Local Music Shops

My local music store switched its focus years ago to music education as a key to staying in business. They have a small stage in the store for recitals. Most of what they sell is entry level gear for their students. They are the nicest people and I still use them for strings and other accessories as well as setups. As I’m older and like and can afford more high end guitars I’m not their market anymore. However I found out a few years ago the are a G&L dealer and I had them custom order a guitar for me. I got the Strat of my dreams and was able to support a local business...
Yup. The Mom & Pop stores are now geared towards music lessons and instrument rentals. They still have the occasional tube or hybrid amp that you can test-drive guitars with, but most of the guitar inventory falls in to the multiple choice realm...its either yes, no, or maybe.

Perhaps that is an appropriate way to approach a viewpoint subject without ruffling a person's feathers...if the person agrees with you you can continue the conversation, whereas if they say no, you could point to the benefits of what the guitar offers. If they say maybe, you could agree to continue the conversation after they've considered the pros and cons.

(Am thinking like a salesman because I work retail...). Had I studied music when I was younger in school and earned a teaching certificate, I might have easily been employed teaching guitar. That was not my career path, though in retrospect it could have been...
 
It's a changing world. Those that change with it continue to thrive.

Are you suggesting we as individuals ought change to mirror the values of Walmart corporation and Jeff Bezos? One certainly can thrive off exploitation of others and ruthless brutal business practices, but what we’re lamenting in this conversation is the world that’s left when you do that.

The US has already morphed into a country that’s functionally disdainful of anyone who’s middle class; just compare student loan debt, healthcare costs, home ownership prospects, and anxiety rates to those of only slightly older generations, with the caveat that we’ve had a ton wrong with us from the founding, like only truly valuing white men who own property, for one.

So I extrapolate this to the world of music shops. The pandemic occurs, causing massive supply chain problems that will still take years to normalize, if possible, and what happens? Sweetwater buys up as much inventory as possible, whom suppliers prioritize, making it impossible for mom and pops to stock their own shelves. They thrive, and small stores are left to fend for themselves. That’s the kind of thriving that occurs in this kind of world, but it doesn’t have to be that way.

Guitar Center pioneers modern guitar retailing, and you can see what each store has in stock, plan your trip, and show up to find a locking trem guitar missing a string, impossible to play, guitars with neatly rusted strings, fretted out guitars just sitting on shelves, with 19 year old practicing their favorite guitars being the counter, or recanting stories of their favorite gigs. You return to the same store in a month and those guitars with problems are still sitting there in the same state, but you do have the elite room, and those guitars are looked after. Guitar Center thrives too.

We could all fight and outmaneuver each other forever for scraps of food, then moralize brutality under the equivocation of adaptation, and then we’ll just stop viewing one another as human brings with value, and we’ll only be competitors. In that world, you can say goodbye to nuance, subtlety, humanity, or grace.

If we’re left with GC and its affiliated companies, plus Sweetwater, as the only two real players in a game of the “big boys,” the world of instruments going to suck even more. We already count on YouTube personalities to be the salesmen, substituting their testimonials for real experience and knowledge. It’s adaptation, and it does suck a big weenie.
 
I’m so lucky to have a great music shop focused on guitars just a few minutes from my home. They carry high end, medium and student guitars.

https://bobsguitars.com/

They also have a Reverb store, and their policy is to have an item in their store for a few months before listing it on Reverb, and they are in the process of revamping their web site to coincide with their inventory application so that everything is kept up to date in real time. Everyone who works there is a musician, and they have lessons, guitar and amp techs for repairs and modifications, etc.

For amps, they mostly carry combos, now, but used to have stacks. They also have some drum and keyboard items, but are very guitar oriented.
 
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Are you suggesting we as individuals ought change to mirror the values of Walmart corporation and Jeff Bezos? One certainly can thrive off exploitation of others and ruthless brutal business practices, but what we’re lamenting in this conversation is the world that’s left when you do that.

The US has already morphed into a country that’s functionally disdainful of anyone who’s middle class; just compare student loan debt, healthcare costs, home ownership prospects, and anxiety rates to those of only slightly older generations, with the caveat that we’ve had a ton wrong with us from the founding, like only truly valuing white men who own property, for one.

So I extrapolate this to the world of music shops. The pandemic occurs, causing massive supply chain problems that will still take years to normalize, if possible, and what happens? Sweetwater buys up as much inventory as possible, whom suppliers prioritize, making it impossible for mom and pops to stock their own shelves. They thrive, and small stores are left to fend for themselves. That’s the kind of thriving that occurs in this kind of world, but it doesn’t have to be that way.

