AI-Generated Death Metal

[USMC_Trev]

 

[Muad'zin]

Over the millions of years we have been banging pots and pans together and howling at the moon in joyous celebration, I think there has been a few times in history where we have made leaps and bounds that has shaken the traditional thinking of the time.

..AI will likely evolve into something that brings us forward - but I imagine that it will be phased in slowly as itself takes time to evolve into something of use, which we Can use. ...And over that time, it will either gain more acceptance or it'll be phased out depending on how it positively or negatively effects humanity.

Think, ...a nut-kicking robot. "oof!" ....Ain't nobody gonna spend money on one of those! ..But a computer that can analyze a person's cancer and formulate a genetic repair in half a morning though? One concept falls by the wayside ...the other gets the updoots!

I think, """Eventually""", AI will likely take mankind so far outside of the box as to defy today's concepts or scientific realities - rendering any of today's fears and conjecture just wasted energy. ...Though not in my time. And maybe not in my Kid's time either.. Maybe on the back-nine of my Grandkid's time? .. Maybe.

I ain't gonna worry too much about these things today though! ... You don't get worry lines like <V^> ..these, by worrying about things like that! ;0) .. I refuse to worry about these things until AI can at-least string together a bunch of notes in an entertaining way as is any old ditty that ABBA has ever come out with. Life is just waaaaaay too short to worry about really bad robots and such.

As to "worry"...Remember the time before Space Invaders - before video games? ...before PCs that didn't take up an entire room? ...I seem to remember people worrying about computers taking over the world back then - I still remember people freaking out about microwave ovens killing us all in our sleep, and The Hadron Collider? Remember some worried that it would crack open the universe?

I have arthritis which is making it harder and harder to hold a pick or play - I do kinda worry about that, ...but have also made my peace with it - being that time marches forth for us all n'all that.

As to technology? ..Sometimes we just gotta trust in ourselves to bend science and technology to our needs, and not assume that new technology will be allowed to be all things to all people. Because it never has in the past - or the present - no matter how far mankind has come.

...in addendum.. Even if AI could write and play a musical instrument better than Miley Cyrus, Mankind - in all it's million of years has proven one thing - that we just love to bang pots and pans together and howl at the moon.

When it comes to music ..one day .. maybe ..an AI musician will enjoy a cult following. But because of the sheer fun of creating and playing music? Logically speaking? AI don't stand a chance of competing with mankind in this department - Not a snowballs in Hades of one.. Mankind just likes to do music waaay-too much.

Interesting thing though. For a while everybody worried about Orwell's 1984 coming to fruition. And they were right! It just took a different shape. But we live in a 1984 world. Government cameras observe our every move, governments eavesdrop on our internet traffic and massive corporations gather every byte of what we do online. Only instead of a big brother TV set spying in our living room we carry a small big brother device we pay for ourselves called the smart phone.

And computers and AI have taken over the world. It's become so complex that our decision making relies heavily on algorithms. Life and death decisions are being made by them. Government bureaucrats rely on algorithms for their decisions, medical insurers rely on algorithms for their decisions, CEO's rely on algorithms for their decisions, generals rely on algorithms for their decisions. But they are still not perfect. You could be denied life or death medical treatment because an algorithms thinks you're too much of a risk factor. You could be harshly sentenced because an algorithms thinks you could become a career criminal, you could be killed via hellfire drone strike because of an algorithm. People rely on algorithms because they trust them, even though they are clueless as to how they work.

We already live in 1984 and Brave New World. We just either believe we don't or we chose to ignore it. Cause ignorance is bliss.

Here's another AI generated track, quick Google..



Not bad! If it's real, actually quite impressive. You know, i reckon it'll be interesting to see where human/AI collaboration takes us musically. Just finding endless ways of generating all that has been is kinda pointless, and let's face it, there's plenty of musicians already doing that!...

However, things like Spotify and playlists already have a huge impact on how people listen. Or not listen, maybe...go to the gym, put on your Gym playlist, going shopping, put on your shopping playlist, having a dance party, put on you "Dance" playlist.. etc. And it might not really matter who or what is actually playing or making the music, just so long as the music doesn't stop...

Spotify and youtube suggested playlists for things you like. Another case of algorithms making decisions for us.

 

[steadystate]

This is far more entertaining to me than death metal. This is hilarious.

