Noise gate at input vs sidechain to input

shatteredsquare said:
The gate audio valve is wherever the gate block is placed on the grid, but the thing that opens it is the signal coming in on input 1 (or whatever you pick as the sidechain source), that way the gate opens up using clean pickup signal and doesn't have to listen to a bunch of noise, the threshold can be set more sensitively for it to still open the gate, it only has too deal with the non-distorted pickup DI, and since the gate is at the end, there's nothing between the guitar signal and the amp chain, that link stays open, so the guitar-amp dynamic isn't adulterated by anything
Click to expand...

This seems super cool. Do you know if it would be possible to replicate on the FM3?
 
Any default settings and placement of the Gate block for maximum performance? Would right after amp or cab be a good place? Definitely going o experiment.
 
Tommy Tempest said:
Any default settings and placement of the Gate block for maximum performance? Would right after amp or cab be a good place? Definitely going o experiment.
Click to expand...

Haven't tried it between amp and cab yet, I bet you can tell a difference if you're using a full length IR and definitely if you've got some room level going
 
Just out of interest because i haven’t checked in a while... has the gate acquired an inverse side chain detect yet? I have a method for doing it, but wondered if the block got an upgrade and i missed it. (I use this inverse gate to control my guitar input whilst playing a piano and vs versa)
 
I just experimented with the gate block, set the gate block side chain to input 1, played with default then different settings, turned off the gate in the input block, found no difference, between the way I had the input block gate set compared to the Gate block. I put the gate block right after the amp block, before the cab block and effects blocks. My input noise gate is usually set at threshold -40, ratio 2:1, attack 10ms, release 20ms. Using those settings in the gate block was not effective. I had to go to -30, 3:1, and raise the low cut to 400 to get it quiet.
So my question is, am I doing something wrong?
 
It seems to me there's a good mix of folks that use the 3 known methods: gate before the amp, gate after the amp, and gate after the amp that sidechained to the input block. I'm mostly a high gain user and use the gate before the amp because I like the results I get. I like to get those short, tight staccato palm mutes but, also want everything to sound/ "feel" natural. For some reason, I can never get the results I'm after with either of the gate after amp or gate before w/ sidechain. Although,
 
InsideOut said:
I'm trying to learn how they are different. I understand they give different results. Just want to know why.
Click to expand...

@GiRa already said it, but it's analogous to using your volume knob at the guitar vs turning the level knob at the mixer.
With the gate after the amp, the amp dynamics remain the same, the gate is like applying a fade on a recorded track so to speak.
Gating at the input, means you are fading the input guitar signal, which will distort less at the amp, changing the tone as it fades.
 
AlbertA said:
@GiRa already said it, but it's analogous to using your volume knob at the guitar vs turning the level knob at the mixer.
With the gate after the amp, the amp dynamics remain the same, the gate is like applying a fade on a recorded track so to speak.
Gating at the input, means you are fading the input guitar signal, which will distort less at the amp, changing the tone as it fades.
Click to expand...
I disagree because of the differences in the outcome I listened to. There was no difference in the fade quality. They both faded the same way with the same noise being present when getting near the end of the fade. I just didn't hear an advantage using the gate block. This is why I was asking if my settings were incorrect. And it seems side chaining it back to the input would cause the same results. I'm going to try not side chaining to channel 1 and set the gate, after the amp, defaulted with some modified threshold, ratio, attack, hold and release settings, and see if that gets a different results.
 
Tommy Tempest said:
My input noise gate is usually set at threshold -40, ratio 2:1, attack 10ms, release 20ms. Using those settings in the gate block was not effective. I had to go to -30, 3:1, and raise the low cut to 400 to get it quiet.
Click to expand...

If those settings were enough to latch the input block noise gate, they would have latched the gate block the same way, if gate block was set to input 1 sidechain. 'Should have.' It would have closed the same way, just closing off signal behind the rig instead of in front of it.
 
shatteredsquare said:
If those settings were enough to latch the input block noise gate, they would have latched the gate block the same way, if gate block was set to input 1 sidechain. 'Should have.' It would have closed the same way, just closing off signal behind the rig instead of in front of it.
Click to expand...
So do I keep the input gate active and use the gate block in side chain to channel 1, or do I turn off the gate in the input block. Because turning off the input gate, lets noise pass and the gate does not fully shut. I have to bring the threshold from -40 to -30, and increase the ratio from 2:1 to 3:1, then raise the low setting to 400 or above to get the same results as the input gate setting at -40, 3:1, 10, 20
 
Tommy Tempest said:
So do I keep the input gate active and use the gate block in side chain to channel 1, or do I turn off the gate in the input block. Because turning off the input gate, lets noise pass and the gate does not fully shut. I have to bring the threshold from -40 to -30, and increase the ratio from 2:1 to 3:1, then raise the low setting to 400 or above to get the same results as the input gate setting at -40, 3:1, 10, 20
Click to expand...

What was the input gate's "type" parameter set to? "Intelligent" works a bit differently with AC hum filtering, and I think one or both types include dynamic high frequency filtering that isn't in the gate/exp block.

A better comparison is to just disable the input gate, then compare a gate/exp block before the amp vs. after the amp. The higher the threshold is, the more of a difference you should notice, with post-amp gating dropping in level faster, and pre-amp gating causing the tone to clean up before the volume drops very much.
 
@Tommy Tempest Basically if you just had the input noise gate working how you wanted it, if you put those same threshold settings into the gate block with sidechain set to input 1, it would close the same way as before, it's still taking its cue from the same place, it's just now you've moved the valve somewhere else, it's still listening to the same thing to know when to close. The gate block has to be set to input 1 as its sidechain source though, so it listens to the same thing the input block does. Then you can just scoot that valve wherever you want it.
 
Bakerman said:
What was the input gate's "type" parameter set to? "Intelligent" works a bit differently with AC hum filtering, and I think one or both types include dynamic high frequency filtering that isn't in the gate/exp block.

A better comparison is to just disable the input gate, then compare a gate/exp block before the amp vs. after the amp. The higher the threshold is, the more of a difference you should notice, with post-amp gating dropping in level faster, and pre-amp gating causing the tone to clean up before the volume drops very much.
Click to expand...

The input was set to intelligent.

I tried disabling the input gate, then compared a gate/exp block before the amp vs. after the amp. I found no advantage to using the gate block, as the results were the same.

shatteredsquare said:
@Tommy Tempest Basically if you just had the input noise gate working how you wanted it, if you put those same threshold settings into the gate block with sidechain set to input 1, it would close the same way as before, it's still taking its cue from the same place, it's just now you've moved the valve somewhere else, it's still listening to the same thing to know when to close. The gate block has to be set to input 1 as its sidechain source though, so it listens to the same thing the input block does. Then you can just scoot that valve wherever you want it.
Click to expand...

So do I keep the input gate active and set the way I like it, then add the Gate block, and set the way you suggest?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom