Guitar Pickup Representation

It's undeniable that there's a difference but "how much of a difference" is where I tend to disagree with people. At the same time I'm having a hard time explaining that there are seven different Vintage 30 designs that all sound very different and what I get in return is "a V30 is a V30" because Celestion says so. The reality is:



And you may think that those sound similar in some ways but that's in a mix context. Do the same with different pickups and you'll most likely understand my point of view. :)
 
I still stand behind my statement about pickups. Yes they make a difference but a very small one. It's nearly impossible to quickly A/B pickups but all the clips you'll find on YouTube will tell you that it's placebo or a feel thing because they don't change the overall tone much. Here's a video I posted before where IMHO you can definitely hear a big difference between different pickup types like single coil vs humbucker but humbucker vs another humbucker or single coil vs another single coil, not so much:

Your experience and your perception of your experience differs from my experience and my perception of my experience.

Too much gain, so little nuances... :cool:
 
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Did you look at the video? Or any pickup comparison video on YouTube? I highly recommend testing yourself and not using your eyes in those pickup comparisons because it's sometimes hard to be subjective with yourself. I have run the data in a pickup comparison years ago and we're talking about output differences and brightness differences of a few dBs at max. This is something that was really easy to make up for with amps. High output pickups - lower the gain just a tad = sounded identical. Brighter pickups - adjust the amp EQ to match the darker pickups = sounded identical.

Remember that pickups are before the amplifier. EQ differences will have way less importance here when compared to EQ differences after the amplifier. This is what my point is all about.
 
Did you look at the video? Or any pickup comparison video on YouTube? I highly recommend testing yourself and not using your eyes in those pickup comparisons because it's sometimes hard to be subjective with yourself. I have run the data in a pickup comparison years ago and we're talking about output differences and brightness differences of a few dBs at max. This is something that was really easy to make up for with amps. High output pickups - lower the gain just a tad = sounded identical. Brighter pickups - adjust the amp EQ to match the darker pickups = sounded identical.

Remember that pickups are before the amplifier. EQ differences will have way less importance here when compared to EQ differences after the amplifier. This is what my point is all about.

Yes, I have looked at Youtube videos, but these narrowed tests do not change my experience of 40 years noting the differences between different pickups (and spending a lot of money swapping pickups).

Seriously? You cannot note the differences? Are you deafened by playing too loud? :rolleyes:
 
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I still stand behind my statement about pickups. Yes they make a difference but a very small one. It's nearly impossible to quickly A/B pickups but all the clips you'll find on YouTube will tell you that it's placebo or a feel thing because they don't change the overall tone much. Here's a video I posted before where IMHO you can definitely hear a big difference between different pickup types like single coil vs humbucker but humbucker vs another humbucker or single coil vs another single coil, not so much:



My comparison has always been to compare this to IR's. Change the speaker on the IR and you'll have a night and day difference while a pickup change will be as you said very subtle. The only difference is that IR change doesn't require a soldering iron nor does it cost $250 like premium pickups do.


If you can't hear the HUGE difference between the pickups in this video you should see an ear doctor.
 
Did you look at the video? Or any pickup comparison video on YouTube? I highly recommend testing yourself and not using your eyes in those pickup comparisons because it's sometimes hard to be subjective with yourself. I have run the data in a pickup comparison years ago and we're talking about output differences and brightness differences of a few dBs at max. This is something that was really easy to make up for with amps. High output pickups - lower the gain just a tad = sounded identical. Brighter pickups - adjust the amp EQ to match the darker pickups = sounded identical.

Remember that pickups are before the amplifier. EQ differences will have way less importance here when compared to EQ differences after the amplifier. This is what my point is all about.

I installed lot of pickups on my guitars and of course there is a sound difference between guitar pickups, high output and low output pickups do not sound the same, 3 months ago I bought the Andy Timmons pickups and I did not like them,i have to reinstalled my seymour Duncan JB back on my Fender.
 
There are certainly "night & day" pickup differences such as high ouput pickups vs low, single coils v buckers, P90's. Leaving a preset untouched and cycling the guitars through this unchanged preset (same as not touching the valve amp) should articulate the differences we are talking about. My original topic included the query about do people find any amp models that are more "sensitive" than others? I agree with ML to the extent that you can tweak a valve amp (or a preset) to balance out the eq of like pickups - eg A2 Mag v A4 Mag with similar outputs. IR changes? Well that's like pickup changes on steroids!!

I can hear the pickup differences in the YT vid ML shared. It's just that the differences were nowhere near as obvious as I would have thought. For me, this "re-aligned" my expectations to a more reasonable level in terms of what I am hoping for out of my Axe FX 3. It just creates a more realistic perspective.