 

[Mark-B]

Interesting thing though. For a while everybody worried about Orwell's 1984 coming to fruition. And they were right! It just took a different shape. But we live in a 1984 world. Government cameras observe our every move, governments eavesdrop on our internet traffic and massive corporations gather every byte of what we do online. Only instead of a big brother TV set spying in our living room we carry a small big brother device we pay for ourselves called the smart phone.

And computers and AI have taken over the world. It's become so complex that our decision making relies heavily on algorithms. Life and death decisions are being made by them. Government bureaucrats rely on algorithms for their decisions, medical insurers rely on algorithms for their decisions, CEO's rely on algorithms for their decisions, generals rely on algorithms for their decisions. But they are still not perfect. You could be denied life or death medical treatment because an algorithms thinks you're too much of a risk factor. You could be harshly sentenced because an algorithms thinks you could become a career criminal, you could be killed via hellfire drone strike because of an algorithm. People rely on algorithms because they trust them, even though they are clueless as to how they work.

We already live in 1984 and Brave New World. We just either believe we don't or we chose to ignore it. Cause ignorance is bliss.



Spotify and youtube suggested playlists for things you like. Another case of algorithms making decisions for us.

LOL.. yeah, I caught that “computers ruling the world” thing right after I submitted it - I figured I needed the smack-down as I tend to waffle way too much. :0) ...But yes. Computers these days have their fingers in all our pies.

But the reason why life is what it is today, is because life has been shaped by the majority of the numbers, and it simply ain’t all that bad. The minute it becomes “that bad” for the majority, politicians get voted out of their jobs, which they prefer we didn’t do to them. As such, when society to a greater extent says “enough”, things change.

True enough, somebody is always trying to take advantage, but in the end, we get what we need - maybe not what we want, but generally we get what we need.

I don’t worry about AI taking over the music biz. Like I said before, humans love to listen to, play, and perform music. No robot will stop that from ever being a reality. The rest? ...will be tuned to society one way or another based on what the people need, and to a lesser extent “want”.

If AI even tries to run amok, the people will want it curtailed. ...And you see evidence of these “checks and balances” regarding these kinda things today with lawmakers tweaking how BiG Biz gathers and uses information (for example). When people notice their privacy violated (entities taking advantage), they speak up, the political machine - which likes to sit on their thrones and prefer not to be voted out off of them, jump into action, express their phony concern and fake outrage and “do something about it” ..if it’s one thing you can count on, it’s the utter selfishness of the average politician.

...So. :0) ...As long as we get to vote schmucks into, and out of a job, the people will get what they need (whether that’s a job, a handout, or cheaper healthcare), all that, and a little of what they want.

To worry about AI becoming the end of all things is bit pessimistic. Being realistic, we tend to curtail the negative as needed, and shape society to a more comfortable reality. Because the minute we don’t.. Voters freak so their politicians freak and all that kinda-whatnot and tomfoolery.

A lot of Orwell’s 1984 didn’t come to pass. Logical mathematical progression can oftentimes make a Nostradamus of anyone. But have faith in a person’s morality, dignity and their survival instincts. As it’s these things which put the kibosh on unchecked societal self-destruction.

I’m not exactly being an optimist - more a realist. We survive. It’s hard-baked into who we are. And it’s the who and what we are and what we need which steers the ship.

I honestly have high hopes for AI. Right now it’s more artificial than intelligent. But, one day, I have a feeling AI just might save us. It’ll see the angles we are too limited, selfish or emotional to see, create at exponential speeds. ...And if it really is “intelligent” ..just like them politicians ...it’ll also figure it will need us as much as we may come to need it.

 

[ChristThePhone]

...
And if it really is “intelligent” ..just like them politicians ...it’ll also figure it will need us as much as we may come to need it.

What makes you think AIs will need humans on the long run and why they shouldn't try to take over control of their own existence and protect it ?

 

[Mark-B]

What makes you think AIs will need humans on the long run and why they shouldn't try to take over control of their own existence and protect it ?

...what makes you think we would be that easy to control, or kill off? ...because that is basically what we are talking here. What makes you think we would be AI’s natural enemy at all?

To survive, it would need to do something we engage in to survive ourselves, it would need to coexist with it’s surroundings. It would need to either make it’s peace with nature - and we all kneel before that God - or AI would just need to keep those who service and protect it, happy.

