What am I doing wrong?

[raccoon]

I use also Presonus Eris E5 XT's and FRFR and Cabs..
I adapted the Presonuses with the built in EQ against my other Speakers to get rid of too much low-ends.
Depening on your room and location of the monitors cut the low-ends on the Presonus 1-4 dB may help and in addition the other mentioned hints here.

Addition: I've done the EQing also because of boomy sound when playing CD or MP3 music tracks not only because of the FM3 sounds.

 

[dmonfette2013]

I had a similar experience when My FM3 arrived. No matter what presets I tried, or adjustments / cab cuts, I was hearing loose lows and a harshness that is hard to describe. I also use Presonus Eris E5’s in stereo or my Yamaha DRX 10 in mono. They are not great choices IMHO, but relative to other options they are cheap. One thing that has helps me out has been my pickups. For some reason the Dimarzio Tone Zone seems to agree with my setup. Bill Lawrence l500 was terrible and the Classic 57+ seemed kind of blah. The Tone Zone smoothed things out significantly which surprised my because it can be a bit dark and it’s a higher output pickup compared to the other two.

 

[markc]

I use Presonus E5 monitors and don't like a single high gain factory preset. I got a Fremen pack which got me 80% there. Did A bit of tweaking and love what I hearing now. I pretty much use a 5153 preset 90% of the time.

Edit. Plus a York 5153 IR.

 

[Piing]

Room treatment is everything! I wouldn't be surprised if you were sitting in a bass point or null spot. Move away from corners and walls if you can, build bass traps and put things on the walls, make sure there's lots of absorption if you can't do proper treatment. Put down a rug if you have hard floors.

I can almost guarantee this will be the biggest improvement.

+1 on the room treatment.

A room with minimal reflections and resonances, and faithful monitors, are crucial. Otherwise the presets that your tweak at your room will not translate well to a mix when recording, or to the stage when playing live.

 

[daacrusher2001]

I had a similar experience and sold my first FM3. I've since repurchased one and spent a fair amount of time really understanding how to use it, and more importantly, how to amplify it. I have an old Carvin PM12a - I can't get satisfactory tone out of it with the FM3, or the Helix fwiw. I also have KRK Rockit 5s, and I find they are usable with some tweaking at lower volume.

I finally decided to get a greatly improved powered speaker...I went with a QSC K10.2. There are lots of disagreements on powered monitors but I can tell ya it's a dramatic improvement over any of the things I mentioned above. I could easily gig with it as my backline "amp".

Do not underestimate the importance of getting your output levels set up correctly.

For me tho', it's all about the speaker. I would have probably gotten a CLR but I've been on the waiting list forever LOL. MF gave me a 15% discount on the QSC so I went with it. I can use it for several other things as well and may go the CLR route later, we'll see.

 

[jlynnb1]

it almost sounds like there is some of your direct signal coming through

 

[Jumpback]

I almost sold my FM3 when 4.0 came out due to thick mud tones, but did the amp block reset and some minor high pass adjustments with New York IR's and hohohoh man am I glad I didn't sell, sounds bad ass with all my High gain presets. IR's helped the most

 

[weird guitar person]

Transducers matter! My first tube amp was a '67 Bandmaster and I was disappointed that I couldn't get instant gratification distortion out of it the way I could from my Peavey Backstage Plus. It was a long time before I put a Rat distortion pedal in front of it and thought, "Oh!" When I got my TriAxis I was dismayed that lower gain amp sounds were lower gain, and that it wasn't quite instant Holdsworth, Metallica, and John Petrucci. Being influenced by fusion guys I was running through Bag End single 12 cabs. Only later did I come to understand pre-gain EQ, the reasons for post-preamp EQ, and what a difference a pair of 2x12 Rectifier cabs made. Woulda coulda shoulda. Have fun!

 

[iaresee]

Yes it was new, came with cygnus. I've attached a short clip shuffling through some of the first 15 stock presets, idk how it sounds for you guys but through my monitors when playing it sounds extremely muffled, it's night and day compared to my THR

Its the regular THR10II, its a Van Halen preset but not sure what amp they model it after. I know the FM3 takes time to dial in and I'm willing to invest in it but just suprised how much better the THR sounds when comparing both factory presets out of the box. Is there anything in the global EQ that may be causing such a dark sound?

You're not comparing apples to apples here. Whatever the first preset in the THR is using as its amp for a Van Halen sound is not at all what the first few presets in the FM3 are trying to capture. The first few FM3 presets are old Fender amps presets.

It's not impossible that the factory presets don't work with your specific guitar.

Why don't you try dialing in a preset from zero? Start with an AMP and a CAB block. Pick and AMP model you know and love. Match the IRs to the amp model. Add a reverb block if you need a little ambience. Use your best monitoring source you own, whether that be headphones or an FRFR speaker setup.

It really doesn't take much time at all to dial in good tones on Fractal gear. You don't even need to leave the authentic controls page on the AMP block.

All this advice about room treatment and whatnot seems way overblown and unnecessary. None of the shitty bars I play in are treated and my Fractal gear always sounds stellar.

 

[bleujazz3]

TBH,

The first several chords do sound dark, but it's because there is too much bass. Also, not enough presence.

Try using FM3 Edit to lo cut your bass to 120 Hz, and increase your presence. If necessary, dial back on your midrange a little, and increase your treble. That should improve things.

For reference, I'm using JBL LSR300s as computer monitors, and I compared it to my iMac built-in speakers. Audible difference. I wouldn't say it was your reference monitors as much as it is your EQ and presence settings, which are adjustable.

 

[iaresee]

@RosettaStoned putting my money where my mouth is. I made a quick preset that's just AMP > CAB > REV to show you how easy it is to start from scratch in the FM3.

I only touched the input gain (dialed it up) and the bass (dialed it back) on the AMP block. I used an IR in the CAB block that I find works generally well for gain-ier tones: 4x12 TV Mix #1 -- it's a classic IR, has been around forever, and is super versatile.

REV block was at the defualt settings: Medium Room and 20% mix.

That's it.

With my 594, which is LP scale and a little on the darker side, it sounds like this:

https://mostlywrong.net/audio/2021-07-29-for-rosettastoned-001.mp3

You can have the preset here: (removed -- i forgot i'm running a beta build -- see my post below for the preset settings)

Now you have a super simple preset and a reference clip.

How does that preset sound for you?

 

[The_Logod]

Also - sounds obvious but hey - tone knobs on the guitars are not rolled off? Guitar cable is fine? No luck even with a different guitar? Tried with headphones only yielding same results?

 

[RosettaStoned]

@RosettaStoned putting my money where my mouth is. I made a quick preset that's just AMP > CAB > REV to show you how easy it is to start from scratch in the FM3.

I only touched the input gain (dialed it up) and the bass (dialed it back) on the AMP block. I used an IR in the CAB block that I find works generally well for gain-ier tones: 4x12 TV Mix #1 -- it's a classic IR, has been around forever, and is super versatile.

REV block was at the defualt settings: Medium Room and 20% mix.

That's it.

With my 594, which is LP scale and a little on the darker side, it sounds like this:

https://mostlywrong.net/audio/2021-07-29-for-rosettastoned-001.mp3

You can have the preset here: https://axechange.fractalaudio.com/detail.php?preset=9053

Now you have a super simple preset and a reference clip.

How does that preset sound for you?

Thanks so much man. I just downloaded your preset but when I import it into FM3 it is coming up completely blank without an amp/cab or anything else.

 

[iaresee]

Thanks so much man. I just downloaded your preset but when I import it into FM3 it is coming up completely blank without an amp/cab or anything else.

I just realized I'm running a newer beta on my FM3. I'll redo it with 4.00 and post a new preset later today.

Here's the preset layout:



AMP settings are:



CAB settings are:



REV settings should be default but here they are just in case:



My beta does not include anything that would make a difference in the tone of that simple signal chain. 4.00 should sound identical.