Guitar Center pioneers modern guitar retailing, and you can see what each store has in stock, plan your trip, and show up to find a locking trem guitar missing a string, impossible to play, guitars with neatly rusted strings, fretted out guitars just sitting on shelves, with 19 year old practicing their favorite guitars being the counter, or recanting stories of their favorite gigs. You return to the same store in a month and those guitars with problems are still sitting there in the same state, but you do have the elite room, and those guitars are looked after. Guitar Center thrives too.

We could all fight and outmaneuver each other forever for scraps of food, then moralize brutality under the equivocation of adaptation, and then we’ll just stop viewing one another as human brings with value, and we’ll only be competitors. In that world, you can say goodbye to nuance, subtlety, humanity, or grace.

If we’re left with GC and its affiliated companies, plus Sweetwater, as the only two real players in a game of the “big boys,” the world of instruments going to suck even more. We already count on YouTube personalities to be the salesmen, substituting their testimonials for real experience and knowledge. It’s adaptation, and it does suck a big weenie.
I'm in Canada.

Never been to a guitar center, and highly doubt all 294 stores in the entire usa mirror your dramatic shopping experience lol.

I also don't use YouTube influencers or gear reviews to make gear purchases as I don't sit in a man cave playing to myself, by myself, for myself, to create videos or the like for clicks revenue.

I'm nobody important, just a lifetime hobbyist and as a consumer, why would I support a small local store that can't stock anything I want to buy?

That's like asking me to support the local convenience store vs 7-11, but that convenience store only has two kinds of slurpee and I don't like either of them, and they've been that way for 20 years and refuse to update.

I have no loyalty, and feel no sympathy.

I order strings, picks, tubes, etc online and it's delivered to my door. Whomever does it cheapest gets the sale at the time.
 
I'm in Canada.

Never been to a guitar center, and highly doubt all 294 stores in the entire usa mirror your dramatic shopping experience lol.

I also don't use YouTube influencers or gear reviews to make gear purchases as I don't sit in a man cave playing to myself, by myself, for myself, to create videos or the like for clicks revenue.

I'm nobody important, just a lifetime hobbyist and as a consumer, why would I support a small local store that can't stock anything I want to buy?

That's like asking me to support the local convenience store vs 7-11, but that convenience store only has two kinds of slurpee and I don't like either of them, and they've been that way for 20 years and refuse to update.

I have no loyalty, and feel no sympathy.

I order strings, picks, tubes, etc online and it's delivered to my door. Whomever does it cheapest gets the sale at the time.
Guitar Center is like that here in Peoria, IL. But that aside, when you reduce the choices and competition in favor a high volume business models (high volume/low service), then you are creating market conditions for a monopoly, which are never good for consumers in terms of cost or selection. No one is asking you to feel any sympathy, but you should understand business is more than the bottom line, and it is proved over and over, from the local restaurant that gets bought out and the highly venerated soup is watered-down, it doesn't take long for them to irreparably harm their name and reputation. You can't win those customers back. But perhaps you are right, and the newer generations want to deal this way. Eventually big business will make you understand. When companies get too big that they are out of touch with their customers, it is never good for the consumer. That is what I was getting at in this thread, on a Fractal forum where I can get help with my guitar amplification system from enthusiasts as well as the company Fractal Audio. I don't know how easy that would be with an Amazon Basics Tone Station. I guess I'd get my money back, and try something else! 😬
 
I have a few at least relatively independent LGSs that are within a reasonable driving distance...plus at least 4 or 5 guitar centers and a couple other walmart-style "big" shops that are even worse than GC.

I also worked at one of the GCs for about a year. At least at the time, the people who worked there were almost all passionate about what they did. Several were gigging or studio musicians/techs that needed the steady money and/or were just starting out. Now, most of the GCs seem to hire mostly generic "sales guys" who might also play rather than musicians who also sell.

The small shops....

One of them is like many described: entry level instruments (the brand Vintage, Sterling, etc.) and gear, random used stuff that can be pretty cool (bought/sold a few amps), and quite a good number of pedals, but all the popular stuff. Plus a lot of "world music" instruments, replacements and small parts for HS Band instruments, really crummy recording gear, etc.. But, they're mostly cool people and one very good guitar/amp tech. I try to buy strings and other small parts from them because I know the markup is good and I like that they're where they are.