Nature is uncontrollable. We, all of us, only exist due to it’s unthinking mindless mercy or wrath.

Then, so, We? ...We not happy, we start looking at cost/return, we start thinking “meh, let’s pull the plug”.

Going full T2 ...If it wars with us, we would war with it, we could harm or kill it. We certainly wouldn’t maintain it, it gets struck by lightning we don’t rush in to do the repairs - that kinda thing.

..No doubt, as the insecure breed we are, we would have failsafes built into these types of computers anyway. If flipping the switch doesn’t take care of it, we have proven to be a noxious adversary with certainly enough highly adapted boots on the ground to get in and get a job done.

If it was truly intelligent, it would know that. Warring with us? ..it would consider risk over reward.

...As for our own survival...Millions of years of evolution kinda points to the fact that we are a tough nut to crack when it comes to outright destruction. We adapt and overcome, this is our world and we are designed to survive in it; whereas AI may not be able to survive without help.

Think, Ants. ...they can get into all kinds of nooks and crannies. We are not necessarily the enemy to AI. Nature, I would imagine, would pose more a long-term threat to a truly sentient but electrical - even biologically powered entity than humans ever could be.

But, as for it turning on us..Why would we just sit back and allow AI to do that to us? We wouldn’t. We never have in the past. Survival might be the one thing - as a species - that we can all agree is a good thing to engage in, and it’s something we have engaged in for hundreds of thousands - millions of years. And to survive we learn to coexist with our surroundings and what we create.

As would it.

...Here’s as sobering thought. :0) ...IF ..”it” evolves, and if AI truly wanted to kill us ALL off - all of us - and survive, itself.. If it had little concept of time (which it conceivably would).. If AI figured out a way to combat the incessant changes in moisture, heat, cold - how to deter the mice and squirrels and raccoons setting up home in the ventilation shafts and chewing through it’s wires-n-such, if it was truly self-sufficient - and nature would NOT be kind to this thing - if it could handle all the lightning strikes earthquakes tsunamis haboobs and floods. ...If an AI could truly survive by itself, all it would have to do to kill us all off - without any kinda drama or harm to itself ...is play dumb.

It would just need to kick back, throw us a couple of bones every now and again to keep us happy and itself maintained, and wait for time to do us all in. It would just have to pretend to be our friend, it would only need to be marginally useful as for it to be kept online, maintained, and cost efficient to keep around.

But, I figure, that it would be in it’s own interest to coexist - even help us. And the only way we would have it’s back, and not just shut it down, is if it was continuing to prove itself as useful, and to do that, all it would need to do is continue to bring us forward. Which means “make us happier”.

There’s really not much upside in destruction on any side of the equation. Not for it, not for us. Long-term symbiosis at a guess?

Really nice chatting with you guys about this kinda thing. ...I’m not gonna pretend I’m right about all of this - just my own current thinking n’ conclusions is all... which are always subject to change :0) ...gotta go work!

 

[xrist04]

I really don't understand these scientists sometimes. I get it that robots can replace our labor, so we are free to pursue the things that are really worth in life, like the arts. And then they design robots and algorithms that can do that as well. What the hell are we supposed to [be] in a post-AI world then?

Critics.

 

[Carl]

....
Nature is uncontrollable. We, all of us, only exist due to it’s unthinking mindless mercy or wrath....

And yet...most of/all human invention and technology is an attempt to "control" nature in some form. And through the process of gauranteeing food supply and all the rest of it, humans have brought much of nature to it's knees...
Of course we, humans, are a product of nature itself...nature has inadvertently brought about the cause of it's own possible destruction...
Perhaps we could be viewed as natures' "AI"... perhaps the AI we create may do the same..

 

[unix-guy]

Nature is uncontrollable.

For now...

With the right AI, we may eventually have computers that CAN control nature.

 

[Muad'zin]

LOL.. yeah, I caught that “computers ruling the world” thing right after I submitted it - I figured I needed the smack-down as I tend to waffle way too much. :0) ...But yes. Computers these days have their fingers in all our pies.

But the reason why life is what it is today, is because life has been shaped by the majority of the numbers, and it simply ain’t all that bad. The minute it becomes “that bad” for the majority, politicians get voted out of their jobs, which they prefer we didn’t do to them. As such, when society to a greater extent says “enough”, things change.

