as a reverb-like for all intents.

I’m sure some maybe able to discern the difference placing full res earlier in the chain but I can’t. I like it at the end for other reasons so that’s where she goes. Everyone’s ears and needs are different….However, if you must move it up the signal chain, now you have a bit of a “logistics” issues separating from your FOH signal.
 
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