I think everyone in this topic has agreed overwhelmingly that the Fractal products are as sensitive and accurate as ANY valve amp and that was the main point of discussion.
 
If you can't hear the HUGE difference between the pickups in this video you should see an ear doctor.
Ummm what? I'll quote a sentence from the post you quoted...
you can definitely hear a big difference between different pickup types
The term "HUGE" is subjective. I posted that exact video because it was comparing the extremes of what to expect in a pickup swap.

If people are expecting to get a "HUGE" difference in sound by changing their humbuckers to another set of humbuckers then at least in my experience it has always been not worth the price of a set of premium pickups. I mean you can get a used Axe-Fx Standard for the price of two sets of premium pickups. So to justify that price point I would expect the pickups to make a difference as big as half an Axe-Fx Standard. ;) Another thing to mention is that usually people also change their strings when they do a pickup swap and fresh strings always feel and sound nicer no matter what the pickups are.

Here's a good example from the other end of the spectrum from a "metal guy":


Even though that'll be pure noise for some people, this demonstrates my point perfectly. Pickups are pre-EQ and an output difference of about a few dB max. How big of a difference can it make? Certainly less than tweaking the amp block settings just one increment in any direction.
 
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Another factor to consider with different pickups is the feel and responsiveness. Audio comparisons can't capture that. I also reckon there's a psychological factor with the marketing of pickups that lead us to expect what we want to hear - not always, but sometimes.

Time for a tone change? Tone upgrade? Should I buy a new setup of pickups? Nup, I'll save the money and wait for a new firmware update :D. Might buy some IR's though!
 
This all became very clear when we started building guitars with my buddy last year. For the first tests we just got the cheapest Korean pickups we could find and then once the builds got better we started upgrading pickups so essentially we have the same exact guitars made of the same piece of wood and same frets and hardware and everything with different pickups. Out of all the things that contribute to a guitar's tone I think people mainly worry about pickups while hardware may play even a bigger role. F.ex. the type of bridge on your guitar affects every note you play and some people change their tremblocks and get a noticable difference in brightness that's sometimes even bigger than a pickup switch. Here's a good video about it:



I wasn't really a big believer in tone wood prior to this either but now that I have one guitar with a walnut neck and a birdseye maple board it's undeniable that this guitar sounds brighter than the others. Some people think it's a Strat even though it's got Seymour Duncan humbuckers in it. I used it for this clip:

 
Here's a good example from the other end of the spectrum from a "metal guy":


Even though that'll be pure noise for some people, this demonstrates my point perfectly. Pickups are pre-EQ and an output difference of about a few dB max. How big of a difference can it make? Certainly less than tweaking the amp block settings just one increment in any direction.

I think it depends. Pickups/pre-EQ matter less with very high gain as shown in that video. But it matters a lot more with lower gain.
This all became very clear when we started building guitars with my buddy last year. For the first tests we just got the cheapest Korean pickups we could find and then once the builds got better we started upgrading pickups so essentially we have the same exact guitars made of the same piece of wood and same frets and hardware and everything with different pickups. Out of all the things that contribute to a guitar's tone I think people mainly worry about pickups while hardware may play even a bigger role. F.ex. the type of bridge on your guitar affects every note you play and some people change their tremblocks and get a noticable difference in brightness that's sometimes even bigger than a pickup switch.
I tend to have a similar sentiment. I wouldn't say the hardware plays a bigger role per say, but its effect on the sustain, attack, timbre, resonance, etc. can't really be changed with signal processing while you can signal process one humbucker to sound similar to another. Seems like mechanical domain vs. electrical domain stuff, dunno if that makes sense :p
 
Well... during the past years I've found uncountable situations of different pickups different flavors (and I'm not talking about the obvious humbucker vs single coil or high gain vs low gain). Here is the latest one:

Why I cannot get this warm "nasal" tone of Nick Johnston neck pickup with any of my two Strats, one equipped with Fender Custom Shop Fat 50 and other with EMG SA EXG/SPC?

Is there an EQ curve or CAB IR that would get this flavor from the Fat 50 pickup?

0:45 of this video

Or this:
 
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Well... during the past years I've found uncountable situations of different pickups different flavors (and I'm not talking about the obvious humbucker vs single coil or high gain vs low gain). Here is the latest one:

Why I cannot get this warm "nasal" tone of Nick Johnston neck pickup with any of my two Strats, one equipped with Fender Custom Shop Fat 50 and other with EMG SA EXG/SPC?

Is there an EQ curve or CAB IR that would get this flavor from the Fat 50 pickup?

0:45 of this video

Or this:

It could be the pickups, but it could also be so many other things. I think only you can experiment and find out.
 
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