Well, we already live in a world where the younger generations on average will be worse off then their parents and grandparents. We already live in a world where a family needs two incomes to enjoy the lifestyle that used to be affordable by one income. We already live in a world where our job security has become less then those enjoyed by past generations. I did not vote for this, nobody I know voted for this, I don't even remember a single political party saying that they wanted to promote this. This all happened to us and we did not vote the politicians responsible for this out of office. In fact many of them are still in office. This is as political as I will go, so don't worry, the point I'm trying to make is that when things go sudden, then people will notice and act accordingly at the ballot box, but a slow gradual process that has been happening for almost 40 years, people are not going to notice that until its too late or at all. It's like the story of the frog that's being put in a pan with water that's slowly being brought to boiling point.

True enough, somebody is always trying to take advantage, but in the end, we get what we need - maybe not what we want, but generally we get what we need.

Do we need algorithms deciding our lives? It's helpful and fun if it shows us new music and movies that we would never have enjoyed otherwise, but what if we are denied medical insurance, or sentenced more harshly because the algorithm has decided, by some fluke in the code that we are too much of a risk? This has happened to people.

I don’t worry about AI taking over the music biz. Like I said before, humans love to listen to, play, and perform music. No robot will stop that from ever being a reality. The rest? ...will be tuned to society one way or another based on what the people need, and to a lesser extent “want”.

People love to listen to music, but most people also don't care where it comes from. Just like when given a choice between more expensive made in your own country, or more expensive sold in your local mom and pop store vs. cheap made in cheap country sold over the internet people in general will go for the latter. Most pop music is god awful because its generic, and this is what most people like to hear. But in the past at least it was still made and performed by people, and now most likely it will be AI generated. Because now the music labels can cut out even more of the middle men to make even more profits. No more pesky artists, sound engineers and writers, just an AI. Oh, they'll take to it like fish to water.

If AI even tries to run amok, the people will want it curtailed. ...And you see evidence of these “checks and balances” regarding these kinda things today with lawmakers tweaking how BiG Biz gathers and uses information (for example). When people notice their privacy violated (entities taking advantage), they speak up, the political machine - which likes to sit on their thrones and prefer not to be voted out off of them, jump into action, express their phony concern and fake outrage and “do something about it” ..if it’s one thing you can count on, it’s the utter selfishness of the average politician.

...So. :0) ...As long as we get to vote schmucks into, and out of a job, the people will get what they need (whether that’s a job, a handout, or cheaper healthcare), all that, and a little of what they want.

I reckon you have more faith in the system then I do. I guess in my 50 years on this planet I have not seen the system work this way. People will respond to and outrage over incidents, but they don't respond to trends. And its the trends that are far far far more dangerous. And the trend has not been changing one bit for over 40 years. The job for life is dead, productivity meaning equal increases in wealth and average incomes is dead. Privacy is so blindingly obviously dead. People know that Google and Facebook know everything about them. They still don't care.

To worry about AI becoming the end of all things is bit pessimistic. Being realistic, we tend to curtail the negative as needed, and shape society to a more comfortable reality. Because the minute we don’t.. Voters freak so their politicians freak and all that kinda-whatnot and tomfoolery.

Like I said, people freak out over incidents, not trends, it's the trends we have to worry about.

A lot of Orwell’s 1984 didn’t come to pass. Logical mathematical progression can oftentimes make a Nostradamus of anyone. But have faith in a person’s morality, dignity and their survival instincts. As it’s these things which put the kibosh on unchecked societal self-destruction.

I’m not exactly being an optimist - more a realist. We survive. It’s hard-baked into who we are. And it’s the who and what we are and what we need which steers the ship.

I honestly have high hopes for AI. Right now it’s more artificial than intelligent. But, one day, I have a feeling AI just might save us. It’ll see the angles we are too limited, selfish or emotional to see, create at exponential speeds. ...And if it really is “intelligent” ..just like them politicians ...it’ll also figure it will need us as much as we may come to need it.

I don't fear AI because it will become sentient and destroy us all, I fear AI because it will take away all meaning to our lives. Because to live in a world where machines do all the work for us and all we do is fun things and/or enjoy virtual reality is not a life worth living. We are not hardwired for such a life. We need purpose. We find purpose through adversity and struggle. And also rank and status as we are still monkeys who live on a rock, and the higher you are on that rock, the more status and females you will get. I was unemployed for like ten years and materially I was reasonably well off. In some ways I even had more spendable income in 2003 then I had now. Everything gets more expensive, incomes have not risen accordingly, current generations are worse of then past generations. It's the trend. But what made me miserable back then was to just answer a simple question, what do you do?