One of them stocks a few things from some of the bigger boutique amp brands (Boogie, Fuchs, Vintage Sound, Tone King...that kind of thing) and smaller ones they can order (Orange, Vox), some boutique guitars (Anderson, Nash) and "smaller" mid-level guitars (Reverend, Eastman, Gretch) and a variety of acoustics. They don't stock new Fender, Gibson, Marshall, etc.. But, it seems like most of their business is in used stuff. Most of the things I've seen and been interested in are either used or consignment. I've played a good number of Gibson CS, Heritage, Nik Huber, Collings, some old Fenders (played a birth year strat the other day), etc.. I love going there because they just wind up with random things that are often pretty cool. That's also where I go to sell/consign my stuff that doesn't stick around (they also take a relatively small cut...it's not that much worse than Reverb + Paypal when you consign). They also have an insane collection of pedals. I've found a lot of at least interesting guitars from very small luthiers that don't get talked about online....and probably my favorite "real" amp, which was built as a Tweed Bassman clone with a very nice post-PI MV by a local builder. I wish I could remember the name of the company.

Another one is very much high-end. They stock Wood Library, Friedman, Two Rock, Gibson CS, etc.. They have good techs and a PLEK machine. And they're super friendly and helpful. It seems like they get mad at themselves when they can't find something that fits what you're looking for. I'm not in the market for 80% of what they sell...but if I ever am, they're my first stop. I was very happy to get my PRS from them, even though it's an S2 and one of the cheapest guitars in the store. The experience was still great from start to finish.

The last is a weird one. I don't think they actually stock much of anything besides run-of-the-mill Fender guitars, entry level Fender and Marshall amps, some pedals, and some random stuff. But most of their shop is used or vintage. That's where I got to play a '52 Les Paul. Because the owner saw me playing a different LP and figured I would enjoy it. That's where I got to play a vintage Super Reverb. They have a vintage Super Lead full stack that I've never wanted to subject my ears to. That's where I played a couple different Victory amps (and really liked them). Their guitar techs use a vintage AC30 for signal checks. It's a very odd place....when you walk in, you kind of think you've walked into a run-down, crummy local guitar shop....and you might walk out before you actually look at anything all that close. Their new location is better...their particularly high-end guitars are in glass cases, and you can actually see them from the door. But, I don't think I've ever played anything new from there.

I'm really happy to have them all. Like...really happy. I've ordered pedals. I obviously ordered my Fractal. I've ordered random pedalboard things from GigRig. But, I've never bought a guitar or amp without playing it first, and I don't really plan to. And, I'm very happy not to have to drive to Nashville to try things out.
 
I have no problem being melancholy and wishing for the past.........my first guitar came out of a mom and pop. Aira Pro II. Was a shredder with a Floyd type system on it and a couple of hum buckers. God knows what it sounded like but I was going to take over the world with it at 15 years old. Worked all summer for it and had it on lay away. The owner would let me play it a little bit every time I plunked down another 30 or 40 bucks. Was making 3.25 an hour in 1989. Store is long gone. So is the neighborhood which wasn't that great back then at the time, either. The world changed. We have instant www.gratification at 3am for our every whim. I have 4k worth of stuff sitting in a thomanns shopping cart, all I have to do is click and its on the way! That first guitar, you better believe I LOVED that instrument after waiting all summer to finally get it out of the store. Fkkn days are over. Oh well.
 
MusicZoo here in NY (Long Island) stocks mostly high end stuff. I don’t think you can walk out of there under a few grand. The once or twice I’ve dealt with them, their service was great. Only drawback is good luck getting to them on I495, the northern or southern state pky.
 
I believe that people are still willing to pay for service.
Even Sweetwater made its name first with Service.
Friendly and courteous service is more valued than money.
Add to this a little marketing savvy and offering what people want (same thing) and a brick and mortar store can survive and expand.
 
I believe that people are still willing to pay for service.
Even Sweetwater made its name first with Service.
Friendly and courteous service is more valued than money.
Add to this a little marketing savvy and offering what people want (same thing) and a brick and mortar store can survive and expand.
I will and do pay more for service, up to a point. I’ll go an extra few percent on sweetwater as opposed to musicians friend or similar.
 
Never been to a guitar center, and highly doubt all 294 stores in the entire usa mirror your dramatic shopping experience lol.
While I haven't visited them all, I've probably been to 8-10 and they have all very similar to the experience described above...

Unless it's coming fresh out of a box, I would consider almost nothing at GC as "new"...

Dents, scratches, missing switch tips, nothing in tune, etc.
 
While I haven't visited them all, I've probably been to 8-10 and they have all very similar to the experience described above...

Ditto.


Unless it's coming fresh out of a box, I would consider almost nothing at GC as "new"...

See above.

Dents, scratches, missing switch tips, nothing in tune, etc.
Got a deal on my SG Special at the end of 2018 for exactly that reason. It'd been hanging there for most of the year, and they blew it out for $500 below original price. The output jack was going flaky, and I ended up gutting it and rewiring it, but it's a great guitar....
 
