Help the Fight Against COVID-19

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Where does the stupid line end?

“"As the Pentagon ordered 100,000 body bags to store the corpses of Americans killed by the Coronavirus, Governor Brian Kemp dictated that Georgia beaches must reopen, and declared any decision-makers who refused to follow these orders would face prison and/or fines," Sessions' statement read.”


https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/04/us/tybee-island-georgia-beaches-open/index.html
 
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Experts are trying to understand why the number of deaths has been higher in Italy and Spain than the rest of Europe

One of the main hypothesis is that grandparents in these Mediterranean countries have closer contact with grandchildren and youngsters (kissing and hugging) than at the northern European countries and Asian countries.

Demographics may also play a role, since they have the oldest population in the world. Italy is the second after Japan, but Japan numbers may be lower because Japanese people barely has physical social contact.

LOVE KILLS

Source (Spanish language)
 
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Jeez. Just now on the Hopkins site the US has 311, 544 cases.
That's more than Spain, Italy, and Iran combined.
And they're all at least 1-2 weeks ahead of us.
 
Experts are trying to understand why the number of deaths has been higher in Italy and Spain than the rest of Europe

One of the main hypothesis is that grandparents in these Mediterranean countries have closer contact with grandchildren and youngsters (kissing and hugging) than at the northern European countries and Asian countries.

Demographics may also play a role, since they have the oldest population in the world. Italy is the second after Japan, but Japan numbers may be lower because Japanese people barely has physical social contact. Same in the US, who aren't as big on Mediterranean greetings but it's even MORE widespread.



LOVE KILLS

Source (Spanish language)

I agree only somewhat - I think the way the virus was taken flippantly initially lead to it being much more widespread than realized, and by the time it was addressed it was already too late to contain it. Countries like Spain, Italy, France, UK, U.S. are all seeing massive cases, spread and fatalities. None of them acted quickly, some even disregarded it as insignificant, some even called it a hoax!

On the other hand, countries that have acted quickly and drastically have seen the numbers fall or slow quite significantly. I'm seeing it here too locally where the government acted quickly and so far there has been VERY limited spread, and the culture here too is very physical in nature/traditional.

Take India, where there is even MUCH more close contact by tradition in addition to very tightly packed areas and living quarters, as well as extended families being the norm. Considering their massive population, they have done phenomenally to contain it. Sadly, due to the highly infectious nature and the above conditions, I don't see them being able to fight it indefinitely....but we'll see....I wish them all the luck in the world!

Direct contact may definitely be a major point of transmission, but more and more evidence points to it being spread via aerosol. Take that choir example, that was pretty eye opening for anyone doubting it.
 
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Direct contact may definitely be a major point of transmission, but more and more evidence points to it being spread via aerosol. Take that choir example, that was pretty eye opening for anyone doubting it.

Was this ever in doubt???? I thought it was clear from the beginning that the germ was transmitted via sneezing, coughing, i.e.; aerosol transmission.

We've all heard the saying "Say it, don't spray". Lots of people spit a bit while talking. Singing is talking on steroids!
 
https://www.connexionfrance.com/Fre...ue-to-stagnant-water-and-Covid-19-confinement

The French are adding more chlorine into thier water.. because less water is being used and becoming stagnant within the waterlines.

Gets me wondering about sanitation.
Sanitary goes through a process of purification before its discharged. Then its discharged...sometimes onto a golf course, sometimes back into a stream or body of water.. and sometimes recycled back into the water system. I think you know where I'm going with this.
 
Yes, this is huge news. The test results in vitro are amazing but I believe that this is one of those times where it will translate well to in vivo.

Ivermectin has been referred to as a "Wonder Drug" in the same vein as penicillin and it would be amazing if it also fits coronaviruses.

This is the first time since all this started in January where I'm feeling any sense of optimism. If human trials are successful it will be essentially the end to this nightmare. The drug is easy to manufacture and proven safe. It won't prevent people from getting Covid-19 but it should lower the fatality rate to an insignificant value.
 
Ivermectin has been referred to as a "Wonder Drug" in the same vein as penicillin and it would be amazing if it also fits coronaviruses.

Have you seen the terrible adaption of I am Legend with Will Smith?
Don't know why but I keep getting reminded of the prologue of that flick.
Man creates new cancer drug.
Eradicates cancer 100%.
Within months the dormant cancer morphs into zombie.

Of course that's the ultimate exaggeration, but I hope the FDA doesn't get strong-armed into cutting
too many important human trial phases in the race to get something out there.
 
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Was this ever in doubt???? I thought it was clear from the beginning that the germ was transmitted via sneezing, coughing, i.e.; aerosol transmission.

We've all heard the saying "Say it, don't spray". Lots of people spit a bit while talking. Singing is talking on steroids!
It's clear to those of us that read a bit. Most people still think skin contact is the only way of transmission and washing your hands is the panacea. I have to talk sense into people here everyday.
 
Speaking of reading, I know @electronpirate has threatened to close this thread if it gets political - which is fair given the abuse at times, but I've learned so much more from reading this thread than any propaganda based information fed to the masses, or any social media 'mis'information, or even the WHO, who seems to me almost like a corporate mouthpiece.

So let's all watch our mouths and not get political as tempting as it is.....