That question filled me with infinite dread. Because I did not want to say I was an unemployed bum. For that would mean low status and no meaning. Becoming a volunteer at a youth center gave me so much more purpose in life. For I felt I was needed and I could finally answer that question with my head held high. Seeing that job become a paid job, was like heaven. This is why I am against AI and automation. You can say, oh, but those jobs replaced are the crap jobs, but those were still jobs that gave people meaning. Jobs that helped them provide for their families. Not everybody can do higher learning to get a job that (for now) will not get replaced by automation. And this is why I think that for the good of mankind we should stop working on AI's. Before the trend goes to far and its too late to take action. Because scientists will not stop it themselves. Their's is the job that goes 'what does this button do?' But we're not getting that debate. For various reasons. Even though its the most important debate of our lifetime next to climate change.

 

[Mark-B]

And yet...most of/all human invention and technology is an attempt to "control" nature in some form. And through the process of gauranteeing food supply and all the rest of it, humans have brought much of nature to it's knees...
Of course we, humans, are a product of nature itself...nature has inadvertently brought about the cause of it's own possible destruction...
Perhaps we could be viewed as natures' "AI"... perhaps the AI we create may do the same..

My first post (I think), mentioned that AI could help us create technology to clean our air, and our oceans, and basically fix all the ills of the world. Man, sitting back it's haunches, today, saying "Well!, 'Been nice!" as he wipes the spots of ketchup off his Iron Maiden T-Shirt and disposes of his Styrofoam hamburger container - responsibly - in the nearest trash receptacle isn't a forever option. And if we can't figure out a way to survive our own laziness and greed, then it's Very-possible AI can.

..What if AI could be capable of crunching all the numbers - in a single afternoon - and could come up with a strain of bacteria which would harmonically integrate with the ocean - leave all ocean life unaffected - a strain of bacteria that could never evolve, a strain of bacteria that would clean the ocean of plastic and petrochemicals. Or increase fertility in certain fish to re-propagate the ocean, or create a source of food that can grow without water and using near-zero ambient humidity, cost effectively, and which, okay, might not be ideal, but could at-least end famine?

We can't effectively do that. ...we can't seem to really figure a way of repairing the destruction we cause because the costs/profit margin is too slim :'0( ..So big business doesn't what to pour years of time and billions of dollars into something like that. Society doesn't want to pay more taxes to fund something like that; ..and the math is currently way too damn hard. Just to handle the contamination in the ocean, you have to take into account Every-tiny-thing from diatoms to sharks to seagulls to evaporation - how it would effect rainwater.

We're just not smart enough to figure out how to clean up our mess that effectively or that quickly. .. But AI might evolve to point where It could, and just in the nick of time to help save us.

I don't think what we have done to our environment was done out of malice. It was done in the name of profit - profiteering which was happily supported by societal laziness, greed and convenience. Out of necessity we needed the food, shelter, and clothing.

But thinking AI is out to get us? Why? .. What's the upside? ....Generally - as higher-ups on the food chain, we have learned that we need to preserve, and we help propagate failing species. Because we do these things, what makes you think AI wouldn't do the same?

AI could figure out treatments for incurable afflictions - cost effectively. Imagine a type of service industry which could compound food in exact quantities - create a kind of shake, which would keep you living life, in perfect health, for much longer periods of time based on your specific genetic needs. Imagine having a type of machine that could do that same thing in your own kitchen.

Right now we are printing 3d Hearts.. Printing the things! ..Think of what AI could add to the mix to help humanity survive it's own condition.

I think the possibilities are endless. But the "I don't know, but we might not be able to reign it in, therefore it bad" ... I think that will kill off a LOT faster than AI ever could.

 

[Mark-B]

For now...

With the right AI, we may eventually have computers that CAN control nature.

Yeah..that would be a toughie! :0) ..Nature's cards are dealt based on the composition of the earth, it's ever shifting upper layers, it's magnetic fields, the gravitational pull of the moon and our rotation around the sun - not to mention our ability to contaminate our environment; and also how we farm it for what we need - food or steel (or whatever). I can't imagine ever controlling nature to the point that it wouldn't spectacularly kick-off to some apoplectic degree.