The US has already morphed into a country that’s functionally disdainful of anyone who’s middle class; just compare student loan debt, healthcare costs, home ownership prospects, and anxiety rates to those of only slightly older generations, with the caveat that we’ve had a ton wrong with us from the founding, like only truly valuing white men who own property, for one.

.
Middle class American here with zero student loan debt, tolerable healthcare costs, no issues with home ownership and little to no anxiety in my life barring emergencies. I must be doing it wrong or something.

Comparing 1500s America (who had the same values of the rest of the organized world at the time) to where natives would cook and eat you to making a point on 2022 guitar shopping is perhaps the largest stretch of the imagination I have ever seen.
 
Middle class American here with zero student loan debt, tolerable healthcare costs, no issues with home ownership and little to no anxiety in my life barring emergencies. I must be doing it wrong or something.

Comparing 1500s America (who had the same values of the rest of the organized world at the time) to where natives would cook and eat you to making a point on 2022 guitar shopping is perhaps the largest stretch of the imagination I have ever seen.

That statement devalues a mountain of hardship and of suffering that is real.
 
Middle class American here with zero student loan debt, tolerable healthcare costs, no issues with home ownership and little to no anxiety in my life barring emergencies. I must be doing it wrong or something.

You are lucky. Guidance counselors have been selling college to HS kids for decades like they get a cut of the grift. Not everyone is as lucky as that.

Back in the '70s and '80s it was a good investment. After that, you might as well go to the casino with your loan $$$$, the way entire industries get offshored so the stockholders can get richer.

I had to go back to college in the '90s to "go to school and get a real job", but was not aware the rules had changed WRT college being a sure fire path to good jobs and middle class prosperity. When I graduated with my nice new degree in computers, the jobs had all just up and went to India, and I was left holding the hot potato. Lots of people out there, and not with BS degrees like "Culture Studies" or "Advanced Aboriginal Basketweaving", but sensible degrees, got caught in that trap....
 
That statement devalues a mountain of hardship and of suffering that is real.
You are lucky. Guidance counselors have been selling college to HS kids for decades like they get a cut of the grift. Not everyone is as lucky as that.

Back in the '70s and '80s it was a good investment. After that, you might as well go to the casino with your loan $$$$, the way entire industries get offshored so the stockholders can get richer.

I had to go back to college in the '90s to "go to school and get a real job", but was not aware the rules had changed WRT college being a sure fire path to good jobs and middle class prosperity. When I graduated with my nice new degree in computers, the jobs had all just up and went to India, and I was left holding the hot potato. Lots of people out there, and not with BS degrees like "Culture Studies" or "Advanced Aboriginal Basketweaving", but sensible degrees, got caught in that trap....
Gentlemen I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. I have a degree in absolutely nothing. I’ve been willing to do jobs others aren’t at times they’re not willing to do it and I’ve always made plenty of money. Boom times, recessions or whatever. Did I survive 15 degree weather with winds cutting my skin and nothing but literal blood and feces the only hint of warmth? I’ve been there. That’s what I consider a “mountain of hardship”. It sucked but I went to work and paid my bills. These days I’m blessed to not work as hard but I paid my dues, dues many others aren’t willing to pay. So no, I really have no empathy in this regard. I was handed nothing and am a middle class slob with the rest of the middle class slobs and happy to be here.
 
Gentlemen I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. I have a degree in absolutely nothing. I’ve been willing to do jobs others aren’t at times they’re not willing to do it and I’ve always made plenty of money. Boom times, recessions or whatever. Did I survive 15 degree weather with winds cutting my skin and nothing but literal blood and feces the only hint of warmth? I’ve been there. That’s what I consider a “mountain of hardship”. It sucked but I went to work and paid my bills. These days I’m blessed to not work as hard but I paid my dues, dues many others aren’t willing to pay. So no, I really have no empathy in this regard. I was handed nothing and am a middle class slob with the rest of the middle class slobs and happy to be here.
Lucky you. Kids are getting sold down the river into a lifetime of unrepayable debt by people that they are supposed to be able to trust, but screw them, you got yours. Ok boomer.
 
Lucky you. Kids are getting sold down the river into a lifetime of unrepayable debt by people that they are suppose to be able to trust, but screw them, you got yours. Ok boomer.
I’m not saying screw anybody. I’ve been taken in a few 3 card Monte games in life, myself. I’m saying get out there and work hard. Bellyaching never paid a bill. I didn’t “get mine” that way and dont think many others will have much luck that way, either. I’m no genius, if I can do it anyone else can, too. “I cant” needs to be erased from the English language. No one HAS to go to college or any further in college than they themselves choose to. At 18 I was a complete moron but knew 200k in debt was probably a horrible idea.
 
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