So many smart people here from all over the world, with levels of knowledge and expertise, it would be a real shame to see such an informative thread locked because of selfishness, let's watch our mouths and keep it clean and informative
 
The topic is very political as well.

The topic is very speculative as well.

Plenty of conspiracies out there, not just from wack jobs, but every single citizen... as well.
 
200404101758-04-opinion-weekly-column-0404-exlarge-169.jpg
 
@FractalAudio:
Ivermectin has been referred to as a "Wonder Drug" in the same vein as penicillin and it would be amazing if it also fits coronaviruses.

This is the first time since all this started in January where I'm feeling any sense of optimism. If human trials are successful it will be essentially the end to this nightmare. The drug is easy to manufacture and proven safe. It won't prevent people from getting Covid-19 but it should lower the fatality rate to an insignificant value.
Can you help me understand why you didn't feel optimism of roughly the same kind, for roughly the same reasons, as similar observations were made re: the combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin (at least for those who don't have the heart conditions which contraindicate)? Setting aside the anecdotal reports, there are at least three studies indicating benefits.

(Yes, I'm aware of the complaints about the French study. Setting aside its small size, there is also the issue that its design could allow interacting variables to produce better results than the meds merit. But that's could, not absolutely will; the benefits should could also be from the meds alone. There's also this study, and this one.)

So now, we see benefits from Ivermectin. Excellent! But it seems to me that should be another reason for optimism, not the very first reason.

I'm willing to be persuaded otherwise. What'm I missing?
 
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@FractalAudio:

Can you help me understand why you didn't feel optimism of roughly the same kind, for roughly the same reasons, as similar observations were made re: the combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin (at least for those who don't have the heart conditions which contraindicate)? Setting aside the anecdotal reports, there are at least two studies indicating benefits. (Yes, I'm aware of the complaints about the French study. Setting aside its small size, there is also the issue that its design could allow interacting variables to produce better results than the meds merit. But that's could, not absolutely will; the benefits should could also be from the meds alone.)

So now, we see benefits from Ivermectin. Excellent! But it seems to me that should be another reason for optimism, not the very first reason.

I'm willing to be persuaded otherwise. What'm I missing?

I'm going to hijack this question to Cliff to share info on a good friend of mine with COVID-19 (that I mentioned a ways back in this thread).
He was in very rough shape - high fever for 2 weeks, pneumonia...was in hospital for a few days, his condition got worse - they put him the ICU on a ventilator (this is a 47 year old, very healthy person).
While on ventilator, they started him on Chloroquine/Azithromysic. His kidneys started to weaken, and his family was thinking that they may never see him again (wife wasn't allowed in...nothing). Everyone was scared.
Well after 5 days on Chloroquine - he started to improve. 3 days later - he is home! He's tired and weak, but doing well.
That's enough for me to believe in that treatment. I'm ecstatic to have my friend back.
 
I'm going to hijack this question to Cliff...
...That's enough for me to believe in that treatment. I'm ecstatic to have my friend back.
Right, I gotcha, and I'm happy for your friend, and for you and everyone else who loves him.

Still, asked the question of Cliff in the way that I did, not so much to ask about the treatment and the anecdotal evidence in favor of it, but to get an answer about his difference in reaction. (Anecdotes on hydroxychloroquine are beginning to pile up, but as they say, "data" is not the plural of "anecdote," at least not unless your anecdotes happen to be randomized and set side-by-side with a similarly-randomized control group!)

See, Cliff's an engineer, and engineers think a certain way. It doesn't necessarily follow that their emotional reactions always track perfectly with what the data is saying they should be -- engineers are human after all -- but clear-headed engineers try to follow the evidence where it leads, and change their minds as new evidence comes to light.

The evidence for Ivermectin is a study, and while I'm not well-informed enough to know if the study has any design flaws, I'm guessing Cliff wouldn't have responded so positively to a single study, if it had anything glaringly wrong with it.

If the evidence for hydroxychloroquine were nothing-but-anecdotes, then I can imagine Cliff saying to himself, "I'm not going to allow myself to feel hope on the basis of hydroxychloroquine until I see at least one real study." But there have now been three or four studies, and unless they're all equally badly-designed (in ways Cliff's already aware of), I don't see why the lack of a study would still cause Cliff to hold aloof.

Anyway, Cliff's smart and we all respect him, and it seems churlish to talk about Cliff in third-person when he's here and able to answer for himself. I want to let him do that.

So, again: happy for your friend! ...but I do hope Cliff will let us know what, for him, distinguishes between the ability of an Ivermectin study to provide hope, and the inability of the studies of hydroxychloroquine thus far to similarly provide hope.
 
Well after 5 days on Chloroquine - he started to improve. 3 days later - he is home! He's tired and weak, but doing well.
That's enough for me to believe in that treatment. I'm ecstatic to have my friend back.
Glad to know that your friend beat the virus.
What we don’t know is whether he would have beat it without being given the drug. It could have been his body finally creating antibodies that killed the virus off.
Thats why it is important to follow the scientific process and test with a control group while taking into account factors such as age, pre-existing conditions etc. before using it on a large scale. That’s what Dr. Fauci is talking about - all evidence is still anecdotal at this point.

All that is nice on paper, but if I’m in a critical condition, I’d definitely want to try anything and everything.
 
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