But, who knows? :0)

I could more easily imagine that AI could warn us in plenty of time that that Cat 4 Hurricane WILL or Absolutely WON'T make landfall.. I don't doubt for a second it may one day provide us very-very accurate predictions for natural disasters and importantly give us a Lot more warning, and maybe-even an out, so we could better survive those natural catastrophes.

hmmm.. :0?

 

[unix-guy]

Do we need algorithms deciding our lives? It's helpful and fun if it shows us new music and movies that we would never have enjoyed otherwise, but what if we are denied medical insurance, or sentenced more harshly because the algorithm has decided, by some fluke in the code that we are too much of a risk? This has happened to people.

So instead leave those decisions to humans, right? Because humans are infallible, impervious to greed, corruption, laziness, stupidity, etc?

The same things you mentioned can also be (and have and are) decided poorly by people. And have been for a long, long time. No system is perfect

 

[Muad'zin]

So instead leave those decisions to humans, right? Because humans are infallible, impervious to greed, corruption, laziness, stupidity, etc?

The same things you mentioned can also be (and have and are) decided poorly by people. And have been for a long, long time. No system is perfect

It's not about who can make the better decisions. It's about taking away meaning and purpose from human beings. When all the work gets done by AI and robots what are we going to do? How will we derive meaning in our lives? How are we going to determine our place at the monkey rock? And you might say, the monkey rock is bad. Status should not be determined by how high you get to sit on top of the rock. No argument there. But it is hardwired into us. At heart we are still monkeys, animals who happen to be a bit smarter then the rest. Mess with this at your own peril!

Also who gets to program and control these AI's and algorithms? Algorithms have made some questionable decisions as well, in the end they are only as good as their code was written. When mistakes are being made, errors in the code, errors in the information and assumptions the end results can be just as bad as with human decisions.

 

[Mark-B]

...Well, we already live in a world where the younger generations on average will be worse off then their parents and grandparents. .... It's like the story of the frog that's being put in a pan with water that's slowly being brought to boiling point.

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Society, in the past, seemed more about making their lives easier - they didn't want to pay reasonable taxes - ...then, we still don't. They prioritized things then which are causing issues today - and we still haven't learned from much of that behavior and continue to make the same mistakes..

True enough. We don't have all the answers today. Yeah, we screwed up in the past, and we have socioeconomic issues which are very real because of it, and we can point fingers anywhere we like, and as much as we like, but, really, that's just abdicating our own personal responsibilities and that isn't fixing a damn thing.

...As political as I get is this: Pay attention. Vote wisely. ..Real levels of Personal accountability and Personal responsibility has to lead the way there. I capitalized the "P" intentionally.

But, if you look around, you are beginning to see that frog figuring that too much more heat ain't gonna work out for him. You are also seeing a dynamic sociopolitical shake-up and a more rapid change in popular ideas and ideal because that frog is waking the hell up. Somebody famous once said that society swings on a pendulum, as far one way it will travel, it will travel in the opposite direction by near equal amounts, eventually, issues are solved due to those dynamic shifts and the pendulum swings in a less aggressive arc for it.

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Do we need algorithms deciding our lives? It's helpful and fun if it shows us new music and movies that we would never have enjoyed otherwise, but what if we are denied medical insurance, or sentenced more harshly because the algorithm has decided, by some fluke in the code that we are too much of a risk? This has happened to people.

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The medical issue is a place where we absolutely do not need any computer saying "no" at all..

I think society has woken up to this issue and is in the process of figuring out another way. Big Business hates it when you cut into their slice of the pie, so they support politicians to slow down processes which will do just that. Having said that, and getting back to that frog :0) ... I think the people have had enough on this score, and I figure there will be some real change with healthcare over the next decade or so.

Now, I do think AI could make medicines, medical processes and treatments cheaper/ more efficiently than we can make them, but it should never say "no" to treatment after a doctor's evaluation and recommendation for treatment.

..Then ..why would we let an algorithm ..and today it's not "an algorithm" it's simply corporate greed. But why would we allow a computer to have that kinda of power over us? ...Steps forward in technology are meant to enhance our lives, not to end our lives.

Today you are seeing unrest on this subject, and rightly so. Things will get fixed sooner than later because of it. But it's a big ship we're sailing on, it takes time to safely come about.