 

[RosettaStoned]

I just realized I'm running a newer beta on my FM3. I'll redo it with 4.00 and post a new preset later today.

Here's the preset layout:

View attachment 86564

AMP settings are:

View attachment 86565

CAB settings are:

View attachment 86566

REV settings should be default but here they are just in case:

View attachment 86567

My beta does not include anything that would make a difference in the tone of that simple signal chain. 4.00 should sound identical.

Thank you I'll try it out now.

I'm thinking that the issue may be with my guitar and or the pickups. I should also mention that often when I stop playing and take all of my hands off the strings a very high pitched sound will start to constantly hum until i either palm mute the strings or start playing again.

 

[johnnyspys]

Thank you I'll try it out now.

I'm thinking that the issue may be with my guitar and or the pickups. I should also mention that often when I stop playing and take all of my hands off the strings a very high pitched sound will start to constantly hum until i either palm mute the strings or start playing again.

It could also be several things besides in the guitar or the connections. See if you can borrow a friends guitar or rent one for the day from your local guitar store. You might also have power or cable issues too.

Back to the sound. When I first got the FM3 within a day I was ready to return it. I just love tube amps and the only reason I tried the FM3 was because I wanted to get a smaller rig for fly shows but also to save my back. Some things I learned that changed my mind on the FM3 are as follows. Now I have a completely different attitude and think the high gain presets are amazing. I have even recorded some songs with on the FM3, a Fryette tube amp and cab with a 57 and I honestly think it sounds amazing.

1) Hint one, dial back the gain a bit.....I am probably wrong but it seems to me like some of the amps on the FM3 have a bit more gain than the actual amps I own...I think that is because there is both an authentic and ideal section of the amp block so you can swap tubes, sag things, and generally mod the heck out of the amp. Stick with the authentic first before exploring further. But often back the gain down. With that also back not just the input bass but the bass on the amp.
2) FRFR and direct outs need a different eq curve than going into a power amp and cab. I find my presets for my live rig (Power station and Mojotone 1x12 cab) are very different than when I used a FRFR or go direct to the PA, versus going direct to my recording interface). Once I got a feel for that, I use out 2 for my live rig, out 1 for the PA (or direct for fly gigs), and a separate set of tweaked presets for going direct into an audio interface.
That is why the FM3 has separate global output curves for out one and two so you can tweak for those possible variations. The great thing about the FM3 is it can be tweaked for just about every parameter but the bad things is it can be tweaked for every parameter.
3) I watched Leon Todd's videos specifically for the FM3 on how to get a good gain sound in minutes. He is fast, no nonsense, talks about eq curves for live, and selecting the best IRS (even gives his favorite away for free). The wrong IR can make a preset sound terrible.

 

[la szum]

I've already tried that, even turn the knob all the way to the right is still sounds bad. Hard to explain everything just sounds like there is a mattress in front of the speaker, but only when gain is introduced, sounds beautiful clean. Monitors are on my desk a foot away from the wall, at ear level

The recording you shared sounds a tad dark to my ears. Are your monitors decoupled from your desk?

It's amazing to me how much bass freqs can travel and resonate (which tends to amplifiy them).

Good luck.

 

[TSJMajesty]

That is why the FM3 has separate global output curves for out one and two so you can tweak for those possible variations.

I think that statement says a lot about why your particular monitoring environment is SO important to getting to the point of loving what your hear from your FM3 (or Axe3, whatever the case.)

 

[johnnyspys]

I think that statement says a lot about why your particular monitoring environment is SO important to getting to the point of loving what your hear from your FM3 (or Axe3, whatever the case.)

No doubt about it. I actually don't use the eq out at all with my tube amp and cab...It is not needed....but with the HeadRush FRFR 12 it sounded terrible without some eq adjustment and that is what several people advised me to do in the forums and it worked. This is why I suggested it might be a solution...or might not.

 

[Jumpback]

Johnnyspys has a great point with lowering the gain, I can play blues with a Recto high gain preset and with the same amp do everything in-between and when I added Leons LT TV 7Mix IR it even sounds cleaner