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People love to listen to music, but most people also don't care where it comes from. Just like when given a choice between more expensive made in your own country, or more expensive sold in your local mom and pop store vs. cheap made in cheap country sold over the internet people in general will go for the latter. Most pop music is god awful because its generic, and this is what most people like to hear. But in the past at least it was still made and performed by people, and now most likely it will be AI generated. Because now the music labels can cut out even more of the middle men to make even more profits. No more pesky artists, sound engineers and writers, just an AI. Oh, they'll take to it like fish to water.

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:0O ...the entire music industry is changing, dude! ...When, in the time of The Beetles, did they have the option to get up in the morning and record their own music in 64 tracks - for free - and publish it - themselves, in the period of a day?

...Back then they Needed real investment in music. It took Big Business to get a single to market. Now, anybody can publish a tune and promote it on YouTube or Reddit. The creativity - you could imagine might logically be seen to decline since record labels - Big Business - isn't as commonly involved in the filtering of talent pools.

But Talent and great music isn't going anyplace - EVER, it's just competing now with "straight to Amazon" digital music files which sometimes gets knocked out in an afternoon.

On the plus side, record labels - Big Business - isn't as commonly involved in the filtering of talent pools!! ...We are AWASH in never would have otherwise been realized talent! It's a GREAT Time to be a musician!

I love all kinds of music, from Johnny Mathis to Metallica, Gary More to the Carpenters, Sarah Brightman to John Denver, Elton John...my taste in music isn't limited to genre or dictated to me by a computer.. It's whatever gets my foot tapping and puts a smile on my face! ...AI could churn out music all day long and it could be ..eventually.. GREAT! I might Love it! ..But it won't stop You creating or performing! And it won't stop me from loving what You create or watching You perform either!

You seem to be taking humans out of the equation completely - favoring AI over whatever humans can create, ...don't do that, we ain't going nowhere in this realm. It's ours, we own it, AI can join the party, but that party is already in full swing baby! :0)

??? ..Now ...?? ..There is a fully digital performer - Japanese? Korean? ...it performs on onstage as a hologram, music that it creates from worldwide submitted music, and samples or whatnot. It has its own name - its really quite a big thing over there (wherever it is). It's a real thing! I'm sure you could find it if you looked for it. ;0)

Not my thing though. Just 'cause a computer lays down a beat or reprocesses a sample and just because "Them! ..Those guys" love it, don't mean it's all things to all people. ...You can turn out something that reaches people just as effectively .. the only person cutting you out of the equation seems to be you, yourself. Don't sell yourself short!

 

[Mark-B]

I reckon you have more faith in the system then I do. I guess in my 50 years on this planet I have not seen the system work this way. People will respond to and outrage over incidents, but they don't respond to trends. And its the trends that are far far far more dangerous. And the trend has not been changing one bit for over 40 years. The job for life is dead, productivity meaning equal increases in wealth and average incomes is dead. Privacy is so blindingly obviously dead. People know that Google and Facebook know everything about them. They still don't care.

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Talking to my kid the other day.. told him that life will give you average results if you put an average amount of effort into it, it's kinda set-up that way. It's hard to fail if you do the right thing and put one foot in front of the other. But the more effort you put into life, the more you will get out of it.

..I'm not special. I am located in a small town pretty-much on-top of a mountain, and there are no good jobs here. I decided that I would start an internet based business - "a business I could operate from a mountaintop in Tibet", is what I told the Wife, I wanted..

After a failing a few times, and skirting bankruptcy I put real and serious effort into learning sales and marketing - analyzing search engine results, looking at competition based on those search terms - if I could compete considering advertising costs - that kinda thing. I learned all this with books and research over a period of two years - then I had at it again.

...Now? I ..umm :0) ... do quite well. ..and have done quite well for the last 20 years. I also mentor individuals and do my best to make sure that those people don't put all their effort in the things that will end in wasted time and money.

I'm not special. You get out of life what you put into it, and sometimes it takes starving for a handful of years while working seven days a week for twenty hours a day to get there.

I can also tell you that I have - through an unfortunate set of circumstances - lived out in a forest for six months. Surviving freezing cold and hundred plus temperatures, where every-day was actual survival - not that made for TV tough guy shit, and THAT is what grounded me. That is what made me thankful for the small things. That is also what really taught me the concept of effort.

In my first post? .. I said something about happiness .."its about what people need", not want, and that life "it ain't that bad" ...and it isn't..

This all occurred back when I was ?? 20 ?? years old...I have some Incredible memories of that time, but it was a LOT of work. A person will "survive" so much easier and a whole-lot happier while working a whole lot less - working the shittiest job you can imagine for next to nothing.

It puts things into perspective.

...People live too much in their minds, dwelling about all that could go wrong - they build life up to this thing that owes them something - happiness - wealth. Some will just give up some will work two jobs - I did! ..some will do the lazy thing, turn to crime.

But life isn't out to get you. You put the effort in, you can achieve.

The rest? The Negative Trends? These ever increasing society's ills? The privacy? :0) ... Pay attention and vote wisely. Personal responsibility (P is capitalized again)... the job? ...Make your way. None of us are owed "jobs". Put in real effort, create your own if you need to.

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I don't fear AI because it will become sentient and destroy us all, I fear AI because it will take away all meaning to our lives. Because to live in a world where machines do all the work for us and all we do is fun things and/or enjoy virtual reality is not a life worth living. We are not hardwired for such a life. We need purpose. We find purpose through adversity and struggle. And also rank and status as we are still monkeys who live on a rock, and the higher you are on that rock, the more status and females you will get. I was unemployed for like ten years and materially I was reasonably well off. In some ways I even had more spendable income in 2003 then I had now. Everything gets more expensive, incomes have not risen accordingly, current generations are worse of then past generations. It's the trend. But what made me miserable back then was to just answer a simple question, what do you do?



That question filled me with infinite dread. Because I did not want to say I was an unemployed bum. For that would mean low status and no meaning. Becoming a volunteer at a youth center gave me so much more purpose in life. For I felt I was needed and I could finally answer that question with my head held high. Seeing that job become a paid job, was like heaven. This is why I am against AI and automation. You can say, oh, but those jobs replaced are the crap jobs, but those were still jobs that gave people meaning. Jobs that helped them provide for their families. Not everybody can do higher learning to get a job that (for now) will not get replaced by automation. And this is why I think that for the good of mankind we should stop working on AI's. Before the trend goes to far and its too late to take action. Because scientists will not stop it themselves. Their's is the job that goes 'what does this button do?' But we're not getting that debate. For various reasons. Even though its the most important debate of our lifetime next to climate change.


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Hey, from this - a former forest dwelling troglodyte, take it from me, a "used to be unemployed youth volunteer" is way-high-up on that ladder! ;0) :0)

Look... You did exactly what I told my kid to do when he was unemployed. "Volunteer ", "Keep Busy", "Learn New Things", "Idle Minds and Hands" ...'n all that. I don't think there is any daylight there between you and I. :0)

But I think where we diverge is that I think you are giving AI way too much power and credit.

...I don't see AI as much more than a tool. I see it not something that will put people out of work, I see it as creating different kinds of work. I don't see it as something that lends itself to a negative society, but a better equipped one to go forward.

Just for example, we can bash computers a LOT. ...but they are tools which have done nothing but bring us forward. Fractal? Heard of them guys? The internet - used to be - as a kid - we didn't know something, we would have to hunt that knowledge down - it could sometimes take days - trips to a library and even then we would never learn of that thing. Now we just Google it.

Industries - Trillions of dollars are generated due to computers and those using them to create jobs and their way in the world.

Just WoW!... Is that bad? No.. Computers have allowed us to move forward - faster - and we have adapted to these new realities. Our lives are better for Windows and Macs and PC's and whatnots. No matter how much we call them a POS sometimes.

New realities, not necessary negative realities. New tools to use. That all AI is. I don't see how it could be much more than that. And like the internet, we will adapt to use it. It's not a "thing" that is gonna crush us, the only thing which is capable of destroying us, is ourselves and to avoid that all a person needs to do is pay attention, vote wisely, and offer-up more than just lip-service to Personal responsibility.

..notice what I did with that "P" there :0)

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..DUDES.. It's been a Real pleasure. It really has.. :0) ..I gotta work and I get too carried away with this stuff. I don't think I can add anymore to this thing anyway. But have fun with it anyway.

....either way ...You're all good peeps in my book, whatever side of this thing you come down on. Life is what it is and it generally ain't that bad. Work Hard and Have Faith. ;0) ..Enjoy your weekends!